This presentation by Dr. Solmaz Yadollahi was recorded as part of a presentation to Virginia Tech’s Community Change Collaborative on April 5th, 2024.
In urban heritage planning, often a discrepancy exists between formal policies and the actual unfolding of projects, shaped by the realpolitiks that rule planning environments. This manifests in a range of phenomena, spanning unofficial real estate market fluctuations, ideological clashes, episodic state strategies in community inclusion or exclusion, and favoritism or corruption in governmental, non-governmental, and private sectors. My project examines the informal aspects of heritage planning in Tehran and beyond through a diagnostic lens. I primarily target civil society, professionals and academics involved in heritage planning within the studied contexts. These actors face a dilemma in grappling with the realpolitik of urban heritage planning. While they lack the power to reshape the fundamental functions of the state, economy, and society, they recognize the importance of avoiding despair. The project’s modest contribution to their struggle is to underscore the crucial role of these actors as truth-tellers rather than enablers within dysfunctional planning systems and their associated rhetoric.
Dr. Solmaz Yadollahi, a conservation architect from Tehran, earned her doctorate in heritage studies. Her academic journey includes positions as a research fellow at the Chair of Urban Management and the German Research Foundation (DFG) Research Training Group 1913, both at BTU Cottbus in Germany. She recently published a book called Urban Heritage Planning in Tehran and Beyond: Sequences of Disrupted Spatial-Discursive Assemblages.
Made possible with the support of the Institute for Policy and Governance and the Community Change Collaborative.
[Music] hello everyone and thank you for joining us today for another Community change collaborative session um just a moment so it is with great pleasure that I introduce our distinguished guest speaker for today’s collaborative session Dr Solas yadah conservation architect from Iran with an extensive academic background and a profound commitment to Urban Heritage planning and Community change initiatives she holds her doctorate in Heritage studies from Brandenburg University of Technology in Germany armed with a wealth of experience and expertise she has held pivotal roles such as research fellow at the chair of urban management and an Affiliated post-doctoral fellow at the esteemed DFG research training group both at brandenberg University of Technology currently Dr yadah serves as a principal investigator for the DFG funded research project named assembling Iran’s Urban Heritage conservation policy and practice problematized in tan her groundbreaking work in urban Heritage conservation sheds light on the complex Dynamics between formal policies and the realities of project implementation in her profound research she highlights the challenges and nuances of Heritage Planning by examination of the intersections between real politic ideology and Community engagement while her project offers a diagnostic lens to understand and address the discrepancies that arise in Heritage conservation effort her advocacy for transparency in urban Heritage planning underscores her role as a beacon of change and integrity within the field as she continues to provoke critical discourse and Inspire action towards more inclusive and sustainable development practices I want to Express gratitude for her willingness to share her expertise and insights with the group and please join me in extending award warm welcome to Dr solma yahi as she shares her enlightening perspectives and experiences with us today thank you thank you thank you for the very kind introduction I just need to uh mention that the project has ended and um uh yeah um thank you for uh the opportunity uh uh for rep for presenting my work here uh I’m extremely grateful for this so um I what I’m going to present today is uh um as Aran also mentioned uh um is on a project that um I started in 2019 and and uh uh it was funded by the by the German Research Foundation and um the project really um uh gave me an extraordinary uh opportunity uh to reflect on myself as an academic and as a a professional and and a conservation architect who was trained in certain uh uh at certain universities and worked in certain organizations so it gave me a a really uh good chance to to look back uh to uh to those uh uh institutions that I um like grew up in uh as a as an academic and as a a professional and um so I’m going to talk about and in these uh more than three years I reflected every day on Urban Heritage planning in tan and Beyond and hoped uh to to to trigger a dialogue of Hope and responsibility um following thinkers like d and guari and Manuel delanda also I uh decided that uh in order to understand my own situation career situation or the the the the structures that I uh was working in or I came from in order to understand U my field uh maybe a good way uh to do this is to uh it’s the history of its Evolution and and see it as a spatial and discoursive assemblage of the Gathering of elements uh such as uh organizations laws individuals uh infrastructures funds um and and and um spaces Urban space es and and also Technologies and reflecting on how the Gathering of all these elements that built the field of conservation uh was shaped by a historical Turning Point from the beginning of its uh its institution uh when it was institutionalized in the early years of the 20th century after the Constitutional Revolution through uh different historical uh turning points uh such as the coup in 50 1955 such as the the revolution in 1979 uh and uh also the uprisings after uh 1979 and uh until uh the the the the severe uh political changes in 20 21 so I was really um the curious to understand what happened to the field or to this uh dis spatial discoursive assemblage uh um throughout uh uh these um these event and uh uh to be able to understand how we came here uh and um I came to understand Urban Heritage planning in tan as Beyond as sequence sequences of disrupted spatial discoursive assemblages so when mapping the historical trajectory of this uh field uh um I uh recognize that it is more like a body or like an assemblage that tends to knock down its own accumulated uh resources and this was although I didn’t have a theoretical uh pre-assumption at the beginning uh this turned out to be very much in line with homayun katan’s portrayal of Iran as a short-term society which is very famous and or as a peock society so it’s like a building that is meant to be uh knocked down destroyed and rebuilt again and again and again and residing within this Society the studied assemblage strives to deconstruct the prevailing structures and ushering a fresh one paradoxically perpetuating the very cycle it seeks to escape and uh with each Revolution with each um political change uh we experienced um purges in the institutions and in the universities and uh the change of uh the the the the the the policies or the the priorities uh in in dealing with uh uh Urban spaces and in dealing with Heritage and and um by focusing more on a particular projects uh uh so I had in the project uh in the in the research project I had this uh um the zooming out I mean the the larger uh Viewpoint and I had uh um several I had looked more closely into several um single projects and and I also uh cooperated or or discussed uh similar cases in other countries like turkey like Egypt uh during uh a discussion series uh that was um about uh policy practice differences in in uh doing conservation in cities and uh we agreed with the participants uh of those uh discussions and with the authors of the the edited volume that often a a discrepency exists between formal policies and the actual unfolding of the uh conservation projects uh uh that are shaped by the real politic uh that influences planning environments on the local basis so in each casee it can manifest itself in different there all politic of doing planning can manifest in itself in in formalities like unofficial real estate market fluctuations like uh clashes of ideologies and identities although uh those clashes are seemingly resolved in the Constitutions or in the legal systems and legally and officially you don’t see a problem but actually you see deep uh unresolved problems and episodic State strategies that tend to change uh pragmatically uh in in the administration period of one government or uh tend to change radically uh uh when a government uh when one Administration period terminates and another Administration termin uh uh period begins and and the usually the uh particularly in the cases that I studied in Iran the the the nature of participatory uh projects and the opportunities available to the Civil Society has been very episodic and um this also was an aspect of what I call the real politic because uh in the legal system there is no problem for participation I mean everything seems very finely described and planned uh but what happens in on the ground counts uh regarding uh to the outcomes that we have in these the studied projects and um also uh the real politic of doing uh conservation can show itself in favoritism corruption uh although um uh I mean I maybe I should uh um note here or uh mention here that it was mentioned in several interviews uh and most of the interviews were Anonymous of course and um it was also uh it is also seen for example in this studies of sociologists in the municipality of tan for example and uh there is published work about that uh issues uh that issue uh and in extreme situations um um such informalities uh May materialize through the actions of uh elite players who perceive themselves to be above the law and I have discussed cases uh from Iran um but uh today uh I would like to uh rather than uh reflecting on the conservation uh projects or uh the the the broader aspects of the field and how it is functioning in Iran I would like to reflect on um the topic uh or look at uh the topic of um I mean how the Civil Society and academic and professional communities that I had dealt with in tan um tend to respond or cope to the short-term Society uh that they are situated in uh so uh in order to uh uh to to um get access to the information about their everyday practice uh um in ton um so here’s a little bit methodology I uh uh through several uh uh periods of field work I attended their campaigns I went to their meetings um as an active or passive participant um I uh try to um hang out with them uh um and I mean I enjoyed hanging out with them in less formal settings and uh like interview them or just chat with them about their experiences and um I also uh focused on certain projects and uh try to um map and categorize uh the relationships and interplay of different actors through observing uh their engagement around that project uh on social media and uh there were very interesting and and contradictory there were deep contradictions uh in um in my observations and I tried to make sense of them uh um through uh categorizing uh my field notes I mean online field notes uh uh thematically and I mean these were like observations of how for example um Regular People as visitors or as owners of places or the the the professionals who were active in the tourism industry in tan or uh and also the I mean some of them who were for example tourism influencers on Instagram how they reacted how they reacted to the projects how they uh how they um um expressed their opinion about places about uh places that have been uh like re I mean uh restored or preserved and the artists how they ref um refer to Tan’s past uh and the past associated with those uh projects for example in Lazar and in tupon in different spaces that were um like hot topics on the public sphere and I also uh um in um specific cases try to map out uh the relationships of different elements that that create uh a uh a conservation project from the beginning uh for example this is a case uh in tan that I tried to map uh the different stages of sociospatial assemblages around House and Garden in Lisa this is the case of uh what is known as uh my uncle Napoleon’s houseon and I tried to show how the uh do you see my cursor yeah okay great I tried to show how the interactions started in the stage of remembering oh this is that house uh that house of the famous TV series uh I tried to show how spontaneous and and inclusive were the interactions of elements and individuals and the early phases of remembering and even listing the house and how it turned uh uh to a more you know the red shades represent the more exclusive and the more coordinated territorialized connections um uh how they turned out to be I mean the uh uh the the whole assemblage of memories the space as a real estate property the the the house and uh the media uh the publicity around it was captured by the municipality and uh territorial ized uh within its structures and uh how the uh the actors who were present in the early stages uh were excluded after the the they helped the municipality to uh to own the property and um something that was really interesting for me regarding this particular case was the climate of things uh just before before the the ownership happened just before the capture and there is a lot to learn from this that um just before the capture uh we uh we saw the the the the signs of the episodic and more pragmatic strategic opportunities raising hand from the from the side of the the the politicians I mean the the officials for participation like participation promises and um using terms like as authenticity higher Heritage values and correct approach to conservation and how uh focusing on factual aspects such as the real reuse concept A an imaginable reuse concept uh that is useful for the city or and uh it um and in relation to available square meter area that the project offered and uh the transparency regarding the utilization of public funds for the materials and services used by the projects became um obscure uh towards the end of the the process and um and how things were clear in the at the beginning and things became came very ambiguous uh starting from the um just the period U just the point of time before the municipality um owned or acquired uh the the the the space and uh this was an example uh of course to I mean for the purpose of our uh session here um um to understand how um Civil Society tend to respond to such uh environments um so I decided to just give you some examples of the tendencies that uh um so I observed as um repeated uh Solutions or repeated responses by different individuals from the Civil Society and from the academic and professional community in Terra um one response uh was migration it is interesting to know that uh out of my um uh 37 uh interview is uh 29 people were under 40 and out of these uh 29 people 18 people uh uh migrated already from Iran or were uh planning to migrate and this is only the interviews not the professional uh that I worked with uh in tan um another response tends to be um transitioning I mean those who say prefer to transition from governmental organizations um to pursuing careers in the private sectors I was um it was very interesting to see that my C my my former classmates uh how they have uh new businesses um like uh cafes um that have this Heritage Vibe and I mean um it was uh statistically it it was interesting to see that oh many my many of my bachelor for example classmates now own the Vintage cafes and restaurants in tan and our tour leaders because um interviewing them because uh they were not able to work for a long time in the Heritage uh I mean governmental organizations another um response uh was for those who chose to stay at um the municipality or Heritage organization institutions uh was uh um pursuing shortterm Endeavors which is very dangerous for urban planning or Urban Heritage planning projects because they are long-term projects but when I discussed with them why you prefer to invest in shorter term projects they um kind of uh me mentioned I mean several of them that um usually uh you don’t want your successor uh to get credit for your efforts for what you did and it is also true about um about higher officials uh some of them I mean not all of them but um usually because after a government change um a new faction who can’t be uh in opposition uh or not not in good terms with with the current Administration they come to power and they occupy the seats of the city council this the the the um not that often the universities the universities are more stable but governmental organizations are not that stable so uh individuals tend to uh prefer to think uh shortterm and that is a negative uh influence on Urban project and um and those who there were examples who thought in a long term U projects but the projects were cut uh the next Administration did not continue their projects and that was another problem another coping mechanism uh uh of being situated in a in the uh in this disruptive uh social spatial assemblage is uh pursuing that I often observed was pursuing uh technocratic solutions for those who uh were um who I mean the brilliant sociologist Muhammad F calls um uh uh bureaucrat academics so they are professors University professors who also can be a mayor who can be a minister or work as a deputy Minister uh and uh f u the sociologist he calls also himself a bureaucrat academic and it is very interesting um I mean his point of view and I borrowed his point of view to reflect on the on some of the bureaucrat academics that are in my field active and very influential and they use their academic possibilities for their bureaucratic uh purposes and vice versa U and um usually when you read their papers um you can see uh lots of lots of and and publication lots of textbooks technical textbooks translated to fary uh from English from a very Renown International authors uh Without Really addressing the the mountains of unresolved problems in the public uh space that is the topic of my work uh in Iran and uh for example um proposing solu ions like enhancing public uh awareness about Heritage is often seen in their Publications and um prioritizing uh technical approaches in general so I categorize this as a coping mechanism because you cannot address the Deep uh uh the Deep problems and uh be a minister or be a deputy Minister um this is not possible and it is often seen that uh bureaucrat academics attend to lose their uh uh bureaucrat seats uh positions when the uh when uh the government changes and they go back to the universities and pursue their project academically and uh with the next for example reformist government they come back to the ministry of urban planning and [Music] um and it it was only after 2021 that I observed something uh very unprecedent and what very interesting that uh there were some former bureaucrat academics that after that uh huge political change uh presented themselves as activists and uh where uh more publicly or they more present in the public sphere but I cannot uh reflect on the meaning of their action whether it is a very strategic and episodic decision that they made or is it does it mean that they uh feel or or they lost hope in the function of the bureaucracy I don’t know because it is very new and I I am waiting to see what happens and um a fifth way of coping with this environment was uh very sad for me that I saw in the Civil Society I mean not everyone but uh some groups uh reduced their civic demands uh to what uh for example the reform governments could offer and in those uh particular periods and um I don’t know I don’t have a solution for what how they could do their civic activities better but uh they were using their chances the chances that they were given but uh among the individuals and within the Civil Society I also encountered a few uh who dared to openly pose questions about objective facts such as real estate prices of the properties in question uh construction costs uh contractual relationships uh among the partners involved and reuse Concepts of publicly funded uh projects these individuals typically uh refrained from establishing firm affiliations with institutional structures instead uh they strongly uh tended to cultivate friendships and inal collaborations with diverse actors across the study the domains and uh the ability to navigate the informalities of Heritage planning enabled them to stay true to their observations their object what they could see and touch uh following their actions brings to mind uh Timon uh Timothy Snider’s assertion in his book on tyranny to abandon fact is to aband on freedom and maybe uh perhaps we need more people like these truth tellers in our environment um in this context it is also crucial uh to acknowledge that uh striving for truth can come with professional and personal cost therefore I prefer to view things uh on a spectrum not b uh and recognize the nuances and complexities involved uh professionals and academic um communities and the Civil Society uh face a dilemma in grappling with the real political Heritage planning although they lack power to reshape the fundamental functions of the state the economy and the society um they know that they cannot afford to lose hope so I hope learning from them and coming back to talk with them uh uh this they find this uh suggestion uh useful that individuals in any of the mentioned uh roles and environments uh can benefit from understanding the repeated historical Tendencies of the assemblage they are part of and they are Ed in and in their everyday practice uh this knowledge can help them to recognize for instance early signs of capture and take proactive steps of course tailored to their specific circumstances before a planning assemblage a project becomes irreversibly exclusive and I hope I can continue my discussion with them uh thank you thank you Dr thank you everyone I think some of our audience might have some questions for you so sure for you I can see AIS has yeah thank you for the presentation uh it was great uh I have a uh a comments and question together um I think Iran is potentially one of the societies with the with the richest uh cultural heritage in the world the academy uh will play a major role uh in turning this potential into reality uh by the way I am aiz I am a PhD student in philosophy and I am researching the L and focus thoughts on institutions uh and integrating the L concept of body without organs into cultural heritage studies is a brilliant idea but I believe this concept has u a psychoanalytical meaning Beyond this context uh worthy of discussion H uh in the individual’s subconscious uh it defin uh a pro prolent protest against the fundamental attitudes attitudes towards societal political religious Etc laws and Powers which bent bent things gildos argues that creation passes through resistance yeah uh and Michelle Fuko suggests uh that this Century will become known as delion uh J regarded this suggest suggestion as a joke uh he responded to this suggestion mean to make people who like us love love and make everyone else angry uh what you think of this H S Suggest Michelle PCOS he said uh yeah this uh Cent will be become known as theion and uh can you explain more the concept of body without organs because I think it’s uh worthy of discussion sure sure thank you so yeah thank you Asis um thanks for the uh very uh deep question philosophical question yeah um I mean uh body without organs was a concept that I used uh uh to explain uh the situations U uh when uh an an a structure is not yet formed and it has several of opportunities to shape in countless ways of uh or take count countless forms it’s like an egg uh uh body without organ is like that is not yet uh a cre a creature like a uh an animal but it has uh the potentials to become become several different uh um I mean individual uh creatures according to the circumstances to The Climate to the to the I mean the light the I mean to uh the worms uh reacting to those circumstances an egg can become um many different things and uh I tried to incorporate this uh into the the field of conservation as a social spatial assemblage as a discoursive spatial and discoursive assemblage uh that for example in the uh case of the re ution when everything is paused and uh uh suspended and uh the the formation of the future um field uh depends on how the actors interact in that particular political climate it is again in the when you zoom in on one project uh again you know before uh the capture happens if maybe if the financial u i mean status of one of the owners was different the all the trajectories all the process could unfold in a completely different way and so that particular uh period that I um that I highlighted for example in the project I call that a body without organ when things are suspended and you have still you have the chance uh to create new structures um yeah you have the freedom to do that and and um you have to study the background of the the the assemblage to be able to identify that oh I’m in a body I’m in a state of body without organs so this is the time to act and yeah I’m sorry I’m so excit excited uh I have a short question more uh uh and there there is a uh More Concept of the the concept of uh lines of Escape maybe you know uh this do you lines of flight yeah the Zoro Zoroastrianism my it is pronounce Zoro aism is uh think this uh thought as lines of Escape in Iran I don’t think I haven’t looked at it that way um because again it is going exactly back to the former structures you know maybe if you have one of your feet on the on U like former Traditions it can be Zoroastrianism yes and uh and align with uh with actors that you or actants that you usually don’t um meet and and try to find new connections for uh more creative processes to to Stepping the your other foot in future to create uh something new this can be the beginning of a line of light but I I didn’t see it like this uh maybe in in my one of my papers I had uh a similar suggestion but I left it very open I see that um yeah thank you so much you’re welcome thank you thank you for the question and until we have new questions uh regarding uh the laws and uh the Civil Society I was very touched with his Concepts on desire and um I I used it uh in my work or I tried to use it uh to because um if you you don’t know your own desire what you are aiming for what moves you someone else will decide for you what your desire is and uh you will find yourself uh being um territorialized in in in the in the establishments and um so so uh it is easier to capture um you and your potentials um if you have not worked on understanding what is it that you want and and I tried to uh use this uh for the Civil Society uh to understand um um how they can cope with the system and how they are coping with the system some of them that I talked about in the later in the final slide and there is a question on the chat on the chat hi how can Urban her planning initiatives be integrated with urban planning uh solutions to mitigate the Heritage challenges in challenges ton has n oh hi n um oh yeah n Nea was a professional that I were uh like interacted with can I cannot say I worked with uh but uh we engaged in a very interesting discussions in tan and um you know um in my work I tried to um highlight the deeper um problems regarding public space public sphere public funds in Teran and I think um in the current situations I mean in the conclusion of the first book I have also mentioned that uh things are not going uh towards a very pleasant Direction uh as long as those uh unresolved conflicts EX exist and no one can have the answer to your question I don’t think the minister of urban planning or the the minister of Heritage can answer this question or academics like me who have studied the these institutions um I think in ton one of the thank you Nemo one of the uh aspects that I found was that for example the neighborhood development offices I found uh that you were also involved in I found uh uh those uh as very good smart Solutions of the municipality to because they were uh offices managed by the private sector and it was very interesting they provided an informal not that rigid uh uh governmental environment for the residents of each neighborhood to discuss their problems and um I have tried to analyze that the these uh governmental these um uh these these neighborhood officers as links uh that could have connected uh successfully and for a period they did a good job connecting the uh the residents who didn’t trust the municipality with the municipality uh but after the political changes uh they were um terminated I mean uh none of these in young committed really really U devoted professionals who worked in these uh neighborhood offices could continue their contracts so uh no one has the uh solution for such problems and I I think that I mean such even even when I’m talking about the the disruptive uh uh system that tends to get rid of or dump its own uh resources I’m talking about examples like this uh that uh even if uh they know the new Administration knows that uh these neighborhood development offices were a very smart pragmatic solution to uh to solving the trust issues of the municipality with the local residents they didn’t continue it uh I mean it was very smart if if they could just uh uh like keep the surface at least uh but they didn’t do it uh so I don’t know what the solution could be I mean those neighborhood development officers were Brilliant Solutions for a system that uh was uh structured to to continue not being disrupted Nemo uh Nema Ro oh he Nemo says fantastic yes I mainly wanted to know your idea regarding Mutual models techniques or Innovative Innovations these two disciplines could potentially have to help solve basic Heritage issues in Teran your answer is sufficient for my question thanks thanks thank you n thanks I mean in long-term structures sorry uh Jose just a closing comment in long-term structures in structures that are built for longer uh functions uh individuals for example we had I I observed Architects historians and um filmmakers making Cooperative uh initiatives during those episodic chances that they got but those friendships maybe the friendships last lasted I don’t know but they didn’t get to get those opportunities after things changed and maybe if they have the chance to freely find each other find uh how to uh cooperate with each other if you give them a chance um maybe uh you can they can find solutions for the Heritage and the urban planning uh to be able to work together but um the system doesn’t allow that prolonged um interaction sorry Hussein okay uh first of all I would like to thank you for your amazing uh presentation I think after three years we meet each other again online uh and uh I have just one question that you mention regarding some bureaucratic former academic I think that just just they uh come to some for example some politic position and then they back to the academic U member uh I would like to ask that how was they already contribution the contribution in the academic was already better or when they were in a uh political position I mean from the point of the urban planning uh what do you mean by better it means that the if for example in the uh academic atmosphere they have some theor some knowledge and then they back to the political uh for example uh authorities how was the contribution um I mean I don’t want to sound very judgmental but no no I mean from the point of your study I mean yeah you know uh for for instance I really focused on the literature produced by um bureaucrat academics regarding values-based conservation and I really traced uh and also in terms of urban planning uh the communicative approach uh towards uh these Concepts like uh the right to the city was used by the minister in his academic literature yes so I uh leave it to you yes to judge how uh how functional these Concepts have been in the domain of Heritage projects or in urban planning projects managed by this academic uh bureaucrat academics um it happened uh for example the mayor of tan had extensive uh literature uh uh on he has um uh translated several books yes he has um he has um uh worked on values and he has translated the the book by Brandy uh and uh more on values and values based approach to conservation but if the system uh values based conservation is a communicative approach to conservation which means that you need in a in an equal Society you need to be able to communicate and I have uh in the upcoming paper it is I have reflected on how values based conservation that was an area of Interest of the bureaucrat uh academics in Iran has worked it has not had uh the function that is supposed to have um okay thank you very much I hope I have answered yeah yeah great I’m sorry just to remind us that we have three minutes left but before that has raised a hand and has a question sure um hi everyone Hi Dr yadah it’s so great to see you here and everyone every friend here I’m so happy to see all uh I have a very small question so um I agree with you that Iran is a short-term society as for example Dr kusan refers to he also I agree with him that he also mentions that we have problem in our civil society uh regarding negotiations and compromising as a nation um for 2500 years we had this problem of short-term Society going to demonstrations going to Revolutions new king come and then the repeated structur on and on so my question is do you see any sort of changes for example after Massa demonstrations last year or um recent Civil Society active um movements uh that our civil society is gaining some sort of um um learned experience or something in showing how their public space is their wealth is a place of power and they should grab it for example in gatar park um example do you see any of that or you are hopeless of any changes in near future thank you um thank you as I said we cannot afford to be hopeless um I I can start from myself because uh um after uh the the the woman life Freedom Uprising I didn’t go to Iran I didn’t do any fi work but when I I was writing the result of my research and I recognized in my someday because I I have been I have struggled with my editor with lauro um about wanting to say something quite but not saying it straightforward and um after those events I think I could send my inner sensor home for some time and I lost some of the fear to say things that I observed to use the material that I have collected and I know that uh this has happened inside many Iranians um thank you so beautiful to hear that thank you so if there is not any other question I think we should wrap up this session as we it’s already 12 o’ yeah so I’m waiting to see if there is any other question seems there is not okay thank you very much thank you so much thank you very much nice to have you thank you for the great opportunity to talk with you guys it was great thank you very much [Music]