How Do You Run 100 Miles? | Tom Evans Interview | UTMB, Western States

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Recently I travelled to Loughborough to chat to ultra-running legend Tom Evans. Tom’s entry into ultramarathons was far from standard, but he’s gone on to place at UTMB, win Western States, win CCC and more.

Hear from him what it takes to run some of the world’s toughest races, how he mentally recovers from failure and what the future of the sport is going to look like.

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hey everyone welcome back to the channel thank you so much for tuning [Music] in this week’s guest on Trailblazers talk is British Ultra Runner Tom Evans Tom is a former Army Captain who burst onto the ultra running scene in 2017 where he signed up for the marathon d as a bet with his friends and then came third place which is incredible he Then followed that the year later showing it wasn’t a fluke by winning the CCC which is a 101 km race as part of UTMB week I then had the pleasure of watching him come third behind mat blancha and kilan Jour at UTMB in 2022 and the following year after that which was last year he came first place in western states and I’m so excited to speak to him today I could go on about his achievements but let’s just get to the talking how you doing Tom good yeah busy season has just started and as with everyone trying to plan any everything some minor speed bumps on the way I am very happy we’re in the UK and it’s not raining so that is true although it’s not quite as sunny as it was down south I can tell you that now no that well yeah welcome welcome to the Midlands in my intro I said that you kind of came out of nowhere onto the ultra running World in 2017 but I don’t think it’s quite true that you weren’t already a decent Runner what is your sports background and when did you realize that you were a good endurance athlete I’ve done sport forever and looking back at it I was never particularly good I thought that I was very good at all sports I wasn’t I just tried harder than everyone else and if we were playing a football match I would score a goal in the last two minutes because I was less tired than everyone else right yeah and then I did Athletics and would win from 800 met above and then all across countries but I didn’t really enjoy it that much it didn’t give me that much of a kick so I think I’ve always known that I had an engine yeah that s of developed while I was in the Army and again there it was I knew that I was fit but I didn’t and didn’t train with a Garmin I didn’t have any metric to track it I probably ran five times a week and went to the gym seven times a week and have always just really enjoyed it and then I wanted something to challenge me as much mentally as physically so started doing sort of endurance events I did an Iron Man Tron and I enjoyed the challenge of it I didn’t enjoy it well I didn’t enjoy the does anyone enjoy I didn’t I didn’t enjoy the swimming at all I sort of yeah muscled my way through the swim but then really enjoyed the bike and the run and especially the run at the end I thought well if I’m enjoying running after 7 hours maybe this is something that you should look a little bit more into and then yeah sort of the Stars aligned and yeah I raced Maran desab in 2017 amazing and you came third which was I think at the time the highest Place European ever Right male male sorry yes an important clarification very important um what is your proud of running moment Western States last year it was the second time it was my third 100 mile race and it was the second time at Western States western states is the original 100 mile it’s the first competitive 100 mile I always wanted to debut 100 miles at Western States yes it’s in the US and for us in Europe UTMB would seem the obvious one sure but for me I don’t know what it was it was the history it’s more than it’s more than just a route it’s more than just a Race So I raced in 2019 and I was third there behind Jim that was when he and the current course record was from that year um and I was third and then I was then planning on going back the year after but then covid happened so it had been a real an itch that I really needed to scratch and I had one of those people say there’s no such thing as a perfect training block and I don’t think many more things could have gone right in that block it was one of those ones that you just I didn’t have a single niggl in8 months and every day was just easy yeah it wasn’t easy I was able to do every day yeah that’s all you can ask for with ar it is tough and then race day execution when nothing again nothing goes perfectly but I had I reckon in that race I probably had the least amount of bad moments out of anyone else which typically in ultra running races that’s what separates first place to third place is or first place to fifth place everyone is really good everyone will have moments of of being not so good and it’s how you deal with those moments of not being so good that set you apart on that note you are I think famously quite analytical about your training do you find that that helps you when things don’t go to plan yes and no and it’s almost the yes and no is almost the same and it just depends what side the coin lands yes it can be really useful because looking back at the data there is sometimes reason for things not going to plan so that’s good because someone some someone or something needs to take that responsibility however sometimes it is too easy to blame the data and then overanalyze it instead of just saying actually I just had a really bad day yeah today wasn’t my day you can actually go into more details say oh actually my I have my blood’s done Afters my white blood cell count was really high and actually my hemoglobin was low and actually my iron was a little bit low as well so actually it’s quite easy to make excuses and sort of almost back away from taking that responsibility and I think that’s something that I’ve really tried to work on since UTMB last year is taking that responsibility I’m the only one who can make or break my race I actually want to speak about that so UTMB last year I was there it it didn’t go to plan for you what actually happened it turns out that running with covid is not useful uh I picked Co up and I didn’t know at the time but I felt horrendous in the few days leading up to I thought it was just nerves and stress and being tired and having some media commitments there’s not much you can do I have to take that responsibility I was in a house with all of my teammates um which is brilliant and it’s really nice to be involved like that but sometimes you’ve just got to draw the line and say actually I’m putting all of my eggs into this basket I need to optimize my performance um so I’ll do things a little bit differently this year because you learned from it and yes I was going to say it’s all a learning experience exactly and the only reason that you can’t get better is if you refuse to stop learning yeah so yeah it was one of those where I didn’t necessarily want to take it was it was someone else’s thought that I had a bad day where actually you delve a little bit deeper into it it’s like actually I could have avoided that yeah I could have whether I should have or not who knows this year I won’t be making those same mistakes again amazing good to hear it UTMB announced this morning I think it was that they are doubling the prize money to $20,000 which is still relatively low when you compare it to sort of the world major marathons Etc most people are also not winning UTMB ultramarathon running is a relatively young sport what do you think are kind of the teething issues around that and how do you think that increase in prize money is going to affect the sport positive or negative in both ways I think it’s really good that prize money is being put forward because for elite athletes you only get paid by your sponsors if you finish on the podium so if you finish with some incredible athletes Adidas TX who finish fourth in every race whove never been paid for finishing fourth in a race and actually finishing fourth at UTMB is incredible but you’re getting zero you’re out of pocket which is wild so UTMB are paying up to 10 which is incredible and yes you’re probably not going to make any money off that but you’re covering a lot of your costs you’re losing less than you would have done previously which is great what do I think it will do for the sport I think yes it’s not as much money as major marathons but there aren’t that many European Runners who are going and finishing in the top five at Major marathons and I also don’t think it’s enough money for someone who is going to be finishing top five in major marathons to think oh actually I know what I’m going to do I’m going to do UTMB sure yeah so I I don’t think that will be a I don’t think it will change the sport that much until bigger either bigger money comes into or bigger opportunities and doesn’t necessarily have to be Financial but then on the other side of the coin you can make good money will that increase levels of cheating will there become more of a doping problem now well in tandem with their statement about the uh increasing prize money there’s also a statement about increasing the doping testing at all of the UTMB races and in all other Ultras as well correct which I think is really important however the sport cannot grow until out of competition testing is done yeah if you test positive in and around a race you’re an idiot yeah sure you’re doing things wrong the best athletes are the ones who are being how many marathoners maybe 5% of testing positive in competition and they’re all testing positive out of competition and we know that the levels of testing aren’t that high yet when they get to a competition they’re failing it but this is expensive so actually putting money in as a incentive at UTMB is absolutely brilliant and I think it’s incredible but in my opinion I would much rather have less money but have a anti-doping yeah a fairer sport precisely and I feel the incentive isn’t going to grow the sport but the fairness is what is going to grow the sport so yes it’s incredible there’s money there isn’t an infinite pot of money around however all of this money is coming from Hoka which is incredible and I think it’s time that the other big Brands who want to have a major pres who are making a lot of money and spending a lot of money as well but it’s time for I think everyone to say okay well how can we actually grow this sport on our terms because everyone gets mad at UTMB all the time and are they perfect no but they I genuinely believe they are trying they’re also leading the way like it is a very young sport we haven’t had precedent I mean yes there are other races but nothing really like Ultra marathons you know they are very different to a marathon precisely and I think they are they are trying have they made mistakes yes am I am I trying to say that they’ve not made mistakes and they are brilliant no I’m not however it’s the most competitive race so it’s the race that you want as an elite athlete you want to be at we just need to make it fair and I think that’s by by putting more money into the sport doesn’t necessarily mean that and I think a lot of people will say oh well the Sport’s more about Community than it is about Elite Performance and I do understand that if you’re growing up in the sport and you not idolize but if you admire a certain Runner you want to know that they’re clean and you want to know that they are following the rules because that’s what you aspire to be like but they’re not being tested we don’t want the same issue as cycling historically correct yeah sure okay great thank you what is a day or a week in the life look like for you in terms of training but also balancing that with your other life balance is the key word and I think that’s something that I do really well and something that I have as I have got older is something that I have got better and better at doing so we’re lra now we’re 70 minutes away from the Peak District I reckon I’m in the Peaks two three times a week and used to go sort of one midweek and one weekend but as trail running has grown and being outside in the mountains has got more and more popular I now avoid the weekend because but it’s it’s I feel bad about complaining that it’s so busy and it’s not that busy it’s not like being on on Oxford Street in London but it’s sometimes it feels that way I’ve got to say but it’s busier than maybe I would like it to be just I go midweek now uh 70-minute drive go up in the van take a dog if I want for me having a yeah 10 15 Mile training route that’s really easy to take off I think is I would much rather have that than have the most incredible 4-Hour run from the door because the 4H hour runs are few and far between yeah they happen a couple times a week but it’s the everyday stuff that’s the stuff that gains you the consistency and being able to run 20 mil a day two 10 MERS in a gym session that you don’t really have to think about it’s the non sexy behind the scenes stuff that Mak makes life easy and being at home in lro I’ve got yeah amazing gym set up physio all the support that I could need within 10 minutes Drive yeah which is incredible and that yes I need a drive to get to the big mountains or I need to go to a big training block before a UTMB or somewhere but that means I get to spend time with my friends and my family my wife at home our chickens and dogs and living a good life yeah exactly so yeah I think it’s for me balance is yeah it’s super important so yeah typical day wake up make coffee in the morning go straight into the gym with my coffee do 20 to 30 minutes of Mobility depending on what area feeling stiff and I’m not very good at not following a program so I’ve recently paid a small fortune to this app but it’s really annoyingly it’s really good so I do that typically have breakfast then so if my wife is swimming she’ll be back from back at about the same times have breakfast together then I’ll go do my first prop session of the day typically around 2 hours come back take the dogs out have some food and making a real conscious effort at the moment with food and just trying to eat as well as possible and making a real effort to be eating loads and loads of different basically variety it’s so easy being an athlete so people talk about doing meal prep but then you end up eating the same thing that’s what’s easy cuz that’s what’s really easy so yeah trying to get 30 different fruits and veg in a week which on the surface seems quite hard and daunting but then when you sort of get a little bit better and get a little bit better and you understand it a bit more or it then becomes super easy do you follow a particular diet no not really it’s just super periodized around training yeah uh as much food as possible as you get into it I imagine yeah to a certain extent but it’s really easy to manipulate your training with food so yeah macros wise fats and protein stay pretty similar the thing that fluctuates is carbohydrate if I’ve got a really easy day if I’ve got really two really easy days I won’t have none but I will massively reduce my carbohydrate intake but if I’ve because why would you don’t need it if you’re not using it but if I’ve got some sort of really intense days then I’ll use more carbohydrate so I was going to ask you mentioned Sophie Sophie cwell is your wife she is now Sophie Evans or she she is but still raced under okay yeah she’s a GB triathlete right so she is a very competitive athlete do you find that having someone who really understands your training regime and the yearly cycle of racing and training is very beneficial or do you just never see each other we’re pretty good at balancing things out and we make a huge effort and we are both prepared to make sacrifices to make it work for each other and I think we probably end up seeing each other more than if you were married to someone who work Monday to Friday 9: till 5:00 not from home because we probably have three meals with each other every day and we make the most of it and when we are together yeah we really we don’t take it for granted we really do make the most of it and yeah I think that understanding is really important in and around races that oh let’s just go out and see some friends oh well I’m racing in 3 days time it’s not oh well it’ll be really nice well I’ll just go it’s okay well let’s sort of bad down the hatches together and let’s really concentrate so I think having that understanding is brilliant I guess it can make it tough when if things are going really well for one of you and not so well for the other one it can be really tough but equally there’s that understanding that it’s not always going to be brilliant for both of us and that other person has had doubts and negativity and problems in their training or racing so yeah it’s that understanding yes it can be incredibly frustrating but I think it’s really it’s really healthy that we do different sports yeah I’m sure and you tried your Iron Man and you just like no more swimming exactly one one and done um so yeah for me that’s absolutely fun love that what is your craziest race or do you have any like crazy running stories not particularly crazy I think it’s by the nature of running itself like running is a should be a really simple easy thing to do oh yeah should so no nothing have you had any crazy hallucinations I know Courtney dealta talks all the time about saying Bears playing the cello in the woods and things like that to this day nothing maybe that’s because you’re so well trained on the like sleep deprivation side of things from the Army yeah I think in the military yes quite a lot of hallucinations on staying off and that’s horrendous but no with this I think like you’re just so prepared for it and I guess I I don’t really let my mind wander and I ne my mind never really wanders and I think that’s sort of typically when the hallucination start to happen I’ve also never ran for that long sure like 20 100 miles your longest race yeah 20 hours is a really long time but it’s not that long I’ve only missed a night of sleep yeah right it’s not as if yeah I’m not going out and doing 200 MERS or two nights like for me yeah Tim be is hard enough as it is let’s just do it as quick as possible fair speaking of what would be a dream race for you to do I’d really like to get UTMB 100% right and I think if that would be yeah that was for me that’s my next really big my next really big goal I like the races with a bit more history love the idea of hard rock um and I would absolutely love to go out to Hard Rock because yeah it just adds in a different it adds in a bit more complexity it adds in some different elements and yeah I think those races are pretty cool man versus horse do you know that one I do know that one um and that’s got great history years and years ago it used to be incredibly financially beneficial because the prize B just added up and added up and added up but that stopped yeah that’s true in recent years which is real probably the biggest biggest prize Po in tra run it probably was at a point but yeah I think like cool races like that and I I still race local races in the UK which I to say are you able to prioritize races that you do for fun or is it kind of more regimented now that you are very much Elite athlete no everything all Races serve a purpose whether it’s an opportunity to test something or it is just to have fun and like I love racing I would still train if I didn’t race but I love racing yeah racing is where I feel sort of brings the the hard days and all the dedication probably just trading on its own are isn’t really worth it for me I just love racing would you do ever do an attempt at an fkt or something like that yeah definitely and I’ve definitely got plans to Bob Graham rounds um it’s just finding the right time to do it and the right year and the right weather window and making sure that you do it properly and give it the respect that it needs rather than just rocking up and and trying to do it sure yeah we all know Bob Grim is pretty hard you can’t just wing it exactly have you ever considered the Barkley marathons yes I have I feel like I have a goodish understanding of how to apply it’s incredibly caky there are a certain type of people who Thrive around the sort of races that b clear is that is not the stage of the career stage of my career that I am at yet bureaucracy aside does the idea of it interest you I think it’s a I think it’s a really interesting concept because you are you’re testing you’re not racing against the clock you’re not racing against anything you are racing against yourself and and I think that’s a really really interesting element it’s almost irrelevant what anyone else does is just about you yeah and I think that’s really powerful and because it’s yeah it’s nice because you’re not becoming a slave to your data because you can’t you have to take every second as it is you’re making your own route up and there’s a lot of luck involved in it so yeah I it’s it is definitely on my list of things to do probably couple of years down the line but yeah I think it’s really cool amazing okay this this is a tough one and I’m really interested to hear your answer do you think that you tie selfworth into performance as a professional athlete I think it’s impossible to answer that question is no yeah like I think the saying of like you’re only as good as your last race and it’s so reflective when you come around as a professional athlete when you come around to resigning contracts or trying to sign contracts your worth is what you have done and what you have achieved I think I’m getting far better at being able to separate that performance from race and with everything else with social media the businesses that I run the boards of companies that I advise with that’s all performance B I do very little in my life that’s not revolved around performance sure then again I think one thing that’s really important to note and this is something that I mean I’m not a leag athlete but I still feel that same pressure I think it’s important to realize that your value is not just in performance but also in what you know what you’ve done what you understand which doesn’t change no matter whether your last race was a 35 minute 5K or wining UTMB it is still all up there yes to a certain extent and I think what I think I am worth my selfworth is probably different to what some other people is and sometimes it can be very nice process sometimes it can be a pretty horrendous process when you say ah this is my selfworth this is how much I think I’m worth yeah this is what I can give to you and actually someone says no you’re not you’re not worth anything like that or sometimes you’re surprised and they people do really see the value that you can add not just in your race performances yeah and sometimes you don’t see that yourself and then they come to you and they say oh I think you can offer this and you’re like what precisely so I think it’s yeah I think it’s would I say that I’m graded it no does it affect me probably on a daily basis yes but once you’ve had those bad or good races then or training sessions it’s done it’s finished and there’s a great saying of like don’t let the wins go to your head or the losses go to your heart and that’s something that I’ve really really tried to hone in on and yes celebrate the victories because as my dad would say which sounds incredibly negative every time he says it says make sure we celebrate it because it might not happen again but it’s so true it’s because you’ve got no idea I I might never win a big race again and if that’s I again I didn’t celebrate at all after Western States last year because my big goal was Western States as soon as I had finished that it was okay well now I want to do UTMB and it was as soon as you achieve what you want to achieve you then your parameters shift and you think oh well I need to do this now I think that’s the scourge of being an elite athlete unfortunately it is that mindset of okay what next exactly and it is it’s something that I think probably everyone needs to work on to an extent but that mindset is what makes people like you great like that is an issue but it’s the flip side of the same coin of of high performance yeah exactly um what advice would you give to someone just starting out with ultra running or wanting to go professional with it I think take things slow build up as much experience you can get in as many different race formats as you can and then don’t pigeon hole yourself don’t say oh the only races I’m going to do are 100K mountainous non-technical races try a bit of everything dabble in things because trail running isn’t like Road running you want to have a massive toolbox and you want to have skills of climbing descending technical non-technical fast slow uphill downhill grass Rock scree the more experience you can get the better and that’s only going to make you a better athlete I love that that’s brilliant advice for for the record what would you say that is your sweet spot of racing distance terrain Etc off previous results Western States I am trying to build that toolbox and make sure and try and give myself everything that I need to be able to perform at the highest level in all sorts of races amazing good answer thank you we’ve got a couple of quickfires what’s your go-to training shoe ad has TX a gravic speed Ultra nice what is your favorite time of day to train morning would you prefer hummus or guacamole guacamole what is your favorite postrace snack or meal uh it would be in Shaman at a uh at a burger hole in the wall that I can’t remember what it’s called and it will come back to me later it’s got a red say in the comments it’s got a red sign followed by a ice creaming sham from Shaman ice yes that’s so good isn’t it Poco Loco Burger is what it’s called po Loco very good I’ve been there it’s good and then one thing that makes you happy every day my wife so cute thank you so much for joining me here today I really really appreciate it and good luck with this year’s racing thank you very much