Manchester is RED | New role for Amad | Transfer latest | Fixture released

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Welcome to the Manchester is RED Podcast, the Manchester United podcast from the Manchester Evening News.

The twice-weekly show features Chief Manchester United writer Samuel Luckhurst, Senior Manchester United writer Rich Fay, Senior Football writer Tyrone Marshall and is typically hosted by Manchester United reporter Steven Railston.

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[Music] hello and welcome to the Manchester is red podcast my name is Steven realon and I’m your host today we’re recording this episode on a Tuesday Morning um and I’m joined finally by Samuel luur he’s been off for two weeks or so I believe I spoke to him yesterday he’s been away in the United States um Samuel it sounds like you had a very good enjoyable holiday but it was also slightly tyring as well it it was it it turned out I was in the um the same vicinity as as casemiro was on his holidays as well as he’s not in the the copper America and in in that mid-30s uh temperatures I I did feel like I was moving around a similar Pace to casemiro as well it was it was it was very draining very exhausting but also very very enjoyable um not not necessarily your usual holiday in terms of of relaxation but certainly very very active and um and and went went by very quickly as as holidays often do as well are you going to upload that photo you sent me wearing your Mickey Mouse merchandise from head to toe are you going are you going to keep no no I I I I will um that you know there’s there’s a reason why uh certain social media accounts are very much private and very very uh try to conceal them as best as possible and there’s a reason why I I’ve got if I thought it existed if I thought existed I’d kill it here but it doesn’t exist unfortunately I I can confirm I i’ I’ve never bought a pair of Mickey Mouse ear I I did have a I probably had a Mickey Mouse in fact I did have a Mickey Mouse hat when I was a kid and taken there by my by my parents but that must be if it’s not stowed away in the Attic it’s um it’s it’s May been some some collector’s merchandise that they’ve managed to get their hands on yeah you definitely allowed where Mickey Mouse is as a child we’ll get straight into the football and Samuel we both agreed to give you a chance to give you reaction to the Eric 10 hog news you were obviously away we expected the decision to be communicated quite swiftly after the FA Cup Final I think you worked for around a week after that game before you jetted off to the states for a welld deserved break um but it was a surprise how long it took really we got there in the end um United of back and hary will continue next season he will remain in charge what is your reaction to the process and the reaction to keep T up well it’s it’s strange and that it feels like tenh has ceased to be the story since the the FA Cup Final because he he held up his end of the bargain he oversaw a masterful performance uh it it’s all well and good winning an FA Cup Final and teams have won FA Cup finals before without performing or providing a memorable performance but United did they were they were brilliant uh we we’ve rapid IED about how terrific they were on the day and after that the story was well when are they going to communicate the decision and they they informed us I think early the following week two or three days later that it wouldn’t be imminent which I think was a bit of a surprise but really the shift was on that bank holiday Monday two days after the FA Cup final which I was I was fortunate to be working because it was quite quite busy and I mean I did the story that United were considering keeping ten hog and sometimes when you’re told something you you soften the actual copy because you don’t want to go too far in that you’re you’re kind of protecting you know you’re covering yourself you don’t want to you want to have a bit of wiggle room there but when I was told that specific information I thought that point that’s that’s a quite significant shift and I I I suspected at the time that they would would keep him but I was never going to write something as strong as they’re definitely keeping him we’ve already seen a story that was done of course before the F Cup Final that was promising he was going to get sacked and and that didn’t happen so that’s you know that’s some of the minui that we have to deal with um in the industry in terms of dealing with with those stories but just those developments on that bankal day Monday when was Kieran McKenna was had been sounded out by United and in the end he he decided to stay at ipswitch but I thought that development was prompted by United giving signals that they were likely to stick with ten hog and of course um with with McKenna sticking around IP witch it meant Chelsea had to look elsewhere as well so they went for moresa there was a theory that Chelsea had no idea if it’s true or not but it’s it’s certainly been doing um the rounds in in in our circles that Chelsea were apparently responsible for that story before the FA Cup Final because they wanted to disrupt United’s plans because of course Chelsea qualified for the Europa League United um that that was unconfirmed until the FA Cup Final and of course what happens is that United’s done City they NAB Chelsea’s place in the Europa League and relegate Chelsea to the Europa conference League that’s one of the theories doing the rounds but I’ve no idea if that’s true or not but that’s just another added subplot to those those days around the effort Cup Final around ten Hog’s future But after those working days um a week after the final I I found it very very strange that inos took was it 17 days in the end after the FA Cup Final to come to the conclusion that they would not sack a manager who they were planning on sacking in May and who I mean they sounded out four five six however many potential Replacements to come in and get him and now they’re they intend to give him a contract extension which just feels like a contradiction of the process they’ve gone through to keep him and tenh hard’s well within his rights to kind of aim a aim a few digs in here and there which it seems like he has done on Dutch television and as we all know when someone speaks in their mother tongue they they they’re always going to communicate a lot more uh colorfully a lot more cleanly and it seems like tenh har has done that speaking about ino’s decision making process and the fact that he confirmed that they they told him they spoken to tou call as well is is pretty extraordinary and I think inos in trying to banish uncertainty around the manager’s position they’ve actually created more un certainty and people at United acknowledge that there is still uncertainty orbe it until the contract extension is resolved but even when that’s resolved there’s there’s going to be a scenario going into next season where there are going to still be three or four quite prominent managers who have either been sounded out or linked with the United manager role who will be available and almost people look at them see they they’ll almost be looming like vultures around ten har on the off chance that United have a poor start to the season and and some of us were theorizing it wasn’t me it was it was a colleague who said that um and he said this before the FA Cup final he felt that they would probably keep ten hog just because Southgate wouldn’t be available until later on in the calendar year and then you’re looking at possibly an international break if things are still not improving to to make that managerial change which is is not beyond the Realms of possibility whether there is a contract extension or whether there there is but as I said when we spoke on the podcast a couple of weeks ago however long ago it was probably a little longer that the story had become inos and inos do look a little bit amateurish the way they’ve gone about this process and Tyrone was telling me he had been told that s Dave bford had contacted someone at a Premier League club asking them about how they went through their managerial process of of finding a replacement for someone who um who they’ sacked last season and you think if you’re needing to do that you I get it that they are learning on the job to an extent but they have been dealing with football clubs for quite some time nce and lo loan isn’t it the the Swiss side yeah and and yeah I get it that Manchester United are a different Beast Al together but there’s there’s still I’m still yet to see you know I’m still yet to hear or understand why these guys are the right people to be making the decisions at United I mean to Dave bford can talk he can use as many hand signals and hand gestures as he likes and use holistic language and use this rather you know meaningless phrase of high performance and talk about you know making the the first te section at Carrington more communal because it will let natural Li in and all this non me I don’t think they had any problems with that at the cliff when they won the trep 25 years ago and yes times have changed but in essence I think there’s there’s still a lot of a lot needed inos need to do a lot to convince Manchester United supporters and convince us that they know what they’re doing because this process it gives the opposite impression and to have required seven more than two weeks for a season review when braford attended the majority of games off from the Boxing Day game against Villa onwards and Jason Wilcox attended a fair few games after he came in I mean what were they doing were they just enjoying the prawn sandwiches um going from director’s box to director’s box in at Premier League grounds you they’re watching the games why why would they not compiling the evidence there and then so they could quickly move on to this season and I remember after um two years ago after the final day when of course United lost different circumstances United lost Crystal Palace in their final game ten hog of course was in the stands he’d been named their new manager about a month before that as well so the for planning was all all sorted there and of course the following day it was his press conference unveiling and John mer we spoke to him a little bit before the press conference started and he just said look we want to draw a line under under this season and move on to next season they did that very quickly very swiftly with these guys running the show now they were trying to extend United season well they did extend United season well into June and okay it might not cost them too much in terms of forward planning because they have decided to stick with the manager and of course tenh har will have been involved in plans for Recruitment and and who was who’s going to who’s going to leave the club as well from the plane Squad but going back to the original point the story it’s not become so much ten hog it’s become it’s become inos because essentially they’ve they’ve kept manager on the basis of one game and a 52 Game season and as brilliant as United’s effort Cup Final Triumph was and there was a lot of emotion around it that seems it seems like they’ve made an emotional partly an emotional decision also a decision because they just couldn’t get the candidate they wanted because kir McKenna decided to stay at IPS which Thomas Tu wasn’t going to get the budget he was going to have um or whatever other reason uh it’s it’s been a pretty cack-handed way of of going about it I mean if Ed Woodward had gone about this then he’d have got pelters and rightly so and it does remind me a little bit of Tottenham a few years ago when they sat Jose Mourinho and then they were scrambling around for a manager and and in the end made the wrong decision in going for Nuno spiritos Santo in United’s case they’ve scrambled around for a manager and in the end decided actually we’ll we’ll stick with our manager so that they will only be Vindicated if United have a very very good season next season and they have got the capabilities there to make that happen as I’ve said before I think there’s a nucleus of maybe six or seven players to build a very good team around if they get recruitment right if um the medical department is overhauled if they don’t have anywhere near as many injuries as they did last season if those right if if those adjustments are made and they get those tweaks right and they’ve got you as I said that you’ve got that those core players to build a team around I think there were some very good uh Squad players to depend on in that next batch maybe you know four or five of them and then you’ve got the academy um where they’ve just had a Triple Crown season and you would want or hope for a couple of them to make breakthroughs next season as well if if it’s all possible so I think they they have got the capabilities there to do well next season but there is also as as there always is with Manchester United there’s a lot of pressure attached to that and there’s even more pressure attached because of this process they’ve gone through where as I said they were planning on sacking a manager and then on the basis of one result they’ve decided not to sack him because let’s face it if they hadn’t have won the FA Cup there’s absolutely no way they would have kept him and we we’ve all seen the the footage I was there when Jim Ratcliffe walked past and he looked very unsettled when he was asked that question by the reporter about tenh har and then there was that fascinating footage that the fa captured on their YouTube channel which showed rat Ratcliffe looking for an alternative exit so he didn’t have to walk walk past us again and he didn’t him and brownford both dodged us STX Ferguson didn’t David guilded and abam Glazer didn’t and the fact that you’ve got AR Glazer who’s not afraid to he he won’t say anything to us but he’s not afraid to walk past the press and then you’ve got Ratcliffe who has spoken at Great length about what needs to happen and change at Manchester United there he was hiding from us effectively it’s not a particularly good look and in keeping with the way inos have gone about all this none of them fronted up to communicate the decision the timing of the decision it was gone 10 p.m. was it uh English time I think it was uh so qu past 10 that says it all as well and the IR is that you United in recent years they’ve become very sensitive to um and vexed by leaks even though Sir Alex Ferguson described the club as a si in one of his last interviews and leaks at football clubs in political parties in the entertainment industry wherever have happened since time in Memorial but there seems to be a particular Fascination around it with with United yet in your purportedly leaked bit to a favored outlet and the confirmation of tenh confirmation that tenh was staying was leaked by someone at Manchester United to a favored conduit so if I I don’t think they can really complain if there are more leaks and there will be more leaks next season as there always are when um reporters report them than arus said to Sig a new deal which was always probably going to be inevitable because he’s just got one year left on his contract it expires next summer if you’re going to back him you need to give a new contract because that would have just continued the uncertainty and the narrative around him would have dominated the start of next season um it’s going to be fascinating to see the actual terms I mean we’ll try to find out ourselves but it won’t be announced publicly of course the actual elements of that contract T AR has previously had a veto written in his deal and he’s previously said that certain power over transfers is a non-negotiable for him but it does feel like Samuel that he has to concede a certain amount of power now this new footballing structure is operating and he’s going to have to work under this new regime he made an appearance on Dutch TV as you spoke about in your first answer on Sunday night during England’s game um at the euros and he briefly discussed his contract so that is going to be really really interesting going forward to see how that unfolds it will be and that there may have to be compromises there I was told that the meeting he had with United officials in in IA was was positive and there’s genuine in Goodwill but they all there’s also acknowledgement that um all parties need to be on the same page and at the moment it doesn’t sound like they are of course inos want to change the role from manager to head coach clearly he’s not going to have as much Sway in the transfer market as he as he did in his first two summer transfer Windows everybody could tell from the first summer transer window that tenh was effectively dictating United’s policy and in some cases it I remember I think the scouts had pushed for pal Torres but ten hog wanted LeAndre Martinez I don’t think anybody would you dispute that a lot of people would dispute paying 100 million euros for for anony and okay tenar doesn’t doesn’t sign the checks doesn’t negotiate the fees but he should have known that that Anthony was not worth you know going going that far along the line in terms of a budget and whether there was an alternative should he have have suggested that how how does that how does that change now um who’s going to have the power Dan Ashworth is is you people if you Google his name I’m sure manchest United is one of the first results that comes up with it but he’s he’s not a Manchester United employee yet um Jason Wilcox spent last summer recruiting for a championship Club should he be spending this summer pulling rank over who Manchester United sign uh that’s something else to you I think that if if you’re from if you’re in ten Hog’s position that’s that’s an argument worth having um are you going to get a guy who who whose willhouse is in cycling to pull rank over over transfers no I don’t think you are uh so it’s of course I understand you know the intention to have this new structure and it’s it’s almost an easy get out for anyos if if things don’t go too well next season the where the structure hasn’t been completely done and completely um finalized that that is going to have a knock on effect I think rat Cliff has already said that hasn’t he he’s he’s complained about these talented people that they want to recruit but they have to set have a period of gardening leave and of course Omar bar officially doesn’t start work until next month he’s been working for a number of months unofficially in a in a United capacity I think he said something at the weekend as well in terms of transfer market dealings and it would be interesting to see how how it pans out under his under his watch if you believe Ash ashworth’s absence obviously Dan Ash’s still on Garden Le Sam if you believe his um fail yet to kind of join United officially he’s going to have that much of an impact on the season you just paid the money in Newcastle surely wouldn’t you if that’s going to be an excuse down the line I know the demands have been unrealistic and it’s frustrating to watch this develop the way it is but there is an element of that where I think United should just kind of pay the money and move on get Ashworth in place it would have been fantastic to have him in his role for the summer transfer window the first official window of vos’s time is corers I I get the I certainly get the logic to it I think from United’s perspective they they don’t want to look as though quite understandably that they’re overpaying for a sporting director who joined Newcastle for about 4 million pounds a couple of years ago and From newcastle’s perspective I completely understand it that if someone if a player was to move from Brighton to Newcastle and then he’s wanted by man united his you his his value uh it’s strange that we’re talking about that in in the context of a sporting director it is going to increase quite um qu quite drastically and United have been adant that they will not pay an 8 m an8 figure fee for for Ashworth and that was going back back to February four months ago and things really still feel like they’re at an impass there’s there’ve been very incremental updates on that um since it’s clear that Ashworth is not going to work for Newcastle again it’s clear that eventually he will probably his next role will be at at Man United and it’s it’s too late really for him to have an impact now if they were to just try and get him in this summer it’s it’s clearly not going to happen I think it’s it’s safe to say and recruitment planning it starts you know plans usually at United they’re finalized in January in terms of their targets and that does stack up I mean with Jared branway he he’s someone that they have been watching very closely and have’ been planning on making a move for for for several months and they’ve they’ve done that they they’ve not wasted much time in in making that move whether they sign him or not it remains to be seen but there’s a good chance that they will get him um and and clearly ten hog is is going to be on the same page as that I don’t think that’s a when you look at the profile of branway and the fact that United need Defenders I mean why why wouldn’t tenh har want him there’s a very good you very good chance that branway could be a very very good Defender over the next decade for for club and Country but where the chief executive is still on guard ging leave and and Jean claw Blanc who’s the interim chief executive at the moment he’s he’s seen I think he’s more of a marketing head rather than a um you know barard of course was the chief football operating Chief football Operating Officer I think wasn’t it at Manchester City so there is a difference there and I don’t think anyone’s pretending that jeanclaude Blanc is going to be kind of like doubling for for Dan Ashworth at this point and of course Jason wox has got this technical director the specifics of that United have have not communicated still and you know of course tenh har has said that he’s he’s had to develop you quite an intense relationship quite quickly with Will Cox because time is of the essence with the timing that will Cox has come in from Southampton but from what I was told the the the point man still on transfers is is Matt har Greaves who’s the the transfer negotiator who only started last year has got a good a good reputation um which is I think I wrote that back in in in September that he was looking to change the culture of United and I think there’s there’s a good chance that he he will still stick around even though there is there there’s uncertainty over a lot of people’s roles at the club for a myriad of reasons but he does feel like someone who is pretty well aligned with inos and given that he’s got that experience of the summer transfer window last year it’s logical that you’d want to kind of maintain that continuity for the time being now it may be different next year if if Ashworth is is in the building but also last summer you look at I mean the the hit rate from that summer transfer window it looks better after the FA Cup final but ultimately Mason Mount has got a lot of convincing to do um Andre N I do think will be better in his second season Rasmus hland had a good first season and I think he there’s a good chance he’ll score more goals in his second season but he his season did still end with him on the bench and and United deciding to play without a striker in their final three games their defining three games as well um sophan amrabat was a dad until the Arsenal home game and did tremendously well and I thought was phenomenal in the FA Cup Final Johnny Evans has been one of ten Hog’s most successful signings Sergio regon and is one of those players that I think people will forget he played for Man United in about a year’s time and outside B won’t forget yeah I thinkes on that I think Al will just be grateful that we’ve we’ve mentioned him on the on the podcast so it was it was a mixed transfer window to um to say the least but maybe in a year’s time after some of those players have had a second season at United it would look a it would look like a more positive transfer window I don’t think I think I told the story about waiting in the brenford mixone was that in April I think it was in April wasn’t it down at the Gtech Stadium March last week March yeah there you go so it all Blends into one but obviously as I was standing in the mix Zone and the players were were leaving the ground and Sergio regon K walson through and he had a gacho shirt around his back and a a goodie bag full of United goodies and shirts and whatnot and merchandise and the brenford security guard just laughed as he walked through because R Yar had been recalled at that point and he joined brenford on lawn he was a brenford player and the brenford security guard laughed him was saying wasn’t he just at United for a few months it’s quite bizarre to see him with that much United stuff leaving the ground as a brenford player and lastly then Samuel just end on this part look you mentioned it yourself with Leandra martinz back Luke Shaw back to Fitness who are huge for how tag wants to play they’re really really crucial and hopefully with the injuries as a thing of the past and the medical team improved United have the tools to enjoy a much improved season and it could be a really positive year especially if to make a a strong start of the campaign I I I genuinely think that I mean that was the the last piece I wrote before I went holiday about the the potential of of the team for for the manager whether it was ten hog or whether it was going to be a new manager and you did see that to an extent on the in the Cup Final um I mean some people might see it as as a one-off that game and that that game was not in keeping with United season it was their it was their best performance of of ten Hog’s Reign never mind last season and the way they played was was not in keeping with the majority of their their performances in terms of how compact they were how intense they were their game management as well game management was Dreadful last season the amount of late goals they conceded in in the final 10 minutes or an added time um you know there was a bit of drama in the Cup Final of course with Ana’s mistake for dcu’s goal but even after that they managed to get really well with um holand providing that focal point and winning that foul late on which you know bit similar to Harry Kane’s performance I thought in the second half the other night for England in terms of taking the sting out of the game which is what you need a striker to do uh from time to time so you know when when we talk about having every player fit that that is a rarity in football and I think ten hard you he was quite selective at times he’d say oh I don’t have the players but then he’d say oh it’s more than 11 players you need a squad and that was one of the arguments I felt that was you know that that undermined him and that he would he would say that I didn’t have these players but it was still very much his Squad they’d spent more than 400 million pounds on bringing players in and strengthen that Squad and it was very much a squad in In His Image so it was on him if he was unable to find Solutions when players Defenders were dropping like flies or um you know casemiro was injured all that time and amrabat barely played amrabat went nearly five months without a premier league star and when he was recalled I think we all wondered well why why didn’t you just play him I mean you play him as a defensive midfielder and he he didn’t play there very often even before he came in for that Arsenal game because he was having stins at left back and um it felt like it was it been a long time since he played and he’s in the actual role that he was bought to um to occupy and I’m not for a minute even suggesting now that they should just sign amra back permanently I’m sure there are a lot of people who think they should but that would be that would be a kneejerk I mean you’re basing that on what three three performances probably the Arsenal Newcastle and City Games in in May which is a hell of a trio of of good performance is to submit as evidence to to Manchester United to if if you am about to say you know sign me for this but that’s that’s one month it’s it’s a season over nine months and I suppose if the way the way inos have operated they they have essentially judged United on one month rather than nine months which um is very peculiar given all their their talk about high performance and all this I mean there is a lot of jargon in in life these days and um you know Dave braford is responsible for a lot of that and and some of the you some of the people who work with him at Team Sky have have not spoken um particularly flatteringly about it since they’ve parted ways with him but going back to whether the United have the tools to do well next season I I do think there’s potential there I mean they they underachieved last season they finished eighth and they lost 19 of their 52 games and theyve got the wood and spoon in their Champions League group that that was a colossal underachievement and I’m always of the opinion that man United should be judged on their Premier League season first and foremost and secondly their if they’re in the Champions League their Champions League campaign and both were colossal failures and there’s only one you know the main reason is that tenh is still in charge is because of the FA Cup win and of course trophies absolutely matter I don’t think inos have looked at the bigger picture I think inos have you they’ve as I’ve said they they were sounding Out alternatives to replace him and in the end they’ve just decided because of all the circumstances um to to keep the manag and give him a contract extension which I I don’t think is the right I know you said that it would be logical to do it I’m not necessarily sure about that in the ultimately if if Manchester United’s aspiration has to be to win the Premier League title Ratcliff has already said that’s a long shot for next season if if they do win it it’s it’s a hell of a story and there’ll be books written about it no doubt but I don’t think anybody’s got United down as title challenges for next season if they get back into the champions league for the season after that you’re under a manager whose record in the Champions League is actually quite poor it’s gone out the group stage three times it’s lost the last 16 tied to Benfica when Ajax were favorites the exception the anomaly of course was that captivating run Ajax had when they knocked out Real Madrid and Juventus and they were Lucas MOA kick away from getting to the Champions League final but are you giving a guy a contract and again I know United as a Champions League side overrated is probably the wrong word but certainly overplayed in terms of their association with that competition I mean you compare United’s trophy Hall in the European Cup with real madrids and United Once Upon a Time and some may still be of the opinion that they’re the biggest club in the world they’re not real Madrid are Real Madrid have won five times as many European cups as Manchester United if you want to get to a level where you’re competing to do something in the European Cup again you’re not going to get a shot next season you may get a shot the season after that but is this the manager to to back with it given his record in the Champions League maybe that would change if ten har is still in charge at that point but again I I think whe you know the contract extension will clearly happen but I don’t think it will NE necessarily banish the uncertainty that will still linger with ten Hog’s position just because of this process inor have gone through that’s that’s not ten Hog’s fault whatsoever that’s that’s all on inos and Jose Mourinho signed a new contract with Manchester United in January 2018 you sacked in December 2018 the new contract is an effort to kind of end the narrative isn’t it of uncertainty but there will still be uncertainty if they start the season poorly however Samuel I believe they are going to win the Premier League title actually because of s brills for marginal gains anything is possible with marginal gains on your side I’ve started implementing my life JY bags possibly hopefully not I could deal with some of them I think as well my runs we’ll leave it there for part one be back in a moment for part two [Music] welcome back to part two of the Manchester is red podcast we’ll fly through some transo bits in this part before looking ahead uh to the Premier League fiction list which was revealed or announced on Tuesday morning at 9:00 a.m and but first of all Samuel we’ll get we’ll just start by talking about Jared Bram for at United had an opening bid rejected for the evident Defender around 30 uh 5 million and including add-ons we can discussed a few podcasts um before you went away but what his value would be evident value in between 70 and 80 and you suggested well of course they’re going to say that all right and then perhaps United and evident could be in the middle because everan aren’t exactly um Rich other they’re struggling for money they’re cash strapped so what what kind of fee is good enough for Branford what what is he actually worth I’m thinking maybe 55 million add-ons I think that would be fair but evid are going to hold tough United are going to kind of low ball as to have them with their opening bid and it’s going to be fascinating to see whether they can sell on I I agree with you in terms of a realistic valuation there for him it will be I think the clubs have got to to meet in the middle there and yeah it’s it’s just it’s it’s not it’s not the most um it’s not the most exting discussion for a podcast yeah exactly but it is high on the agenda though isn’t it I mean it is yeah BR is a a huge Target he’s the the first player that made a bid for um that we know of anyways this summer transfer window and he could be in quite early could be their first siging of the summer I think the kind of like the the interesting parallels there is that obviously because of his his age his style and the club he’s he’s playing for he’s he’s likened and even his frame to an extent he is a little bit like Jon stones and he’s a ball playing Center back and they talk how how good he is with both feet as well and and really United needs someone who’s going to be more predominantly right footed to go in there with with with Martinez and if you’re spending I mean in terms of the fee that branth R would would command you’re looking at and and his age you’re looking at him as being the probably the starting center back with with martinez I know it doesn’t always necessarily work out as um um it doesn’t always go as it would appear on paper shall we say and there were times where a player will have to come out of the team or they have to adapt and and that’s why given Maguire had a good season last season and probably won’t be sold just because I’m not too sure there’ll be a market for him in the summer and he’s going to have a preseason with United because he’s missing the European Championship it’s it’s good to have him around and I think he can be a pretty good Mentor for for branway as well it’s you know Changing of the Guard is is maybe a bit bit of a stretch there as Maguire although he played a lot last season I don’t think anybody still looks at him as a Manchester United first teamer but that was the problem last season there weren’t many starting center backs who really attained that first team status on on a long-term basis because of of the injury issues in the squad I mean ironically the the one who probably had the longest run was was Varan and um he’s he’s been released he’s played his last game for United Maguire had very good spells in in the team as as we discussed and he was on course to start the FA Cup Final until he got injured and as as we said he he conducted himself really well last season given the um pretty bleak starting point and some of the stick he got in during preseason which really came to a head in in Dublin where it was some of the some of the stick he got and the grief he got from some of the clownish fans over there was was really really uncalled for and fair play to him he ended that game get an assist for for kundo pelist and then he went on to have a good season and I would like to think that he won’t be getting booed on preseason um this summer when when United play in Norway and Scotland and and the states but with with branway that there would have to be a period of adjustment and I think with the going back to the stones comparison when Stones was at Everton I think it was it was almost seen that oh he’ll he’ll end up at man united just because if there’s a good young player at Everton as we saw with Wayne Rooney they the the belief is that they’ll end up at man united Ross Barkley was linked with United a hell of a lot um when when he was making waves at Everton as well and when with with stones when he ended up at City it was it was mainly because Guardiola came in I think if Guardiola doesn’t go to Manchester City I don’t think City Sign JN Stone and Stones was still he did go I think he was in the Euro 2016 Squad but he was seen as a bit of a running joke at the time because he was this Defender who wanted to wanted to dribble with the ball and wanted to play the ball out but couldn’t seem to defend and now eight years down the line he is he is one of the most successful English Center backs uh that there’s ever been in terms of the heights he’s reached he he has attained that world class status he’s won everything with with Manchester City he’s had an exceptional career he’s been part of a very good England team as well I mean I I don’t think it’s a stretch to say he he’s possibly going to be categorized as one of England’s greatest ever center backs just because of his Club career and and his contributions to England in in some of their some of their best tournaments and I know he was Rusty the other night but he’s he’s been on well hasn’t he he’s he’s been injured so I don’t think you’re going to judge him on one one ify iffy performance against Serbia but it felt like that summer when City signed stones and United signed ER baay who was very good in his first season but the way United are thinking now in terms of signing center backs it there’s there’s definitely a shift there and it changed a little bit with I mean baay was was pretty good on the ball he was better than people G excuse me people gave him credit for and then the following year they signed Lindelof who was a very un Mourinho Center back um and I think maybe in hindsight Mourinho regrets going for Lindelof and he’ have maybe wanted someone a bit more robust but Lindelof is still spent seven years at United U Harry MaGuire you look at his frame and he almost looks like a rugby player but he’s very very good on the ball and he’s had five years at United now um Varan everybody knew about his reputation Leandro martinz less so but he’s another ball play center back and the way United going about selecting Defenders now it’s it’s playing on the front foot and that was ten Hog’s bug bear last season with Shaw and marz being out he felt that compromised the way United played in that they had they their defense was naturally deeper because they couldn’t get higher up the pitch and of course that also compromised the way they could use Andre Nana’s distribution as well at times and we saw what a difference Martinez and Varan as a partnership made in the FA Cup Final and and Martinez it’s it’s a Pity that he has played only a handful of games for United over the last year because he he has been probably in terms of the whole package he has been tenh hard’s most successful signing but he’s not played enough and he he needs to have a really fulfilling season and he needs to be a lot fitter and a lot more available and some of the injuries he’s had have been freakish and of course they you clearly the first round of surgery on his metat tarle was botched and tenan Har rushed him back albeit in in invidious circumstances against brenford when Varan and lindoff both went off injured so he was he was forced to turn to Martinez and then he got injured in training a few days later that the injury against was it Vladimir kual of West Ham that was unfortunate as well but ultimately he’s he’s been quite injury-prone over a 12 or 13 month period now but he’s he’s such a good player and nobody’s spoken about his height since probably brenford away in in August 2022 he’s he’s his impact on the team has been that that significant and the United fans adore him the players clearly adore him ten hard clearly adors him as well and um from from the Press Box perspective you I’ve spoken to him a couple of times and as as aggressive as he is he’s actually a very softly spoken very Charming lad to to speak to as well he’s I thought the night before the FA Cup fining ter you I felt a bit more bullish about United’s chances and it was because they had you looked at the team that was probably going to play and you thought that they were players that you’d want on your team and of course Martinez is is a player that if you if you’re in the lineup and you look down the line you see that he’s on your team you’re thinking I’m really really glad that he’s there and so he’s going to have a huge impact on on the start the new starting center half who comes into the team next season of course United want that to be branway and it is interesting how there’s been a recalibration in English football about how we view cacks now it’s not it’s not just you signing a lump who’s going to be blocking the ball who’s who’s robust who’s you a good shield for for the goalkeeper it’s someone who is actually going to carry the ball a fairway from the goalkeeper as well and move into Midfield football is is ever evolving and and Guardiola is is is the main Pioneer of that we’ve we’ve seen that with stones and how he stepped into Midfield and I’m sure United have similar aspirations for for branway possibly we’ve seen how how Dogo do added strings to his bow last season making those runs where he was effectively you cropping up as the striker and it it came off with his goal against Brighton on the final day of The League season and the the days I think David Moy said it in his column the Sunday Times at the weekend you you put a lineup in on paper now and most teams it’s it’s just there on paper in the when the game starts out of possession it’s a different formation with the ball it’s a different formation when they’re pressing it’s a different formation and United have been very very very slow in evolving like that and hopefully for their sake now they’ll they’ll actually you know get quicker to it and someone like bran th who’s a very modern Center back that that would only help them I think the reason that brought up is feet again because it’s a bit of a boring discussion is number one personal terms aren’t going to be a problem they really are when United are involved in in transfers and as well the club have famously overpaid in the past I do feel like Edward’s mistakes still kind of Haunting the club in the market and they probably will continue to do so in the next few years I think it’s going to take a little bit of time for J ratcliff’s regime to kind of distance themselves from those mistakes and go look we’re not going to pay those fees and if that’s what you demand him we’ll walk away from the deal and look at other targets because unfortunately at a certain point in negotiations that’s what you have to do if if the fee gets too high and it prevents s like Anthony for for 86 million which was obviously a big mistake um some Of You’ have written the line on Mason Greenwood and jayen Sancho and a brief update on them to do you want to just expand on them well those two are players at United are more than happy to um I think it’s safe to say actively push out because that neither have any future at the club and and rightly so for very different reasons and the confirmation that ten hog was staying that that ended any lingering possibility of of sancho at getting a kick for United again I think there was a report regarding the the the the meeting unit had with Thomas tle that apparently tul wanted to reintegrate Sancho into the squad and I I thought T was probably the most suitable guy to come in and replace ten hog but that that would have been that should have been a red flag I know tle he’d have probably managed Sancho wouldn’t he at Dortmund I think he was at Dortmund at that time um in 2017 so of course there’s there’s a relationship there but some things have to be taken out of the manager hands and and and that is is one of them had they gone down the line with with tal um you know ten hog was completely correct and the way he dealt with Sancho I mean I was I found it that quote that juren klopp came up with when he was on his long goodby at Liverpool about the way United dealt with Sancho I mean even Benny McCarthy didn’t really help himself when he gave that interview and he he ignored the key fact that Sancho had accused his manager of of lying and that’s why he was banished he wasn’t banished because he’d been crap in training um I think that if he’d you if he hadn’t have put that post on on his social media site then then there’s a chance that he he’d still have a fut future at United but it’s amazing how things can change because of course you know after the Champions League semi-final uh Sancho was effectively doing a Victory lap on social media because Dortmund had reached the final and he played very well in the first leg of the of the semi-final against PSG come the final at Wembley and he he was a ghost again I thought particularly in in the second half I I forgot that he was still on the pitch and I thought well you know this is history repeating itself because he was Anonymous in the in the FA Cup Final uh almost a pretty much a year to the day earlier and and that’s that’s kind of sancho that’s his mentality um I I’ve I’ve said before he he has not got the mentality to to be as to succeed at Manchester United he just hasn’t and it’s completely logical that given reasonably the reasonably successful spell that he had at Dortmund in the second half of last season it’s completely logical that they want to cash in now and tenh said that press conferences towards end of the season that players values were increasing and he said that specifically about sanjo and 30 million I don’t think United would accept anything lower than that because of the PSR rules and the need to get get Revenue in from from sales but of course they they see him as a little bit higher because Dortmund have just reached the Champions League final but as ten hog also noted Dortmund um they they didn’t actually have that good a season they they’ve not qualified for the Champions League next season have they because they they finished fifth or sixth in the bundes Lea so as I said there was a there was a lot of you know there was the Victory lap after they got to the final and that was a very creditable achievement but in the end Sancho it didn’t really end on a successful note for him and the way United are gearing up for the future with ten ha staying and you’ve got garnacho on the left wing you’ve got the need for new forward to come in Ahmad is a more integral player now as well after a good encouraging running of course Jane Sancho should be sold he should be sold just because he he accused tenh har of Lon and the way he he reacted over that but from what I was told yesterday with with Mason Greenwood his probable departure is at a more advanced stage um in terms of discussions I’m not too sure specifically which club but I I don’t think the way it’s from what United um believe could happen there it sounds like that he will he will head abroad which you know he’s he he did that last season with hfe where he spent a season on loan there and it’s probably in his best interests given the last um what’s what’s gone on in in his life over the last two and a half years someone’s got to take a punt on Sancho for 30 million pounds as you just I think there’s a lot of upside there if he can click although I’ve been seeing that for the last three years and he hasn’t clicked the United so me to be seing whether he can actually return to those levels that he showed for dortman so regularly during his first in at the club um you mentioned klopp there Samuel should we discuss the player briefly who spoiled Jurgen klopp’s farewell season Ahmad with that goal in the FA Cup quarterfinal Al Trafford what a goal that was and be set for a more prominent role in the first team next season I mean very disappointing I mean I say very disappointing he was injured for the first half of last season then he came back to Fitness in December but he didn’t really play in January or February wasn’t really given the opportunities we hope he we’d be given finally towards the end of the the year finally got some momentum it’s performance against Arsenal was excellent you got a goal and an assist against Newcastle in that 3-2 win in the final home game of the season um he obviously didn’t feature in the FA Cup final but it was some really promising signings from Amed toward the latter part of the year and he does deserve that role into the new season doesn’t he I would argue yes I I completely agree um I mean ten hog kept saying you know he was injured the first half of the season and he was he missed five months but he still took way too long to actually start him he didn’t his his first meaningful start for United was against arsel and may as his three previous starts which were under oan Sol and Ralph rannik though in heavily rotated teams and all three of those games came in 2021 so it was a it was a long time coming but he was good against Arsenal he was even better against Newcastle he was okay against Brighton I think he came off in the second half of that one but given his his form at the time and certainly compared with amrabat as well who enjoyed a similar similarly good run of form he was slightly unfortunate at start of the FA Cup Final I think ten hog was ten hog of course he was right he got everything pretty much everything right that day but I think when we were discussing it pre-match the prospect of pitting Amad against vardal would have been would have been a bit of a stretch and they got it right with with garnacho starting on the right which in itself was was an interesting move given that garnacho played predominantly on on the left wing last season but it’s I’m pleased for Amma because when Amari forson was starting ahead of him against Fulham and when Anthony started ahead of him countless occasions it it must have demoralized him and I think it did I mean he was there was that passive aggressive social media post I know he he tried suggest it it wasn’t related to that but I think it clearly was and it could easily have disheartened him because Mari forson I I just don’t get what tenar saw in him I know sometimes there are managers who see something in a play that nobody else can see and it pays off I mean Mourinho with Scott momy is probably the best example of that um at the opposite end of the of the spectrum Louis vanal bringing in Paddy McNair and Tyler blacket didn’t really um pay off that both of them just did very well to actually play for Manchester United I I’d have said that of momy as well but my goodness what a good job he’s done in terms of forging a a successful career at the club and with Amari forson he had some exposure on pre-season um under tenh but I I never got the sense that he was remotely ready or looked looked particularly settled playing first team football I think he did all right actually when he came on in the it was the FA Cup quarterfinal against sorry the the semi-final against centry um not that that was ever going to get much coverage given the the rather faral nature towards the end of that game U but again like when United released their um their released list they didn’t use the word released um in in copy whatsoever was referred to as retained list and look don’t don’t worry about offending anyone if they say that Amari fors and shol shter have been released it it looks weaker to have said that you’ve actually offered those players who have who have and had absolutely no future at United new contracts they shouldn’t have been getting new contracts um just just take the the compensation fee that they’ll get from what whichever Club signed shti and and from Monza who’ve already signed forson forson as well was there was some noise about him around him when he was in the academy that he could leave United for Arsenal I think it was maybe four years ago didn’t TR didn’t happen of course but ultimately I don’t think United are going to be looking at him and ruin the day that that he left for for Monza and for ammad to have overcome that setback and I remember that that filam defeat as well I mean ammad came on in the second half and did quite well and whenever he was introduced in games as a substitute United were either losing or drawing and I I think we said well you know maybe start him and you you’ll be winning and okay it didn’t happen against Arsenal but it certainly was the case against Newcastle he scored a tremendous goal he assured of Colt status with that Unforgettable winning winning FA Cup quarterfinals goal against Liverpool as well but he he just he fits in with the way United play he’s an exciting player he’s he’s a right- Winger he’s i’ I’d say he’s probably their most natural and um and best right winger as well on his day in terms of the attributes he has I’d rather have him in the team over Anthony and he’s at a good age he’s still only 21 they’ve made quite the investment in him rising to 37 million pounds that deal was done nearly four years ago so it’s they’ve taken their time getting there and and I get that he was always going to need one or two loans and the Sunland loan went really well the Rangers loan did not go so well and I think in his um in his first his first four season they were looking to send him out on loan to finard but he got injured so he’s had a couple of injury setbacks he’s had one bad loan but he’s had one good loan and this calendar year has been very encouraging for him um I’m not too sure what his circumstances are with the Ivory Coast National Team because he wasn’t included in that Squad recently and he was wasn’t in the afcon squad but he’s been named in 22 of the last 25 United match day squads he’s had good impacts whenever almost whenever he’s been on the pitch and you the supporters really enjoy seeing seeing him come on in games or starting games and I think it’s a bonus for United that he’ll be available for the entirety of preseason because he was yeah he was start you know he looked like he could have a good preseason last season that he started those first couple of games and of course you you saw him in Edinburgh against leyon and then unfortunately he got injured against Arsenal in New Jersey and we we saw him leaving on on crutches and then he didn’t play again until until late December against Forest so that that was a a setb but he he should have started far sooner than than May the 12th it would have been I think against Arsenal but at least at least belatedly they’ve recognized there’s a really good talent there who’s who’s worth investing in in that sense of you know giving him a big role in the squad and certainly next season if if he’s in a match day Squad whether it’s as a starter or as a substitute it’s it’s the United attack is better off for having him there onwards and upwards fad I’m looking forward to seeing more of them in the new season and you’re right completely right about Mari forson his move to m is actually really interesting I mean he looked really raw and inexperience when he started against Fulham in February came on didn’t he within 10 minutes and he flew into that challenge that he was a lucky to v a yellow card for but I mean Lono just got promoted to Syria for the first time two years ago they finished in mid-table for successive seasons so it’s going to be interesting to see how he fares out there a really kind of bizarre move is that unfair to describe it as that an interesting move um I think he’ll um he won’t struggle to get a Ferrari will he um which which is is is one would be one perk of um of moving to Monza and the weather’s nicer as well and Milan isn’t a bad City to be next to Eva I must admit it’s a lovely place to visit um picture list briefly because it’s been a long podcast United have fullam on the opening day Friday night fixture Samuel that’s a r tree isn’t it should be atmosphere for United fans to to head along the all Trafford on Friday night um that’s followed by Brighton away at the MX Liverpool at home the third game of the season Southampton away and Crystal Palace away so they’re the open five games we’re not going to get into every single match um that Liverpool game stands out just straight away though doesn’t it jumps off the paper that is huge if you United can get a win that’ll be huge for ten hog especially against the Liverpool side who have just got rid of UR klopp and gone into a new era yeah of course it’s the the matchup of the two Dutch coaches and they’ll have met by then given there’s the friendly in South Carolina which is is also in August on August the 3 in in the states it’ll be technically it’ll be August the 4th in English time I think but uh so ten hog and slot on slot will be coming up against each other twice you know within the space of something like 20 28 days whatever it is but um you know in terms of you know I think when we look at it we look at it quite selfishly and we look at it and we see September and there are backtack away games at Southampton and Crystal Palace having had the uh the long Journeys toh to end the the previous season we I’ve got please please break it up a little bit that that’s what I was looking towards the end of the season it was like I’m at a when Play Bright so I was actually quite happy about that that’s Bank H weekend at the August 24th that’s isn’t it yeah I was quite happy about the timing of it because um they always seem to play Brighton in May or August and um that that’s been that’s been maintained and obviously it’s always you know the weather’s quite nice down there as we discovered in May so that’s that’s that’s one of the perks of that but um I see again they’ve got brenford and Chelsea as back toback ways this time in May but yeah it’s that they’re still trying to give us PTSD from some of those those trips down there I think we uh was it when we were leaving where when were we Le might have been leaving the Chelsea game we did we drive past the brenford stadium I think I drove past that brenford Stadium on three occasions rather than just the the two occasions and yeah that that was um the long long old days but but certainly days we look back on quite wistfully but yes it’s it I think you I was getting messages this morning from supporters um I mean I think the the fixtures actually leaked a friend actually we we of course get them in advance for publishing purposes but a friend uh already had the PDF as well so fans can um plan in Earnest it would have been a lot more helpful had they actually G given all the August fixtures specific dates and times I still think that the Premier League have got a lot of work to do in terms of giving supporters advanced notice of um confirmed you know final dates with with games but at least we’ve you that first one it’s it’s a it’s the earliest possible point is it on a on a Friday night being the purest I’d have I’d have liked it to have been a Saturday 3 p.m. and I certainly think United Fulham is more of a Saturday 3pm slot rather than a Friday night slot but United are you they’re almost always the biggest story in town and they’re the biggest pool on on TV as well I remember weirdly back in high school and gaing around like the change room around someone’s phone who had um some data I’m not I’m not as young as I might seem um and just being so interested to see which which fixes were getting released who who everyone was playing and when but as you get all that it doesn’t really make a difference does it it’s a bit of a boring deal F no you kind of I think I think you you look at what I mean Christmas time obviously it affects you and me in particular as we’ve got you’ve got your family in the Northeast I’ve got my family in the Southeast as well so that obviously you tend to try and do a bit of forward planning around that occasionally the odd birthday here and there and and then really it’s just the the big games when of the Derby what’s the first game of the season what’s the last game of the season so um I suppose that’s you know most people Pro probably look at it that way but then you’ve got the hardcore contingent who will be looking to do as many games as humanly possible and um and of course that that some of those games can already be filed down as as Sunday matches because of the uh because of the Europa League schedule that that United have got so we’ve we’re back to it’s a season of Thursday Thursday Sunday games quite possibly we I I wait with baited breath to see what the uh the four away games because it’s four away games now isn’t it that um United have got in this this new bloody system but some unique we can only Embrace interesting places yeah yeah exactly thanks your time Samu it’s nice to have you back thank you very much St very kind of you and thanks to listen us we’ll speak to you later in the week byebye [Music]