Okay everybody good good evening and welcome to the Council of the city and C swans meeting the first item is apologies for absence thank you presiding member I have apologies from councilors Matthew Bailey Alison Anthony Mandy Evans David Hopkins Elliot King Richard Lewis Paul Lloyd and Nicola m
Uh chair I’ve also got uh sorry also got apologies from Erica cner and Victoria Holland get bad oh and Hanna Lawson please she’s not very okay the next item is disclosures of personal and prejudicial interest if I can add you over to Deb please thank you thank you presided member um sent an
Email out to councilors this afternoon to highlight some potential interests in the agenda tonight um in particular agenda item number 10 adoption of the council tax reduction scheme and I’ve set out uh there that if you if you were a person who with whom you live or a close personal associate of yours
Benefit from the discretionary elements of the scheme and that’s the discretionary elements only and you can find those in section three of the report and paragraph 3.5 if you benefit from those discretionary elements you like it to have a personal and prejudicial interest and you’ll need to
Leave the meeting uh agenda item 12 the housing revenue account rent setting 2425 again if you or a person with whom you live or a close person associate as a tenancy with the council then you’ll have a personal interest only thank you um I don’t know if there’s any other uh
Interests to be declared ccor H again yeah um item 11 P uh housing Revenue C page 111 I’m a council tenant so I’m declaring the personal interest thank you Baker uh I’m a council ten and as well I declare a personal interest thank you yeah I missed a bit about um I’ve
Got a relative who get the reduction scheme and uh I put Personnel but you did mention prejudicial I already got that it’s only a prejudicial personal prejudicial if you benefit from the discretionary elements of the sche the main scheme itself but if you see paragraph 3.5 of the report there are
Some discretionary elements that the council has um a discretion to implement or not and it’s those bits that you would be making a decision on and if those discretionary elements of the scheme affect you or a someone you live with or or a relative then that’s what
Triggers the interest all right so it’s prejudicial as well okay C Anderson yeah thank you chair um I have two relatives living in a council house does that apply to me personal interest only okay thank you coun for couldn’t see you were I have a family member who I think
Potentially could start to claim under a discretionary so I’ll declare it in case uh post un prejudicial coming in can I remind you all to fill in the uh forms my oh white yeah my my sister lives in in in in Council property personal address okay just remind you all to fill
In the Declaration forms okay thank you the next item is the minutes and that’s on pages one through to S I’ll take them one page at a time for accuracy so page one oh sorry I couldn’t see them sorry need to go online for declarations
I can’t see the uh Mr if you can point me please is there anybody online wishing to declare an interest nobody okay sorry there’s nobody apologies okay okay thank you have gone up now sorry was it adoun Davis uh apologies my mother-in-law is a council tenant i’ not entirely sure what
Uh Council uh council tax reduction she might be entitled to so I’ll have to double check but I’ll declare a personal interest on that one just in case okay thank you councilor Davis Council Nicola furong oh Nicola F Council furong sorry council furong do you wish to declare no
No okay you can’t see anybody oh she’s come back on uh councelor furong do you wish to declare I think she’s having problem with the signal or something here C Fong you’re on mute yes I declare a personal interest thank you councelor f sorry in which a sorry councelor
Fong I’ve got a relative and a council property item 10 then yeah yes you see me councelor Penny Matthews as well I understand okay coun Matthews you might be on mute councelor Matthews sorry sorry apologies um member of the family gets council tax reduction because they currently not working on claimed
Benefit so it would be item 10 I believe is there anybody else Mr I think that’s everybody thank you okay councelor Jenkins uh sorry chair uh yeah my if it’s a reduction in uh the TA Council taxit my mom gets at a single person so that would be um item 10
Section three paragraphs 3 and five he it it’s actually only if the if it’s the discretionary elements of this scheme that that that uh you or a family member benefit from so I think if it’s just a single person’s reduction that won’t trigger um an interest it’s the discretionary elements that’s being
Decided upon in this report so but if you’re unsure you may feel it easier to to declare one okay is that everybody yep okay we move on to the minutes then and that’s to approve and sign the minutes of the previous meetings as a correct record again I’ll
Go through in for accuracy that’s page one two 3 4 5 6 and seven okay move thank you Ro the next item is the written responses to questions asked of the last ordinary Council and those are on pages eight and nine okay then we have the announcements of the presiding
Member uh the first announcement I’ve got unfortunately is one of condolences and that’s the former councelor nordri Perot it’s with sadness that I refer to the recent death of former councelor nage Perot norid represented the Upland Ward on Swansea City Council from 1994 to 1996 and the City and County of Swansea from
1995 to 1999 so can I ask you to stand for a minute silence please okay thank you the next announcement is that the Britain’s best large Indo Market has been won for 2024 has been won by Swansea Market it’s the National Association of British Market Authority Rob am I right yeah it
We previously won in 2015 and 2020 and David Hopkins has been up in I’m not sure what is but he’s picking up the award today of Birmingham okay I can’t even understand my own writing Rob sorry okay the next item is the New Year’s honors and it’s the citizens of
Swansea who received Awards in the new honors list in New Year’s honors it’s the member of the order of the British Empire the MBE it’s for Robert Terrence gray lately boxing gym owner and trainer of gwent amateur boxing club for services to amateur boxing in Swansea okay the next is Alfred I’m
Going to noce Al oh my gosh o o director black Asian minority ethnic mental health support for services to minority ethnic communities in Wales and my apologies if I pronounce his name wrong the next is the British Empire medal the bem and that’s for Leslie John want for services
To the community in Sketti and Swansea the next it’s Santa’s joing when day today it’s the 25th of the 1st 2024 the Welsh and the Celtic patron saint of friendship and love the popularity and celebration of Stan’s day has increased considerably in recent years and please remember to tell your partner that you
Love them just just remember okay no fighting tonight the next is the amendment the next is the amendments to the corrections of the council summons and it’s an urgent item I got a notice of motion for tar to Steel it’s speu to paragraph 100b bracket 4 bracket B of the Local Government Act
1972 I consider that the notice of motion TARTA seal should be considered at the meeting as a matter of urgency and the the reason is given that tart steel recently announced their intention to cut thousands of jobs this year which will have a huge local and Regional
Impacts this is the only opportunity for this Council to consider and debate this motion and put pressure and T to steel and the government that’s the end of my announcements thank you then on to announcements of the leader councelor Stewart yeah thank you uh presiding member um only one announcement and it
Relates to the the motion um obviously everybody would have been um really shocked by the announcement made by Tata steel and the UK government uh last week uh just to update that since then um I’ve taken action with the wlga um all of the group leaders within the wlj and
All 22 leaders have signed a letter which has gone to the UK government asking them to reconsider uh the outlined uh approach to the steel uh issue in TX um and we’ve also written to the Welsh government also uh in a similar manner um again I I won’t say too much because
I’m sure we’ll have a a long debate on it but just to say um in terms of the impact if the uh proposal were to go ahead we think that you’re looking at uh around 150 million pound worth of direct loss of uh economic uh input um direct
Just from salaries within tataa it’s s every year and probably three times that from the broader economy uh when you include the supply chain and the and the other issues so you know you compare that uh to the input for instance from UK government via the city deal that is
120 odd million over 10 years so they would be taking out nearly four times the value of the city deal every single year so uh again it is something I think we must all work to try and change but I’m sure we’ll have a really good debate
On that when we come to the motion chair but just to reassure uh we have mobilized as a local government and we’ll be lobbying uh the UK government and Tas very hard thank you leader the next item is public questions have we got any Mr erans no no there’s no public questions
Okay thank you we then move on to item eight which is the corporate parenting pledges and I’d like to call on Council GI BD please thank you thank you presiding member um it gives me great pleasure to bring this report to council which is the culmination of a number of years
Work now by the corporate parenting board um it might not look like much as one page to say it’s been a number of years work but these seven pledges represent arguably our most important function as a council that of being a good corporate parent which helps the
Children and young people in our care to live their best lives to thrive now and in the future importantly we didn’t just pull these things out of thin air or through closed discussion as councilors and officers but we were LED throughout by our care experienc young people who
Gave up their time to work with us to share their experiences and I’m really happy to say they’re given up more of their time to be with us today we’ve got Rose and Aaron here who are going to speak in in just a second and some more
Of them up in the public Gallery there so I hope we can all give them a very warm welcome when they speak in a second I want to say huge thank you to the members of the corporate parenting board to Josh price our participation officer and most importantly to the young people
Um it’s imperative that we listen but also that we Act and the onus is on all of us to take actions to live up to these pledges like safeguarding corporate parenting is everybody’s business and it needs a holistic cross counil approach from Social Services of course but also culture education
Housing and other partners across the city uh so without further Ado I’d like to hand over to Rose and to Josh to Aaron sorry to explain a bit more uh good evening and thank you all for inviting us here this evening um we’re pleased to attend tonight and provide
Present the corporate parenting board seven pledgers um there have been a number of young people involved over the duration of this work who couldn’t attend tonight that have worked with the corporate parenting board to relate these seven pledge areas to our children’s rights with the support of the corporate
Parenting board the pledges will ensure that every young person in care has the opportunity to live their best life make use of all the experiences that are on offer to us and that all care experienced young people are fit and healthy both mentally and physically these fundamental pledges can have a
Major impact on not just our lives but so many other children and young people who have had similar experiences to ourselves and we are very proud to have the opportunity to be involved in their creation thank you give wish to respond yeah I just wanted to formally remove
The report and again thank everybody for what they’ve done and uh in terms of giving up the time sharing their lived experience it’s so important and in in in the spirit of the next um item on the agenda it’s really about having children’s rights throughout Rob did you
Want yeah presid member yeah I’m happy to very very happy uh and proud to Second the report and I just want to thank all of our uh uh carers sorry care levers here today uh for their efforts we did as you know chair just before the
Session we had a little bit of a try of the chamber they’ve taken the the opportunity to uh sit in the leader of the opposition seat the leader seat member of the cabinet and the chair themselves uh and they uh certainly slipped into the roles and I know um
They’ve also uh pitched for Dave House’s role one one of our hair levers is Keen to get uh to become the next director of uh Social Services for us so well done everybody I think it’s a fantastic piece of work and look forward to implementing it and improving the services for carers
Who come after you apologies for I just wanted to mention as well that they’ve been working on a fantastic series of podcasts as well which we hope to make available on the council website or in some some form that so we can share with
You all as well and those of us in the corporate parenting board got to hear some clips of that and there had a launch last week and that’s they’re they’re really outstanding so again thank you for the work on those okay before I move to the vote can
I come back can I pass on my congratulations it’s intimidating to have to speak in front of everybody so I know what it feels like so well done everybody so I’m going to go to the vote and the recommendation is on page 10 and it’s that it’s it’s the report is
Attached pledges are forwarded to full Council for approval which it does can of oh sorry councelor Lyndon Jones oh uh thank you presiding member I was only going to say that I totally support the and and the group totally support the pledges and you know P you really no barriers to opportunity
Because they really deserve those opportunities and and good education and a good job and uh I know that the scrutiny panel on education which I chare uh we we look at this on a regular basis to make absolutely sure uh that there are those opportunities in education throughout Swansea and I know
When I speak to the director of dation and the cabinet member we are speaking to an Open Door on these issues thank you Council Jones council fitgerald did you wish to speak apologies chair I put my vote up for the for the um motion too too speedily Mr Evans is there anybody else
With their hands up because we can’t see them very clearly pxton Hood Williams councelor Paxton thank you madam forting member yes uh we had this report presented this to us this week in the T of family scrutiny performance panel uh the uh Cabinet member was there she know it was
Very well received and we’re really uh pleased and with the the progress has being made there and the work has being going in not just by the department but obviously by the people the children who’ve been young people who’ve been involved in preparing these as well thank
You thank you councelor okay we now move to the vote then so all in favor of the report any against any extensions that’s unanimous thank you very much and thank you all for your attendance tonight okay you’re welcome to say but you’re also welcome to go if
You don’t want to sit through it all okay thank you okay the next item on the agenda is uh item nine which is the progress report on swansea’s council’s children and young people’s right scheme for 2123 and can I call on councelor Haley Gillam please thank you presiding member um we
Have a duty to bring this report here and as you will see from the report details um the progress of the whole Council approach taken to children and young people’s rights scheme the council originally adopted did this in 2014 to ensure that we were compliant with our
Duty um to have due regard to the United Nations conventions of the rights of the child this is the fifth report um and focuses on the five right way PR RightWay principles and a huge amount of um work has been undertaken since 2014 to embed the rights across all Council
Services um and the progress report evidences this quite clearly alongside the report and contained in the appendices uh the plan on a page which is co-produced with children and young people who identified priorities and this piece of work has been recognized as best practice by the children’s commissioner for Wales who suggested
That it’s used as a national model um the plan on a plag page identifies key priorities there are a wealth of examples which I can touch upon um throughout the report um the enormous Parks Redevelopment and upgrades across the city thanks to the enormous investment which has taken in place um
Thanks to colleagues and the erf fund which which have also been complemented by communication boards um both pictorial um and with English and and Welsh language but even further expanded to include BSL um which enable children and young people to communicate um a great example of inclusive practice
Providing voice choice and control for our our young people um Universal children’s rights day um and the play day which um saw exceptional attendance figures providing information and play opportunities and at the last um events ony Council went even further by providing food support to um all attendees feedback from children and
Young young people along with families was exceptionally positive and despite all for weather conditions families braved the rain and headed to the event and were able to to have an indoor picnic um we we as a local Authority also provide course grant funding which has supported lots of children to
Participate in activities across the city but also ensured that CH those children and young people with protected characteristics were afforded and broke down down barriers to provide them with opportunities that may have been um beyond their reach which include surfing cookery growing lgbtq specific sessions
And I think that we can all um see that the impact of of these is enormous and it’s reflected within in the report um the SE at youth panel and and obviously the the young people at work um on the corporate paren in pledges um so it it’s been really impactful and really
Important work um across the city and the right to way approach is very much framed around the human rights principles which sits nicely with us being the human rights City and I ask that the recommendations outlined on page one of the report with a revised reporting cycle be accepted and formally
Um move the report thank you yeah thank you I fully support what council William said and uh formerly second councelor Mary Jones thank you I did tell the leader I had 50 questions but it’s not really uh thank you for the report I have to say it’s a very in-depth report
And there’s so much information it did take quite a bit of reading but I did try and go through it the first one is a a commentary uh it’s page 24 and I’m glad to see that you’ve said an easy read version of the report will be
Available judging by what I just said it was a lot to read but then again the information in it is extremely informative and obviously um you a lot of work has been put into it by both by officers and yourselves um the second one I might need a written answer I do
Accept that uh it’s page 43 and it’s about the children’s rights and the participation sessions we’ve already heard about the ones for the corporate perington but it says about schools and I just wondered which schools had been involved and if the ward member or governors of that school uh were
Involved as well or did they know about it it’s not a criticism I just want information I’m not uh because I think you do you know it’s done a fantastic job and then when you go on to page um 77 I think it is but it’s all those
Pages like that this to Learners I think it was brilliant I like the way it’s all set out that is an easy read I must admit uh it’s a Pity we have to have the dry bits as well but uh congratulations but I would like to know about the schools thank you Mr
Gam yeah thank you presiding member and thank you um councelor Mary Jones um yeah all schools are reached out to to participate um all all schools have student councils and that’s worked with with the um children’s rights um officers and and our engagement and participation officers um W members are
Invited if if schools ask which is in this instance is that they asked to come to um the council chamber um and participate so Ward members are always notified of of that and given the opportunity to attend um I don’t think there was anything else was there two question no okay thank
You councelor Mike day thank you presiding member and first of all like to thank councilor gam for the report but also for all the hard work that she does and um don’t think there’s anybody here today who would want to say anything different about um of the work
That is going on with um the children and young people and I think it’s to be congratulated I’m sure we’d want to pass on our thanks and congratulations to the officers as well for all the work that they’re doing um it just of um something
Which um is just at the back of my mind really and um it may require a a meeting in itself but um uh K William referred to you know the impact that is having upon uh children and young people but I wondered if um you know there’s any
Research that we’re aware of that is actually able to measure that sort of impact what sort of difference is it making to Children young people’s lives there’s there’s a lot of activity going on and I’m sure that is having an impact but but I wondered if there was any kind
Of research that we’d be aware of which um would enable us to think ways in which we could we could kind of measure that um I suppose one of the ways in which it could be measured and I’m not suggesting this for any stretch of the imagination would be to you know
Withdraw some of these activities and see what the difference was but you know I’d like to see it in a positive sense as saying that um you know as a result of the work that’s being done um you know there are more opportunities for children young people as far as um
Employment and um so on uh as well as thinking in terms of um actually improving their quality of life um so as I said it might be that there would be a need for us to look at that possibly in one of the scrutiny performance panels
But um I think it’s something which um you know I might be interested in looking at further yeah I think that is something that we should um sorry that went off then um yeah I think it is something that we should revisit outside of um Council but yeah I’d be very interested as
Well you Council Keaton I think it’s very hard to prove a negative and when we do I by patting us on the back here do so much positive work within the community you can’t really tell how bad it would be if we didn’t I just wanted to make that comment
Thanks okay there any more speakers no okay the the report has been uh passed on seconded so I’m there’s three recommendation so I’m going to take the three all at once so all in favor of the report anybody against any extensions councelor Phillips okay thank
You okay okay thank you the next item is item 10 and that’s the adoption of the council tax reduction scheme and I’d like to call it Mr Ben Smith please thank you presiding member this is a an annual event where there is requirement for you to consider as Council adopting the uh authorities
Council tax reduction scheme there are five recommendations before you recommendation one and two was noting the Amendments and adjustments going through the senv um they are also reviewed annually and the linked recommendation five which gives me wiggle room to advise you if any changes were made in the sen on the 16th of
January there were no such changes so that deals with recommendations one two and five in terms of my advice by way of reminder the bulk of the council tax reduction scheme prescribes statutory minimum standards so that all 22 authorities offer the same um reductions but it does also provide a limited
Amount of opportunity for discretionary elements so the discretionary ele ments we consulted on it’s a small consultation exercise and those are set out in section three and also in the appendix the uh results of the consultation indicated uh a narrow majority in each case for two of them
And a bigger majority for retention of our current policy in all three discretionary areas uh given the advice set out in the report which is our funding is fixed and the amount that falls to council to to to fund if we are to be more generous in discretion is
Because becoming more burdensome my officer advice is that it is correct to uh consider retaining the existing discretionary scheme as unamended but it still requires you to formally so adopt it and those Discretions are set out in the report in terms of the normal Arrangements around income disregards
And War pension disregards and such like so my advice to you as the officer is to adopt the report as as set out with the rationale for why we provide those three discretionary elements on top of the statutory scheme noting the amount that falls to General taxpayers to meet the
Um the the the E the cost which exceeds the amount that we are funded by um noting also the uh majority or be in two cases a slim majority for continuing with the existing scheme so that would be my advice to you um uh presiding member thank you I would look to members
Probably to the leader first in terms of looking to move under a seconder for the report but I’m happy to ask questions if there are any thank you leader yeah thank you uh presiding member um and to thank Mr Smith and his team for the work they’ve done um again
As Mr Smith said this is a report we take every year there aren’t any changes compared to what we’ve done in previous years I think the scheme has worked well uh but Mr as Mr Smith has said um it is one where we’re not funded for the whole
Costs of the scheme but it is absolutely the right thing to do uh to provide these uh specific reductions to help certain groups of taxpayers within Swansea this happy to Second you moved it R yeah okay anybody online no okay the report the recommendations are on page 96 that
Are five which we’re going to take all together so I can have show hands for the report in off favor anybody against any extensions okay that’s carried thank you very much okay we now move on to the housing revenue account which is the HRA rent set in for
2425 and can I call on councelor Lewis please thank you presiding member um just to run through a few things in the report um so members will see in 1.1 this report seeks approval to make the changes from the 1 of April this year uh and obviously the implementation of the
Rent in home act has meant that we bring this two months earlier than we normally would uh in accordance with the ACT uh a little bit of background at 2.1 that Welsh government Set uh a limit in terms of what we can increase our rents by and the minister set the limit at
6.7% this year uh the proposal in this report is to go to 6% uh and I am a mindful as I’m sure members are that inflation did drop towards the end of last year and in December it was 4.2% but I’m sure members will be mindful that just because inflation has
Fallen slightly that doesn’t mean that costs have fallen so drawing M’s attention to the table at 2.3 which shows the housing management and the revenue repairs since 2122 to the current date have increased at around 30% but in 2.4 they will see that our Revenue income from rents has only
Increased in the same period of time by 10% so it’s still a cut to our rental budget um and just to remind members that the rental budget covers ongoing maintenance and repairs uh just recently in cabinet we approved The Damp mold and mildew policy um and you know in terms
Of responding quickly to when people have concerns given the recent tragedy and in uh which was noted by courts in 2022 uh and I’m pleased to say this Council responded quickly to that and also in terms of the ongoing uh Welsh housing quality standards so to date I’m
Pleased to say this Administration have uh invested around half a billion pounds and what this will do in terms of the rental income and it’s important for the public to understand that the council rents income coming into the h is only that by ring fence reinvested into our
Council stock and also into any new homes that we build by the very uh nature of the Ring fencing and there are schemes coming forward which are major schemes such as the refurbishment of Croft High Street uh high-rise um and then also Griffith John Street and schemes like tno and emis uh
And so on and so forth so we continue to improve our stock whilst we also are mindful that we’ve got huge numbers in homeless accommodation at the moment temporary an emergency and so we therefore need to rebuild uh um new homes and also we’re using Acquisitions to buy back all the
Properties that we lost during the council right to buy scheme where we lost around 4,000 homes so we use in the rental income to bring that in to purchase properties and buy them back into our stock to to try and address homelessness because simply the the demand is completely outstripping the
Supply at the moment and we are really struggling so we’ve decided as an Administration not to go to the maximum of 6.7% but we will support 6% rental increase and also just to point out that doesn’t impact on all our Council tenants around 70% of our tenants receive full housing benefit so that
Money comes directly from UK government and then around 30% either pay some of their rent or all of their rent so it impacts a very small amount of our tenants and it will be recycled into making sure that we’ve got good quality homes for the benefit of our tenants um
So I I moved the report um and I’m happy to support the proposed rental increase uh happy to take any questions presiding member yeah thank you chair very happy to Second this one and just to add to what council Lewis said I think it is
Keeping in mind that the H is a is a ring fenced fund it is self-funding and if we do not raise uh sufficient revenues from rents then we will not be able to repair our properties and we will not be able to add to our stock and
And as we’ve said in previous debates we have around 8,000 people waiting for a home in swansey at the moment we need to do all we can to increase that stock so that we can get people into homes so it is a finally balanced um decision but as Council Lewis said
Not going to the max um making sure that we set a level which is 70% covered by UK government in terms of of the costs so again very supportive of the uh final conclusion on that one thank you H thank you pres member I think the
Policy is the right one and I think it’s all right and proper that we do start building Council houses I only wish it would it had never stopped if I’m perfectly honest to you because that it it’s the benefit really outweighs any any any other sort of benefit that it
Applies to any other organization the one thing I I am concerned and I would like to ask the cabinet member may not be able to give an answer today but it is about um when we see these difference in the rents and what have you uh obviously we don’t charge a service
Charge within our Council properties but others do and I think one of the things that we are very mindful of and I think we should be be showing it on these if there is on top of those rent equivalent a service charge because I think one of the things that is leveled against
Authorities is that oh you rents are quite High what are you look at so on so so on but see people seem to forget that in many of these other organizations there’s a service charge to look after the various grounds around them or whatever um the policies right one it
Should be fully supported but I think that sort of clarification should be put in the report thank you yesand yeah thank you presiding member um and I I think the the charts speak for themselves in terms of affordability so we still remain the cheapest landlord even compared to housing associations on
Our doorstep those housing associations are going for 6.7% just as a matter of Interest we we’ve deliberately chosen not to charge service charges we pride ourselves on the fact that we’re an affordable landlord we are the safety net for our tenants in Swansea we are the cheapest and the most affordable but
We also don’t ask for a month’s rent in advance or for bonds for deliberate reasons because we don’t want to place Financial barriers for tenants coming onto our books uh as a you know as a social landlord we have a social conscience but in terms of the the
Maintenance the service charges I will speak to officers regarding it but my understanding is that it’s a deliberate decision that we have made not to add an additional financial burden onto residents I clarify this and I think we are right they not doing it but what I
Would like to know is what the other uh rsls are doing because I think that we should be showing the public the difference between what we do and what other RS do thank you Mr Lewis I’ll take that forward to the officers uh thank you to council Harley counc
Jardine you’re on mute councelor Jardine sorry I’ve been trying to get that down I wouldn’t come get sorry I don’t have a question I couldn’t get my hand down councilor rice thank you chair just to pick up a quick question um on page 117 we look at the variation between councils and how
Much they charge for certain properties um I know obviously there’s differences where we’re up and down on other areas it seems that we’re above the average uh by about 5 or 6% in some cases for smaller properties compared to the Welsh average is there a particular a reason for
That it is an average um but I my understanding is in the league table compared to other social landlords including other councils we’re around the center of That League table counc black thank you chair just two quotes I’m just to clarify um where you have a Warden Service I thought there was a
Service charge involved in that to pay for the warden service maybe you could confirm that that’s case or not um that’s the first point um the second point is um do the worsh government still provide a grant to the housing revenue account and is that tied to the
Level of rent which we charge um because I understood this they they assumed that you charge 6.7% and then the grant is set accordingly and if you charge Less in that you lose out you you lose out and I’m I’m I’m very much in favor of this
Of the policy in front I’m just trying to clarify because you haven’t actually got the housing revenue account in front of us thank you can I just SE clarification from councelor black which Grant do you mean I’m going back into prehistory here man we we used we used to pay there used
To be a a grant paid to local authorities which went to the housing Revenue accounts um that doesn’t happen anymore okay that’s fine that that’s so all the only income is the rents for this house revenue account yeah there is a major repairs that’s the one I’m thinking of that’s the one you’re
Thinking of M uh and that has been frozen for many years and hasn’t altered years I think yes it’s not linked to rents at all it is it’s remained the same since since I’ve been in Poon probably beyond that um it is something that we are in conversation with Welsh government about reflecting
Inflationary increases to try and get a higher level of MRA because our repairs are costing more because building materials are costing more yeah uh we’ll continue to have that conversation but it hasn’t moved yet uh and in terms of sheltered wardens I’m not aware of a
Service charge but I will check that and come back and write in on that thank you chair okay if there aren’t any more questions it’s been proposed and seconded and the recommendation is on page 111 and it’s that there’s two parts I’m going to take them both together so
Can I have a show hands in support of the report please any against any extensions okay that’s carried thank you the next item is the review of the polling districts polling places and polling stations and can I call them Mr Evans please thank you presiding member um this review followed a formal
Consultation period which run from the 8th of November to the 20th of December 2023 um correspondence was sent to MPS uh members of the sen counselors grewn counselors and groups with uh that represent protected characteristics please excuse the error in the report because I still mention mep’s apologies for that
Um the the the the returning officer remains committed to reducing the use of schools as polling stations due to the impact it has on children and families and it’s pleasing to note that um the recommendations outlined in in appendix 3 has lowered the number from 11 down to
10 that’s over 145 poll stations we are really going in the right direction with in that usage um and the other point we’re looking at is to improve the voter experience we’re not keen to be using mobile stations but obviously in certain are we’ve got to but where possible
We’ll avoid using them I’ve got nothing nothing to add other than to remind you that appendix one sets out the returning officer initial recommendations appendix 2 sets out the consultation respons and appendix 3 sets out the R’s final proposals I’m willing to take any questions you may
Have propos are in second at first y yes chair move the report happy to second okay coun mcck sorry hi yeah thanks for the rep I did I did raise raise this issue at the consultation stage but I just draw members uh attention to the
Fact that one of the boxes in Sketti is particularly large so the car glass roadbox W is 3,713 people which is not just sort of 50% bigger than the next nearest polling area it’s actually about 50% bigger than some Wards so I I guess the question I’d
Like to ask you know in order we don’t want to have cues we don’t want to well thatd be a good problem to have but it is possible I I think two two things I mean at what point is that area getting too large and secondly I know that
Schools and mobile stations are not favored but again is there an argument for it when those when those polling areas are starting to get large given there has been house building for instance there come if I can come in on that well first I take a point about 3,000 but
Well yes there are 3,000 in the polling station but there are two polling stations in that in that area so that the quees are instantly managed um we put up the room it’s a big venue we’re using so I I don’t see the issue um in
St Thomas some years ago we had a triple station in one venue these things are quite common place and we look to the best used voter experience we’re looking at if you got any suggestions in the area we’re always willing to look at but we’re not keen to going back to schools
Because of the impact it it has and I really want to avoid going back that way and uh Mobile Stations they they’re not great for anybody but if you get any physical buildings always willing to listen thanor Phillips you um and I apologize to Mr for asking this question now I didn’t
Notice it before I refer to page 133 Castle Ward at the bottom of the table on Castle Ward um the bottom line says we are combining XG with hx1 but uh hx1 has been combined with hx2 in the first castle line and next year has been combined with HX 2 in the
Following line so it seems to be being combined twice yeah on the face but I agree let me just look at the I think there’s a typographical error there let me just see if I can work it out quickly otherwise I’ll permit a written response
But let me just see if I can find it somebody actually read the report now the bottom one has been combined with one that’s combined in the first line xh1 iser to twice that that’s the point that councelor XG is being comined combined with hs2 yeah yeah
But it looks to be X and G XG and xh1 are being combined together in the third line but H it’s also being combined with xh2 yeah what I think is actually happening there the three are all going to form a Brin mailing Community Center polling District that’s what’s happening
It’s it’s it’s these are purely lines in the ground they don’t affect people they go to the same polling station it’s purely administrative change this is it doesn’t affect anybody and no voter will be will will will see any change in this I can see it I I can see what’s going on
The fact you can’t if I can explain it further Bren ma used to be double station given the numbers it’s now going to be a single station that that’s the honest reality of it why couldn’t that be a single line then and everybody would understand it without without without
Argument he just said H h12 and nextg all being combined together it would be perfectly simple are you okay now councilor phers are you okay yeah why didn’t say that though no it doesn’t Well it can’t do otherwise it wouldn’t have asked the question would I any other questions
Anybody hang on Council back because I got somebody online first before you put your hand up okay unless you want to sort something out for Mr for councelor Phillips no okay councelor will Thomas then please thanks presiding member just a quick one um we’ve got uh a part of um
What was West Cross moved into the mumbles ward however that section of uh what was West Cross is still in West Cross mumbles Community Council uh we often have byelections in the community council so I’m wondering if th those people where they will um vote on a West Cross by elction because
It’s all the way in Norton uh and that which is long way and also I would worry about the West Cross polling stations both being in the south of West Cross there’s nothing in the in the North West Cross which is a long way to walk for a
Lot of people so just wanted to um get some thoughts around that please and what you thinking okay as the as the report was it it was out for consultation we were asking for people’s views and opinions if you’ve got alternative eners please give them to us that that’s the purpose
Of this report we don’t have the answer for everything that’s why this is here so if you have a suggestion please forward it to me so I can consider it yeah at the moment the fact that something a mumbl area in is in West Cross has little makes little difference
Um to to the to the ability to vote and of course po um postal votes are always available helps sorry coun yeah just for a point of information there is a third in station in West Cross at whitstone primary ideally it wouldn’t be in whitstone primary I know you received
Representations to that effect but there is no alternative venue um and I think a portion of the voters that councelor Thomas is referring to would in fact be voting at Whit Stone so it’s not as far to go as all the way down to Norton just
For as a point of information yeah it just says alternative venue sort that’s why I brought it up thanks coun mate uh thank you the the letterer of the polling stations um fall uh in alignment with the old parliamentary constituencies for example um W and X prefixes for the old Swansea
West and um I think e and Fs F form the old Swansea East and I think G’s form the old old gal didn’t they so are there plans in the future now to realign them with the new parliamentary constituencies you know with with new letter codes uh to fall into line with
Referencing yes absolutely this report actually covers it but doesn’t give you the codes it it it’s happening it’s a it’s a statutary change so yeah it’s happening we will share the lists uh once we have them but yeah the new Cordes but it doesn’t affect anybody is it oh councel back sorry
Thank you chair just relation to the appendix 2 very much welcome the acceptance of moving the path of Eaton Road Milwood Street and suit streets to um into the B hovery box so residents don’t have to climb up the hill when there’s a polling station just over the
Road from them um just clear and that will presumably also include that that part of cler Street and Bowen Street between Milwood Street and Eaton Road as well where when when you comes up I assume you’ve drawn the line on the map and that’s that’s the case yeah let’s speak tomorrow to get
That F finite detailed then but yes we know we took on board your comments and we’ve tried to reflect them exactly as you asked so they made sense they were reasonable we’ve acted on them I sent a map rather than actually yeah okay if there’s no more questions
It’s been uh proposed it’s been seconded so can I have a show of hands and support of the report please anybody against any extensions mric thank you okay let moved then thank you so the next item is the amendments to the council’s Constitution the Constitution working group terms of reference again
Call Mr Evans please this report um has come from a recommendation of the cwg the Constitution working group we’re looking to amend the terms of reference slightly to enable it to consider any issues that requires cross political group discussion it’s quite useful not a decision-making body and I want to make
That point clear it’s just to allow discussions on a formal basis nothing further to add good yeah chair happy to move this we’ve had discussions at cwg and I think all group leaders are in agreement with the report so happy to move okay CC H second yeah okay any questions for
Anybody no okay then the recommendation is on page3 and that’s to consider any issues that requires cross political group discussion oh sorry I got councelor days councelor day sorry sorry I was anticipating the vote Walton were you taking the vote as well yeah I think they’re all waiting to
Vote sorry I thought were speakers okay okay so show hands in support of the report please anybody against any extensions okay that’s carried thank you so the next item is item thiron 14 milon it’s the adoption of the name in policy and can I call on councelor Stewart please yes uh thank
You chair in uh Council Hopkins absence I’ll move the report um the the adoption of a name in policy is something that’s been discussed at uh again it’s constitutional working group uh it’s there as a framework to allow us to um bring forward names of individuals who
Have made contribution to Swansea um it again will allow us not only to new to name new places that we create as part of regeneration but also to revisit some names that may have become outdated across the city so uh again uh nothing to add to report I think it’s very
Sensible there’s a lot of uh discussion gone on and I think it’s a policy we can put into practice very quickly have a second to please Chris I’m very pleased to to to to Second it because I think there are a couple of uh things that come to mind
That could be named I won’t mention them here to embarass people but it it it it is something that has been sadly missing and I I welcome the policy change okay it’s been moved and seconded so we go to the the report which is on6
So I can have a show hands in support of the policy thank you any against against Sinda yeah okay Evans we got that and any extensions okay we move on then to councilor’s questions on page 171 and the first one is from councelor Peter black any supplement the next is from councelor
Peter May any supplementaries councelor race oh sorry I’ve got one perhaps um does the does the um Council envisage any more applications uh on top of the four .5 million that’s already been secured uh in the future to the Welsh government so in terms of uh deams we’re
Very grateful to the Welsh government for the uh support they’ve given to this point of course it’s it isn’t the only site uh within the city center that the Welsh government are co-investing with us so I wouldn’t rule out further uh contributions from the Welsh government
But we’re not working on the basis that there will be at this point in time R you speak thank you chair just a couple of quick follow-up questions um I I know from the response obviously it’s focused the leader’s mind on the finance involved I I’m also interested in
Investment in terms of potential use so what’s a foot at the moment what’s happening to make sure it doesn’t become an expensive white elephant and secondly um with 4.5 million pounds committed through expenditure already from the Welsh government in terms of support do you think that this project is worth
Spending four times as much as you did on roads last year actually the second point is simply untrue and maybe Conor rice would wish to withdraw that because our investment in roads was was more than he suggested if he’s saying it’s four times then we would have spent less than or around a
Million on roads which is simply not true I think uh our total investment in roads last year was above 5 million uh in total I can check the actual figure but he may want to May wanted to um withdraw that comment I think yes it was
Above 5 million uh in terms of the uh how it making sure it becomes a viable site well I think you’ve got to look at the uh proposal to do nothing against the proposal to do something um had we have not acted and of course this Council acted before deams went into
Administration to keep the Swansea Branch trading we managed in doing so we managed to keep that uh business trading for longer than it otherwise would and of course deams itself was a an extremely well um Trading Store in terms of its uh location nationally for deams at the
Time um I think being interventionist uh making sure that we uh take the right steps to keep our city center functioning if there is no Center to the uh quadrant then it’s likely to impact uh other Traders and the decisions of other traders to move out to the
Quadrant so it’s essential that we took action there our agents are are already uh taking steps and having discussions with a number of potential retailers uh we have a number of options on the table from a single uh occupier to multiple occupiers it’s a very large site about
160,000 Square fet um so it probably can bear more than one uh occupier and again it may be not just retail it may be other operations that come out of there so again if if those of you who who look at the national press announcements over recent weeks you’ll have seen Moves In
The High Street of different retailers taking over the old debam Stores um but there are others and one of the things the cabinet has been very keen to see is additionality in the city center so adding to the mix of retail that we have there but um you know if if Council
Rice’s his view would be Council don’t do anything just leave it to somebody else to fix I certainly couldn’t agree with that uh approach and I think it would be damning for businesses in the city center to have an Administration that didn’t care about a city Center C
Back thank you chair one of the conditions of the grants which the Welsh government as imposed is or agreed rather um is a requirement for a Steering group with wsh government to confirm occupation and usage including consideration of longer term options for occupiers could you give us more
Information in terms of the terms of reference that group it’s membership and time scale and whether that whether that um has a finan exist will it will it be a will it cease to exist once once it’s fulfilled its purpose um in terms of a Steering group generally there is already one in
Existence in terms of the council which many of the members of the cabinet and CMT sit on but in terms of this formal board is being set up at present I believe um and obviously once it’s done its job it won’t continue I would have thought once the uh the new tenants are
In place because it won’t have a function then so time scale in terms of setting it up and terms of reference um setting it up ASAP because obviously we’ve have been moving as fast speed to get our marketing together so the agents can engage with potential occupiers um
We’re now getting to the point where we’ve got responses from those occupiers which we can consider we’ve got the Welsh government support offer in place so now the Steering group can begin its work uh and obviously uh we hope to be able to make announcements in due course
But you’ll also note that the quadrant is also on the market at the present time and they’re in a live bid situation so there are many moving parts to this that we need to be mindful of um and in terms of time scale uh I think at the
Time when we made the announcement about purchasing deams we want that um filled as soon as possible but of course um if it is multiple occupiers even if it’s a single occupier there are Works to the mechanical and uh electrical systems that’ll need to be done there’s the fit
Out of the stores that’ll have to be done so inevitably you’re talking many months of construction work before you will become an operational place within the quadrant again um but the sooner we can get to the point where we can announce who those tenants are going to
Be uh the better and that we are working to do if I may CH as as this is a joint Steering group will the wsh government officials on that Steering group have any have any veto on what we want to do with this not as I’m not as I’m aware we
Have had detailed discussions with the Welsh government prior to the money being awarded and there are clear um lines in terms of how the money can be used um and those are ones that we pre-negotiated with the Welsh government so I do not believe they’ got any power of veto over any decisions
Hol thank you for the explanation leer um I I don’t disagree with us purchasing it and what have you because at the end of the day it’s a very very big store alongside a multistory car park in the center of the city and we had to do
Something with it now in no Cardiff are having ears demolished Newport having ears demolished Calin are turning ears into a c Hub uh we came too late in the market to have a look at that but we are where we are the one thing I would say
Is when we actually start on this I do think it would be beneficial for the council if there was a confidential briefing about how this is going to play out because it is a major store in the city center it’s a huge investment and I suspect it’s going to be even more in
The future because whatever we do and we as you rightly pointed out we will have to spend money doing the mechanical electricals whatever even if we have to have a fit out done on it so I suspect that it would be advisable that if we had a confidential briefing for members
About the future of this particular store thank you yeah thank you uh um counc Holly I think look we’ve offered that to the scrutiny panel that looks at all of our regeneration schemes and again I I think you know we’ve agreed to go into a private session to do
Confidential briefings on that so that that’s certainly in trail anyway um in terms of uh coming back to all members on this uh at the appropriate time got no problem again with doing that but at the present time we are in the process of speaking to potential tenants and
Then looking and evaluating the options once we have a potential Way Forward I think that’s the appropriate time then to to hold that briefing okay thank you councelor SE the next questions councelor mate uh thank you presiding member uh first question is um due to uh certain elements of the
The arena complex how can I put it a yet to be yet to be finished does um uh does the 46 million uh figure is that the the final figure or would there are there going to be any sort of further figures to to finish the project and does the
Leader have a sort of time scale of of of when um everything will be fully operational yeah so we we haven’t included the figures um for the completion of the elements uh with the multi-story car park and the units because members will know that is subject to administration at the present
Time uh and therefore we are in discussions with Wilmore Dixon in terms of a a scope of Works to complete the remaining works that were left by Buckingham when they went into Administration we’re obviously having to uh wash everything through the administrators as well so it’s a complex picture therefore it wouldn’t be
Appropriate for us to put those figures in the public domain until they are known but we have briefed uh group leaders I believe and we have briefed uh members privately and again as we’ve said publicly we have retained and protected the council’s position against more more than we believe the remaining
Works are uh to ensure that the council taxpayer is not out of pocket in terms of any remaining works that need to be done in terms of time scale uh I would love to be able to say it’ll be done by the end of the month but the reality is
You’ve got to work with the administrators we’ve then got to make sure that willmot Dixon uh scope of works is something that can be fully agreed that will be the next phase then they will get onto the works that will include rendering some of the packages of work hopefully to local traders who
Potentially will have lost out by the um fact that Buckingham went into Administration and we’re keen to make sure those that potentially would have lost out get another opportunity to for the work and have an opportunity to finish the job and that’s important for our local trades and then of course they
Get on with the job of finishing uh the remaining works so taking all that together I think uh late summer is probably where we’re going to end up again it’s a similar answer that I gave to council Holly when we were at scrutiny but I can’t really give you a
Date until we get that scope of work back from Wilmore Dixon and then we will be able to answer that question with confidence thank you um just in reference to last question I’m happy to provide the evidence for the information I I provided um in terms of the
Expenditure of 46 million P which has been made on the arena so far what percentage or what figure has come from funding which is not directly from Council resources and does the leader expect any Financial payback in terms of direct um cash or money in future for
Many tenants in terms of being able to reduce the the cost to the council sorry could apologies Council R could you repeat that question again please I missed the first little bit of it okay no problem so the first part was what percentage or figure of
The 46 million pounds was provided by a funder which is not the council and the second question is does the council expect any of its Financial investment to be returned through any of the private Partners or occupants in Future Okay so the the first question is
Um that is already detailed in the uh Arrangements uh for the city deal uh because this is a city deal project and that would have been co-funded by ourselves uh Welsh government and UK government I think those figures are already public but I’m I’m sure we can
Recirculate them so that you have them in terms of the second one I’ll need to take advice on that one and come back with a written answer for you we move on to question four then and on that’s again from councilor Peter mate thank thank you uh Cabinet member
For your answer to this question um I just wanted to see further assurance that uh no schools have been pushed back from the financial year ahead to 2027 I said this the situation is fluid what I can say to you is that we monitor each project on a monthly basis on on
The delivery group and the program board and so on there’s officer on political oversight of all schemes um obviously when when you’re when you’re in this situation matters arise and and things that we are not aware of any at the moment question six is councilor s Bennett please question five
I was like oh I’m not question five sorry s can’t I’m not ready for question six um thank you very much um Cabinet member for the response is really detailed um and helpful um I just wanted to pick up on a couple of things I mean obviously the use of burning any
Materials is going to reduce air quality so it’s it’s helpful the information is there but it’s not necessarily in answer to the question it’s reducing carbon emissions but it’s not improving air quality for residents in the area um I I I suppose towards the bottom of the the
Response I just want to get um to see if the cabinet member will commit to using air quality monitors moving forward you know how do we know whether there is an air quality problem when we we put put events on for substantial period if we’ve not if we’re not monitoring
RG yeah that’s really an environmental health matter which we come under councelor David Hopkins and who’s not here today he’s collecting the award for the best Market in Britain uh thought we get that in again um Lu very important to the best Market in Britain I think I was right wasn’t
I that’s Mark in Britain yeah look you know we I did see the best Mark in Britain never seen you lost for words come on well just taking it back you know but it’s um I’m I’m getting ready for next Christmas actually look we will always you know
Monitor the air and we want to make sure that we get as little pollution in Swansea as possible it is not easy to run the Machinery there you know there was an ice rank Etc um it’s in the contract as you see that we use the least pollutant um
Uh you know fuel for all the The Operators there we will continue to monitor that and put the contracts out accordingly where we can find better Solutions it’s never easy um but it is you know the people of Swansea and the region really look forward to this and
It’s either we do it this way or or not do it until we get a better solution um that is Affordable as well there are other fuel probably available in the future which will you know you could look at being fuel by hydrogen but the the um facilities for operating
These that is not available with them at this moment in time but should it come that way we can actually use those different um different means of operating the machines they’re considerably mon monitoring environmental health yes and air quality we you know we monitor air quality I know in skety we monitor air
Quality over in foxol we monitor the air quality so you know it’s it’s something that we Contin be doing thank you AR okay the next is from councelor Peter May that’s councelor rice is well again councelor rice okay just a quick question on this one for you um there’s been some great
Practice in housing and um you’ve had some plaudits from outside of this body about the good work that’s been done there um but reflecting on a TV program just before Christmas it said that there’s more that councils can do and I can remember Professor pet pet Tom macki
Saying so um with that in mind would the cabinet member agree that it would be a good plan to buy more Council more properties to turn into Council properties as it’s a faster turnaround than building our own uh I believe um councelor rice is referring to the program that I was
Actually interviewed on and uh did watch uh very closely I think when we looked at the comments from Professor Maki they were mainly aimed at Welsh government and at the standards that Welsh government have and removing the the barriers in terms of building so we can
Build at scale and Pace faster I can’t disagree Acquisitions are quick they’re easy um very Rel especially if we’re buying back X Council right to buys uh it’s a shame that we lost 4,000 in the first place but um we aim to buy as many as we can back because those are built
To a standard that we can then refurbish to Welsh housing quality standard and quite easily and relatively cheaply bring back onto the market so we do that wherever we possibly can but we usually use Grant Welsh government grant funding to purchase those properties to bring them back into stock nevertheless given
The actual demand that we’ve got we need to do both so we’re looking at the moment at reviewing our swansey uh standard so that we can build as efficiently and the best cash affordability without dropping standards for our tenants so we want to build more
Uh and we also got a number of schemes in the pipeline where the council won’t be directly building but we will be working with development partners and of course we can’t ignore the additions from the housing associations as well that we work closely with when we administer our social housing Grant uh a
Housing support Grant no sorry a social housing Grant to rsls so that they can build in more social housing across Swansea as well so essentially in the short answer to councilor rice is we will do everything within our power within our gift as quickly and as safely and as efficiently as we possibly
Can uh leader yeah chair not not on this one but just to uh help councelor rice because I think he said he’s going to send me information I’ve I’ve looked back at last year’s budget presentation which I got my phone um than thank thank you thank thank you for making me do
That because I’ve just had to look at lots and lots of photos of Pointy Pete uh because I forgotten uh Peter May pops up on many a slide in that uh presentation but the actual figure for highways was 7 million plus and you’ll find that uh not only did we have 7
Million plus we also then included additions for patch team and other highways works and they were following there were cabinet reports that followed that where we then confirmed the full amounts so well above the million pounds that you quoted counc black thank you shair in relation to um new build L obviously as
You know whenever an EST a new estate is being built by a private developer as opposed to Housing Association there is a SE 106 requirements in terms of made 10 to 20% depending where it’s built and often that that percentage is is handed over to a Housing Association to manage
Is is the council looking at being partners with private developers in as well as Housing Association it seems to me that the council could acquire properties in that way as well as the housing associations uh the short answer is yes we are looking at that and I think GN
Vine is one of the developments where we’ve got commercial uh houses for sale we’ve got RSL houses and we’ve also got Council properties on that site so wherever we possibly can we want to be part of 106 we want to use all the tools in the toolbox to get as many properties
Into our stock as we possibly can can I ask a second question because there one of the section B um questions indicates there’s over 3,000 private sector properties which are empty in the city some of them in aing condition admittedly I’m just wondering is wsh government grant available to bring some
Of those back into use as Council Properties or is is it going to be too expensive to get them up the necessary standard uh the reality is we don’t only have to be restricted to looking at ex counil properties we can look at private properties there have been a number that
We have surveyed and when we’ve surveyed them it’s just been not justifiable or viable because the expense of bringing them up to a standard or they just structurally it’s it’s impossible to bring them up to the standard but we can consider private properties and we have brought back some councelor
Phillips rising from those questions I wonder what the cabinet member could might not fall within I think it’s probably David Hopkins actually given that we are uh having agreements with housing developers to provide 20% of um available housing can we not have a policy that says that
We will not accommodate any request from the developer to buy out the obligation to provide 20% probably is one for Council Hopkins but I think in terms of 106 and the developers um the requirements on the developer I think that’s more question for planning committee than it is for this chamber presiding
Member okay okay we move on to the next question have we had question seven we had the electric vehicles no sorry okay councelor Peter May then please councilor Rices but I I’m I’m tempted on on this one um the the largest sort of capacity electric vehicles I I could
Imagine would actually be Refuge lorries that that carry carry the most load um I have seen reports a while back of other local authorities you know using bin L’s and they’ve um had either shorter ranges so have we in Swansea bearing in mind we’re quite a hilly Authority had any
Instances where um fully loaded bin lores have conked out on Hills or or anything like that or are they are they are they fully capable of delivering their objective I just clarify are we talking the electric Refuge vehicle so we only have one electric Refuge vehicle on our
Fleet at the moment um like other local authorities that were piloting the EV RCV we had software issues which were resolved by the manufacturer and we haven’t had any issues since that I’m aware of perhaps councelor Anderson could come in on it but I’m not aware of
The vehicle conking out as councilor May has put it on any hillsides um we did have issues initially with software but those issues have been resolved it was a question not a statement I think you answered the question yeah yeah chair I think uh Cabinet member did
Answer the question uh just to go forward on it I was speaking to Mark Barrow today and um we got procurement out for the new vehicles coming in possibility if we can get match funding or funding by the Welsh government for a possible further electric 26 ton vehicle
I’ve been assured by Mark par that the vehicle that we got now at the moment did have technical problems with um it it’s like everything new that’s got uh little things in it but I’ve been assured by Mark Barrow he is not afraid to go forward now with electric because
Uh Dennis have sorted out this malfunction with uh the EVS Anderson I got councelor Thomas Thanks pres just follow up on the electric bin um Lori uh really just wondering we had a written answer and I think it was the last Council to questions posed on that um and I’m just
Wondering on a follow up on the two is is that uh electric bin lry still used every day I understand it’s still in service is it still being used every day understanding that obviously it has challenges but is it still being used or is it sitting in the yard the majority
Of time thank you um thank for the question uh councelor Thomas uh Thomas as far as I’m concerned that vehicle is out on the road every day now and there’s no glitches with it whatsoever phip sorry I wonder whe the cabinet member could confirm if there are any vehicles
That do conqu out on Hills do we have any contingency plans to Peter May because he seems to be running around having his photograph taken picking up letter all over the place when who answer that I think you know if if a ward member wants to replace a vehicle when
It’s not operational and it can’t pick up the litter who are we to stand in their way the next question is from councelor Sam Bennis please thank you more um um thank you um for the response um and also I want to take the opportunity to thank the marina
Office for all the work they do to clear the rubbish that does collect at the the Boon across the tower um I just want to ask the question really having had conversations with the Mariner office and youve referenced it in your own um response here say um saying that the
Weight the waters are cleansed by using a small workboat do we think that we’ve got the equipment um available big enough to do the job given how much wood with plastic among it and if if if we don’t feel like we have is there anything we’re going to
Do to try and stop Plastics I appreciate there’s a lot of there’s a lot of other people involved in this but it’s becoming our problem and it’s sitting in the middle of the the the river waiting for a high tide yeah few parts to that question so I’ll get you a written
Response in councelor Hopkins absence okay okay that’s the end of the councilor’s questions then we move on to the part B there’s no supplementary so we now move on to the notice a motion over to you councelor Stuart yeah thank you chair um in terms of uh the motion it’s it’s
Self-explanatory and lays out um the position I think uh many members will uh hold this evening um the announcement did come as a surprise because as you’ll be aware there’s been a transition board in place uh for a number of months now which has been working on a plan to
Retain both the uh blast furnace and and have a uh orderly transition um to A gleener A Greener type of steel production namely uh Arc uh furnaces which are electric furnaces which the difference between the blast furnace and the arc furnace for for those who are not familiar with the steel industry is
Is that in the blast furnace you can make steel from scratch you can make virgin Steel in the arc furnaces which are electric furnaces you can only use recycled steel so using scrap which is then recycled now the the produce that comes out of the arc furnaces obviously
Uh isn’t as uh widely usable as uh the blast furnaces that’s one of the constraints but also as a as a nation as the motion says um one of the concerns is that we would then be the only G20 power um not to be able to actually make
Virgin steel now given some of the statements made uh recently by um members of the senior members of the Armed Forces by defense secretary and others the situation around the world in terms of the likelihood of of of conflict and and uh new emerging conflicts even uh the prospect as was
Announced yesterday of um conscription being uh introduced um should a a major conflict arise for the UK to then not have an ability to make steel uh for its own economic uh purposes or for its own defense seems to be an incredibly shortsighted and dangerous move so from a national critical infrastructure
Perspective this move just doesn’t make sense sense you layer on to that the fact that um The Arc furnaces uh if they’re EST if they’re ever established will need to have um a competitive energy price in order to to operate because one of the other things that
Tataa has said is that they’re losing a million pounds a day well why is that do we think could it be that we’re paying three times the price for our energy in the UK that for instance France and Germany and others are paying because of the deregulation and because of
Situation that we have in the energy Market which this government has presided over we got into difficulties because we took exactly the same well the government took exactly the same approach to energy which was that we’ll rely on a foreign power to provide uh
Some or or or lot of our energy needs so even if the arc furnaces come along they won’t be able to produce the steel that we potentially need for all the things that we need they may not be able to do it in a competitive way and if you look
At the climate change aspect of this well we were working working within the city deal already to deliver three key projects as part of the low carbon growth initiative that’s the advanced manufacturing production facility which is already been built overneath falet looking at how we could help um to
Improve the production facilities of uh Industries like steel then a specific project called the South Wales industrial transition from carbon Hub or switch which was looking at how we can decarbonize steel manufacture uh and also other Heavy Metal Industries and then finally The Net Zero Skills Center
Now these are projects that we’ve um taken forward very quickly as part of the city deal they were projects that were that we’re going to employ hundreds of people in order to help secure a long-term green future for steel in South Wales that’s what the transition board were working to try and and
Deliver as a city region we were working to try and deliver it and Along come UK government and Tata steel and suddenly say no we’re pulling down the shutters end of that story we’re now exporting um blast furnace production uh back to India and if you look at the comparators
That that production uh capacity and capability uh in India is a dirtier process than it is in the UK so all you’re doing is ex is giving up your own ability to do it cleaner and pass it to another part of the world so there’s no
Global gain for for the planet in terms of of climate change it’s a retrograde step so on what basis can the government possibly support this you know I think we we have to as the as the U motion lays out all for continued discussions for them to look again about how we can
Have an orderly transition to a Greener um uh steel production but on the basis that we retain capacity and capability as a nation to make our own steel and if we do that then we then protect the jobs that go with it because 2500 well-paid jobs being lost to our economy is not
Just difficult it’s devastating daating as I said these are uh potentially 125 150 million pound taken out of our local economy every year uh and then when you add the supply chain in all of those Associated businesses that rely on seal production and that benefit from it
You’re looking at probably close to half a billion pounds being taken out now those impacts will be felt not just in NE P Alber they’re equally felt in in Swansea in Bend IN Ronan Anda in all of the surrounding communities and it does not have to be this way
There are there is another way to do this um I just don’t think the government are Keen to pursue other options you know uh take the Party politics out of this for any prime minister to announce that scale of job losses and not talk to the equivalent
First Minister about this refuse to even have a conversation to lock the uh Regional government out of any opportunity to participate in the transition board as UK government have done uh for the economy minister to be offered a conversation with a deputy Junior minister in about four or five
Days time is just arrogant beyond belief and it smacks of of the way in which this government behaves I am absolutely convinced they do not care about Wales there is no there is no value in them doing anything for Wales because there’s no votes in Wales for them and that’s
What it comes down to and I will be interested to see in a few months time whether we see you know very very lucrative contracts being awarded out to companies in other parts of the world maybe India maybe Elsewhere for the supply of Steel to the UK when we could
Have continued to make it here if the government had the will and I would urge everybody to support the motion h thank you presiding member can I thank the leader because when I suggested this he he suggested a cross parties um agreement to to bring this noce a
Motion the simple fact is that in this in in in Swansea in particular how many of us have being touched by the steel industry um it is unlike The Valleys which to some extent was touched by all of coal in in this area if you if you
Start infinet and go up to Brien at one stage you couldn’t go 100 yards without it in some sort of steel or iron in industry and that you know that that is a fact and the reality is the steel industry has been decimated not just in
The last couple of years but over the last 30 years the reasons being Energy prices yes but I always remember a man by the name of Mr McGregor turning up Atari where sorry th in poala and I can remember his saying to a colleague of
Mine who was in the union and he turned around and said to him I’m going to fire a shotgun in the Rolling Mill at midday and not in anybody he said how you going to do that I’m going to sack you up and that’s what they
Did and that was when the Glorious Mrs SATA was around so let’s be blunt about this the steel industry has never had its support uh a man I an engineer that I once worked for had an opportunity to travel around America and one of the places he went to
Was a place called Bethlehem Steel in Philadelphia and Bethlehem Steel is one of the biggest steel manufacturers in the world and on the side of the Rolling Mills with fistan rolling Mills was a brass plate and that brass plate said this is donated by the American defense Pentagon for the Strategic importance of
The American defense uh um Network in this country we do not think of that if it’s a bank you underwrite it because the city friends who are all members of the same clubs in London you got to look after them but the steel industry doesn’t have that club Steel Industries Club are its
Workforce the people that we know the people we grew up with and the people that are now working there and that’s the sickening part of all this we know how to produce steel very very good quality steel and without the blast furnaces you do not produce the steel the Virgin steel from
IO electric AR fness is um I had a I have actually seen electric Arc furnaces working for the titanium industry it’s a big copper bowl with a big electrode in the top you throw all the scrap in you eat it up and then you pull
The bowl out and that’s it and that is uh how electric AR furnaces work very little technology very little employment and this is the proposal for patala I said to the leader one of the things that I really concerned about is the future of young people
I was fortunate I left school I had an apprenticeship like 60 or 70 other people of my age group who went into into Tech we all had these jobs there were loads of Industry around there we haven’t got that now there’s two or three manufacturing places left in Swansea so what’s going to
Happen not everybody can be a computer scientist or a game designer or something of that nature and to think whether or not does our UK government uh currently think of Wales I don’t think it does regardless of what uh you know I think it was the Secretary of State for
Wales said oh we’ve given them a 100 million for train and that’s enough that’s more than enough it doesn’t it doesn’t matter about how much it is it’s what they’re going to do the real issue about this is we are losing a vital part of our infrastructure we lost it with coal but
We knew that happen for the carbon reduction there are ways of making steel I don’t know myself how they do it on a low carbon method but one thing I do know once those blast furnaces are closed once they cool down you will never ever see them again and we will
Have lost the ability to make virgin Steel in the UK and that has a direct effect on outcome of any any conflict this country ever got into thank God we will get into hopefully but when we can then import steel from Holland Carter’s place
In Holland which is in the EU by the way and I’m not sure if any of you realize but we were told before the referendum if we stay in the EU our steel industry will be decimated told by farage man we stay we came out of there and now
It’s decimated but there are companies in the EU still producing steel I’ll tell you I fully support this notice motion I think everybody should I hope every conservative votes for it because other than that we are losing a major Maj part of our industry thank you counc Holly
Council Jones bring you in there Robert great thank you uh presiding member yeah you know um it is really sad to see this news about the job losses in P Albert uh which will have a big impact uh if if if they go ahead on the town and The Wider
Community um I disagree with one of two points that have been made in the fact that the UK don’t care about whales that’s not the case uh not least uh the huge investment in Swansea and of course the free port in put Albert um but I was
Shocked to hear about the losses with uh with tataa uh and pleased to hear that the UK government are investing half a billion pounds to save jobs but I think that could be done differently like many people before before me speaking tonight we we all know someone was worked in in
In in the in the uh Works in patal but members of my family friends neighbors uh so I would like to think more could be done there are we’re talking about two furnaces there one I’m told is is um at a stage where it needs to be reigned
But I understand the other is due to be led in about four years I would therefore like to see at the very least and I mean the very least the second furnace remain in use uh you know during this time and this is something I I know
Our leader in the Senate is called for I would also like to see that furnace remain open for a number of the points that have been made here tonight number one in four years technology will be different we can make different choices we uh uh which would allow hopefully to
Retain a lot of those jobs and I also think it’s very very very important we retain the capacity to make that high quality steel once we’ve lost that it’s very very difficult as I’ve heard tonight to get that back so it is important equally I’m I’m pleased about
The fact that the uh there is a 100 million and I’d like to think there could be more than that to help people who were to lose jobs but I think now is the time to do all we can to make sure we can keep those job jobs uh you know
Uh because it does affect not J but Talbert but our area as well and I think that is is vitally important thank you thank you councilor Jones I got RFD first down unless you want to come in I got R first sorry listening to the leader and listening to council Holly they made
First class case of why we have all got to be supporting those jobs was in Char to Steel it’s the government I said the English government they are the national government have treated I think the Welsh government with contempt in the in the way they haven’t consulted with the first
Minister uh it’s an absolute disgrace you know Council Lan Jones talks about 100 million pound and let’s let’s try and help people we were the metal capital of the world where are we going you know every day you put the news on you heing about whether it’s conflict well conflict all over the
World what happens if that conflict spreads and spreads where’s the capability of the United Kingdom without the Virgin steel to be able to um protect the United Kingdom the government care about that you know they they they’re often talking about you know quite often Wars seem to suit this government because deflects
Perhaps of the dire state that get us into 3,000 jobs those 3,000 jobs would be it can multiply that by at least four or five times we talk about um a free port at the moment we got a port in balber where the O comes into 60,000 ton
Vessels coming in to offload the O that o won’t be coming in to be offloaded so those doctor jobs will be gone and do the government care no they don’t care should they be investing in it of course they should be investing in it you know the our national security
Alone it should be we the only G20 country that will not have that capability and just to announce it and not not care care about it you know what do we tell our children or grandchildren immigrate get out of the United Kingdom because the jobs are not
Coming with this government all I hope are that we have a a general election sooner rather than later so that the public can tell them what they think of them so it’s the National Security the job losses our economic dependence on other countries having to import from all over
And in times of conflict will those Imports be available we all know the answer and once those blasphemes gone the expertise goes with it anybody you know you walk into your local pub your friends your neighbors we all know somebody who’s been brought up in the metallurgical Industries whether
It was tin PL whether it was um popper whether it was brass and now Steel there’s not going to be anything left and they don’t care they can say they care I do not believe they care um they go on about well the environmental impact our carbon
Footprint we got you know the electric Arc system will work better that should be we should have the electric Arc system and I I’m looking forward to that money being invested but that should be as well as and it’s it we what they be putting money into is research and development
Or bringing the cost of electricity down because that’s what’s killing T and as the leader said is that we are paying the prices that they not paying in France and in fact the industry that we all owned they sold out and who owns them all now mainly the French so what
We owned the French now own and it’s killing off of steam making as well we have good universities in South Wales we’ve always been an Innovative country and that Innovation and that investment should be put into that Innovation and how we then find our fuel to become
Cheaper but let’s not kill off our blast furnaces um I know this side of the house and I know that side of the house I’m sure will V this maybe the conservatives will V for it do I believe that they believe in this motion no I don’t they play lip service dread
And I I’m appalled by this government C Lewis thank you presiding member um wholeheartedly support this motion um I am pleasantly surprised as I do believe that councelor lynon Jones was actually speaking in favor of the principles of this motion against the stance that UK government have taken which is quite
Surprising but pleasantly surprised by that this is history repeating itself um I take you back to 1982 where the Dufferin steel Works was closed through Margaret Thatcher’s government and here we are yet again with another steel Works being closed this is shortsighted not just because of the
Skills and the job losses and all the supply chains and everything that’s connected to that but also we need to be mindful that Quality Steel needs to be used in the Renewables industry and Wales could have been at the Forefront of that manufacturing wind turbines we’ve only got to look at the
Opportunities with the Celtic Sea and the offshore wind where is the steel coming from for that where will the steel come from for the tidal lagon what will happen to the the R&D the research and development that councelor Francis Davis re uh uh referred to with the universities where they’re actually
Looking at coated steels to produce solar energy they’re looking at all these things and all that will come to a grinding halt because we won’t have Quality Steel manufactured on our doorstep what is the point in having a free Port if we can’t export something of quality that we were Manufacturing in
Nethan balba and in trra no point in having a free Port if you’ve got nothing to export uh and as Robert Francis Davis uh indicated about the import as well impacts on that so I wholeheartedly support the notice of motion the UK government theyve never been serious about renewable energies let’s be quite
Clear they’re focused on nuclear energy they always have been they always will be they absolutely ignore the fact that decommissioning nuclear plants causes radioactive waste that needs to be disposed of Renewables is where Wales could have really flourished and and we can still really flourish but we need
Steel as part of that picture to be able to do it and they’re just shooting Us in the foot yet again I Echo the leader comments I think Wales are yet again the poor cousins UK government don’t care about us they stopped Rail electrification and now here they are
Stealing thousands of jobs from our region so don’t it yeah thank you uh presid member um this is my opinion as well as a few people have spoken to that the central government and TAA have concocted a plan where they will invest between them 1.25 billion to end
Primary steel making by closing his two blast furnaces at P Alber and install a scrap recycling furnace instead tataa and the government is saying that both blast furnaces are at the end of life this isn’t true number four Blast Furnace isn’t du to be reigned until 2032 with the planed closure of British
Steel’s blast furnaces at skun thop already announced this devastating news will end our Sovereign steel making capabilities the UK would be the only country in this in the G2 G20 without the ability to make steel from scratch the basic oxygen steel making method currently in use uses raw
Materials in a blast furnace plus other elements added to the boss process to produce extremely high quality steel with a wide variety of specialist grades that are used in Auto automo Automotive defense and food packaging to name just a few Tata steel and the government say
That the high amount of CO2 generated by using blast furnace is not sustainable under the Nets Z plan that this toi government are trying to implement yes the steel Works input Albert is a single largest CO2 producer in the UK but it only accounts for 3% of the country’s CO2
Output the UK only accounts for 1.5% of the global CO2 output so you can really see how insignificant this will be compared to the humanity costs I say this is a financial decision that due to Decades of underinvestment and creative accountancy that has been largely Tata home doing
They are bringing blast furnaces online in India at the same time as closing hours we we still require virgin steel to use in our country what will happen to the price of this steel when we cannot produce alone our European partners are investing heavily in clean Blast Furnace
Upgrades using hydrogen and other carbon capture methods to clean up the steel making process where our shortsighted government are once again selling our Vital Industries down the river they say electric Arc furnaces are green I ask them where the vast amount of electricity required to operate this
Furnace will come from it will be the world’s largest electric Arc furnace and only last year we were threatened with lights going off so I asked the government and tataa where is this green electricity coming from Renewables aren’t reliable enough so why I’m am saying to them is that it
Will be for gas fired power stations very green indeed so it appears that 2,500 jws will be lost at tataa with thousands more contractor partners and supply chain jobs for the green initiative that isn’t green a sad day for Great Britain inded to finish presid member how do we compare with our
Neighbors France they got three blast furnaces Germany have 14 blast furnaces Sweden have three blast furnaces Belgium have two and Austria have five blast furnaces and there are no plans for closures UK has four blast furnaces move into no blast furnaces and that is a disgrace thank you very much coun counc
Mric thank you obviously I’m going to urge everyone to support this motion as well so I worked for 10 years in steel industry um the last place I worked shot and works in North Wales that used to be an integrated steel works and decades after they sacked thousands of men on
One day the effects were still being felt there and I’ll never forget the bit bitterness with which everyone spoke about those days how for a year everything was great but then the redundancy payment pay packets ran out and suddenly businesses started closing in their communities and their young
People had to leave to get those sorts of jobs that’s a vision of the future of what we’re facing as these jobs go um I won’t revisit some of the the territory that’s already been covered although I would agree with everything that’s been said um but there is a lack of strategy
And I think that has been highlighted and there’s also sometimes a lack of willingness to pay for things the energy price big issue but we have to recognize some of the things that we want from a modern steel industry do cost money that’s not killing your workers that is
Paying your workers a decent wage that is about controlling emissions and controlling the amount of carbon all of that is within our control while that steel industry is local and our local steel Works have worked very very hard to address all of those big issues um and then finally yeah the
Green the greenwashing of this decision is is absolutely breathtaking um there certainly may be good reasons to build an arc furnace and i’ far rather see an arc furnace here than nothing whatsoever but in terms of green all of that steel will have gone into recycling somewhere anyway steel is
Almost all recycled every single bit we can get our hands on is recycled and yeah it’s great for the UK carbon footprint but like good grief what about the global carbon footprint unless we change our patterns of consumption and that is not happening anytime soon because we are going to be
Using steel to build rails build all the renewable technologies that were mentioned earlier we are still going to be producing that steel somewhere and we’re moving potentially from situation where we’re producing it locally in a relatively carbon efficient manner to producing it potentially further a field under worse
Conditions more carbon output and then additionally having to transport heavy materials long distances um so I’ll leave it there I think most of the rest of it’s been covered by others but I wholeheartedly support this motion and it’s a terrible day for British deal those will Thomas Thanks presiding member um I
Think firstly our our thoughts should all be with all the people that are you know with prop proposed uh job cuts um obviously it must be a very stressful time for for all of them um so firstly you know our I’m sure everyone in the chamber our thoughts are with them and
Hopefully it doesn’t come to such severe job Cuts obviously um it’s very real problem um I think what Andrea said uh said it best was it’s so shortsighted by the UK government um and I I really believe it’s um it is an absolutely awful decision that um you know hopefully can
Be reverted uh the leader mentioned that you know we pay a lot more for energy uh on this site uh that is obviously one of the one of the factors uh of the you know the prices however with the steel industry obviously we’ve seen excuse me one sec my daughter’s
Screaming sorry sorry about that um kids and working from home um obviously the steel industry is at the center of a geopolitical game as soon as China joined the um the World Trade Organization they’ve been subsidizing their steel production and lowering the prices and Western steel manufacturers
Have obviously paid the price of that and Port Alber has um I would go as far as saying that it is a massive national security issue we can’t make virgin Steel in this country and you know I would look at you know steel tariffs on imported steel coming in to the UK there
So we are in our group making representations in the party um and in Westminster we will continue to do so um for RFD to say that this is lip service is very offensive to me and hopefully uh what I’ve said here today just um confirms that you know myself and my
Colleagues are you know very much in support of this thank you okay this is a very emotive subject I think I’ve got a number of speakers so if I can ask you not to repeat what’s already been said so if you got something new to bring to the debate I’d
Welcome that and the next speaker is councelor Smith yes thank you presid member a lot of what I was going to say has been said we’re not just talking about 3,000 jobs in patalo input and though those are we’re also talking about the supply chain and we’re looking at the future
Job opportunities that are going to be taken away you I as Cabinet member for Education that is one of my big worries about this it’s not just the jobs that have been lost now it’s the future job opportunity now I’m I’m slightly older than you Andrea uh but you know I was a
Teenager in the 198s watching the the cuts in the steel industry 19881 McGregor and that agenda the community that I represent they worked in trostre trostre was decimated is still there thankfully valindra is gone duport is gone the Bringin has gone many of them worked in Portal but those in that
Industry has been decimated those job opportunities were never replaced and as has been said this does not make economic sense it certainly doesn’t make environmental sense and it doesn’t make sense on grounds of national security so I think on all of those age arguments this needs to be reversed I’m glad we’ve
Got consensus here but I think we need we need a regional approach the leader has already pointed out the work done in the city deal that could bring this to become a modern Cutting Edge steel production facility in patalo that’s what we need to convince and that’s what
We need to aim for C Phillips I think we should be clear that uh tonight has has been a very important occasion we have seen for the first time in a long time the conservative supporting a motion that is against their government I’m not surprised that councilor Lon Jones is in support
Because like his uh colleague uh councelor Thomas they’re decent guys and so often councelor Jones has been sent here to defend the indefensible but not tonight because they recognize as most other people people in this chamber do that this is a most important issue it’s
Not just about the jobs it’s not um just a financial issue it’s a political ideological issue we’ve got into this mess because of Politics the reference was made to the nuclear industry to our power generation to our water supplies and our electricity companies which are in the hands of foreign
Nationals is there not should now not be a recognition that the production of Steel is of such National Security importance that it actually should be in the hands of the government and not in foreign actors who may at some time be on the opposite side of any national political
Disagreement whether we’re going to be subjected to slow delays uh import delivery problems during times of conflict when we cannot get steel if we do not make our own steal we have less of a bargaining chip if we do not make our own steal we are at the
Mercy of whatever is produced elsewhere good quality or bad quality would it be too much to ask uh councelor Jones to go along with me to say that now is the time that the government should renationalize the steel industry councelor race thank you check I’m in full support
Of this motion as every everybody else in this room is I I think as members have said it’s the wider impact on the community Beyond The crucial issues that we’ve already spoken about it will have a fundamental longlasting effect on Southwest Wales if this is to go ahead
Everything from education to um Finance to security and I’m sure all my all the group members here amongst us all agreed and I know Alan you worked in steel as well this is just a crazy decision and needs to be stopped uh councelor Katon councelor Keon you’re on
Mute I think she’s Frozen actually so I go on to some El and I’ll come back if that’s okay um I got councelor Jenkins thank you presiding member um I’ll take your advice I won’t uh repeat what every everybody said try to come up with some new points but um I think
Everyone’s got choices uh in life and this is a poor choice it’s a poor choice for the families and the workers and the members in patal but and and also the periphery where uh people uh Supply Supply P but okay so I’m wholehearted to be be behind this
Proposition motion I be taking similar propositions to the C p and the trades Council next week and I think uh people got to get behind this motion but they’ve also I think uh after we’ve had our debate today we got to get be behind the uh the members and the workers tal
Whether they’re standing beside him in balber or wherever they go uh in in any dis in any dispute or rallies okay so take out away and but what I would say it’s a dangerous Choice as well because as people have said if you’re going to if you’re going be able to get
That steel uh pretty sure that people are going to work out that and got the capacity to defend yourself I mean uh Ukraine got rid of the nuclear weapons didn’t they and uh whether Russia would be in there now if they were there that’s that’s a different thing but um
When you when you’re doing a poor job okay uh and you get you look at dismissal uh they escort you from the building with all your belongings uh because of the damage that you can do to that brand uh unfortunately looks if we got another 10 months before ry’s uh
Escorted for number 10 but what damage you’ll do in that 10 months uh there’s hope nobody gets another patal but uh cuz that’s the worry thank you very much councelor rice you speak yeah speak oh I spoken sorry I hadn’t crossed Chris Evans and please sorry or Sarah Sarah Sarah’s
Before me if I can call Sarah first then please sorry yes I’ll try not to do say everything that everyone else has said I thoroughly agree with it all my father was a welder during 60s 70s 80s 7s the veale valindra port Albert 80s when it got hard to get
Jobs um I think it’s ludicrous I think it’s crazy that it’s that a government is doing this right now Grant schaps was saying how dangerous the most dangerous time in our our modern history we’re at and we’re closing down of Steel works that is just crazy I mean it’s
Unpatriotic I I I can’t believe I’m saying this but it is um to it’s like tying our hands behind our backs we really need to keep this open not just because I’ve got history with it but because we have to and it’s ludicrous as for it’s green washing at his worst I’m
Pro all the green stuff you know that with me but this isn’t this isn’t green when we’ve got to get something from the other side of the world probably to replace what we’ve got locally when we’ve got so much building to do is not green absolutely not and the other thing
Is we’ve got the problems with sewers we got problems already getting stuff in it makes us vulnerable and we don’t need to be vulnerable this is this scary so one time i’ agree with grand shaps we are vulnerable and we need to protect ourselves that’s all I want to say thank
You okay got two more speakers and I’m going to close the debate okay so I’ve got Chris Evans next please councelor Evans Chris you’re on you’re on mute Chris I can’t lip read sorry no worries uh yeah I’m I’m another one my my father was a veteran Turner at uh at valindra
In the 80s um this this it doesn’t make sense economically it doesn’t make sense morally it doesn’t make sense environmentally and it doesn’t make sense in terms of strategy what it looks like more and more is just a massive bung from rushy sunak to a good friend of his
Father-in-law so what we have time and time again is the English government letting whales down it’s happened before it’s happening now and it’s happening again and I think it’s now time that we should stand up and make our own decisions and leave the UK and go for Welsh Independence councelor
Aona hi there thank you um of course this is clearly very emotive topic everyone knows somebody uh who’s been involved I think in some way uh for Tata steel and it’s not the first time in a long time we’ve actually supported a motion uh before not that long ago um
We’re only human I think this is absolutely awful for the UK as well not to mention a worrying security issue particularly for our patch as Linda and has already said and will um the wages these workers get paid won’t even be able to be matched um they were high
Wages obviously and won’t be able to find that type of waging W easily either and I absolutely feel for every single person who’s lost their job and been affected because it’s an awful horrible time uh for those people to go through as well so yeah fully support this motion tonight thank
You Mr Stewart thank you Char I’m up really quickly and look I’m grateful for everybody’s support I’m a little surprised that the um the conservative members support him but really pleased to see them stand talking and standing out against what is a ridiculous decision and just say some people have
Mentioned their family connections to see I’ve got one as well my dad was actually one of Mrs Thatcher’s first victims when she closed uh parts of the plant back in the 80s and uh I didn’t mention her name in my father’s house because it’s a it’s a tiate of Words I
Couldn’t Say in this chamber um but and he’s absolutely right and I think councelor Phillips has always been looking at my notes because one of the things I was going to say in suon up as well is I think look if you’re going to spend hundreds of millions of pounds
Protecting uh an industry that’s struggling then you’ve nationalized the banks before you’ve nationalized rail Services before before you’ve nationalized other services before we should not fear nationalizing part or all of the steel industry to protect something that’s of critical National importance to this country so uh thank
You for your support and uh chair happy to go to the vote okay it’s been uh proposed on secondly so can have a show hands in support of the motion please any against any extensions and I’m pleased to say that’s unanimous okay thank you very much everybody okay thank you all for your
Attendance and thank you for your patience it’s been on a little while service thank you all bye