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Welcome Consciousness Explorers!
Tuesday, May 28th, 2024, tune-in at 2pm EST/7pm GMT on Rumble and Youtube for the Talking Stick Show! Our host Dale Tobin from Symmetry of Health will be joined by his co-host Laura Massey from Two Feathers Medicine, Amy Kruzic from UCM, and Andrew Bartzis the Galactic Historian. As well as special guests Michele Meiners from the Paranormal Rangers and Deborah Hatswell from Being Believed Research & Investigations for a special show on the paranormal!
Michele Meiners, a Native American journalist, has an ancestral background in three Native American Nations: Navajo, Chippewa, and Pawnee. With a profound dedication to investigating Native American culture and its correlation with extraordinary occurrences in the Uinta Basin, she has spent the past six years honing her expertise in the field. Meiners has been featured on TV shows like the Weather Channel’s “Uncharted Adventure”, and collaborated with notable productions including “Blindfrog Ranch.” She is now partnering with the Paranormal Rangers Jon Dover and Stan Milford Jr. Benefitting from Meiners’ distinctive perspective and exceptional investigative skills., they will unravel the enigmatic world of the paranormal.
https://welcome.theparanormalrangers.com/michele-meiners
Deborah Hatswell is an Investigator & Researcher of the strange and unexplained. A witness to a Cryptid Creature herself in 1982 Deborah set out to find other people who had seen and experienced the impossible. Over 40 years later Deborah is a self taught Parapsychologist and is a leading expert in the fields of Cryptozoology, The Unknown and The Paranormal. Investigating cases of Bigfoot, Dogmen, UFO, Alien, Abductions, The Supernatural, Entity/Attachment, Hauntings, Unsolved Mysteries and all manner of Phenomena giving her a unique skill set.
Please share your comments and questions! Be sure to subscribe to the Galactic Historian in the live chat for $5 a month on Rumble (click Subscribe in the live chat)! We will field questions from chat supporters!
ALSO: catch Andrew Bartzis with Dale Tobin and Laura Massey on the Talking Stick Show on Tuesdays at 11AM PST/2PM GMT/7PM GMT! Adventures Into Reality will air on Thursdays @ 4PM PST/7PM EST – only on Rumble! And stayed tuned for new Unascended Masters Shows with Andrew, Dale, & Laura!
Our weekend line-up includes gaming with Andrew Bartzis in World of Warcraft for Friday Night Fight Club at 5pm PST/8pm EST only on Rumble! Followed by select replays of Adventures Into Reality throughout the weekend!
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Enjoy a montage of footage from the tour as well! https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLMNO_ps0CHd5tcm4dnLqgft5ZBU294A8P
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https://www.youtube.com/@DALE Tobin-Symmetry Of Health-TwoFeathersMedicine
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And check out Andrew’s episode on Gaia!
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https://www.youtube.com/@Galactichistorian
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#ufo #bigfoot #parnormal #hauntings
[Music] [Music] announcement we are open to have private sessions I am opening new dates on my schedule we have a brand new automated booking system no more long waits for confirming the booking that’s right everyone automated booking system is here put Andrew bart.com I look forward to seeing you in a private session [Music] [Music] no oh no [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] oh no oh no oh no oh oh no oh no oh no oh no oh oh no [Music] oh [Music] oh [Music] [Music] hello hello everyone and welcome to this week’s talk so I’d like to firstly welcome my mysterious co-host I have Laura Massie hi everybody hi guys and we have the great Amy cruik hey everybody and we have the mysterious Andrew Bart is on the show hello Andrew meow meow meow meow meow meow and we’d like to welcome back this week we have de Deborah hatswell back onto the show hello Deborah hi guys hello and welcome back last week we discussed Bigfoot and this week we’re going to be talking about the Paranormal the hauntings and UFO as well so firstly Deborah would you like to introduce yourself for those people who are not familiar for what you do just a bit about yourself I’m um my name’s Je hatwell and I live in the northwest of England in the UK I’m a crypted and Paranormal Investigator but I kind of do it in a different way I don’t go into areas and and prove that there’s a haunting I work with the witness themselves with any trauma that they have around those events and it could be something that happened when they were a child or something that’s happening currently and I work with them to try and put the tools in their hands so they can kind of go forward with it themselves so I think over the years I’ve investigated about 4,000 cases and is anything ever surprised you like holy [ __ ] or is it every day a surprise moment holy [ __ ] holy [ __ ] yeah yeah but the the the the video that I sent over earlier to to Laura that all that almost well it just kind of just turns into a hand I’ve never seen anything like that I’ve seen lots of normal videos don’t get me wrong I got sent thousands of them but this was Standalone um and I did everything I could to debunk it because I thought there’s no way this is real this I don’t know they’ve done it but it’s it’s not been messed with it’s absolutely I would say perfect really and it came about by accident as sued your your best cases year if you get what I mean um if I can tell you about the case if you want it’s uh go ahead yeah it’s if we go to the Lincolnshire Coastline and we head for a very small village called Sutton Bridge there are two rivers that meet at the estery one being the river nen and one being the river us um and there’s one house that stands out there alone and it’s been there since the 1830s um and it was originally built by the pets family so the lane is named after so forward to to March of this year and a lady called Chrissy reaches out to me and she’s the mom at the house now she’s had ongoing activity there since the day she put her foot through the door 23 years ago but she it’s like one of those situations where it felt like a an Old owner or a land owner that was just not happy what with what was going on kind of thing so she got a team in a team actually came in in 2020 um and it kind of ramped things up a little to the point where one of the male investigators was locked in the bedroom and Chrissy’s first husband and I’ll tell you the story about how they came about the house it was really strange but she said he was a lovely man until they moved in there and it changed his personality completely and they split up and he moved out and he was back to his normal self and that happened again with a second partner so I instantly thought this is something dark and negative that’s not happy with other males on the land so we’re going to probably have a predatory mail or something like that and you know in the UK you can go back hundreds and hundreds of years with houses and a lot of Maritime houses will have leftovers from the rexs and some let’s be honest are scuttled so that you could get everything off the Rex and a lot of that wood and furniture and anything that was stolen would have gone into the building of the house in the in the lentils in the Attic Flo [ __ ] up on the wall quite natural um that happens all over the world so in March she contacted me and said I’ve recently put some CCTV in into the house and on the outside of the property my youngest son has autism and he gets up very early in the morning and I I want to keep him safe I want to know that he’s safe so it’s um action so the the minute it you go in front of it it will set off it will start to tape and it it will it will record motion activate I should have said so she one day she’s expecting a delivery of food and the CCTV suddenly starts to record and she thinks oh right the the food shops here and the dogs going ballistic as per normal and she goes outside and he’s just nobody there’s nobody there and the audio seems to have captured some really strange um almost gurgling voices now there is nowh around the area where this could be interference from it’s not coming in from CV radio it’s not something from the port it’s very different um and I’m not sure if you want to play a clip of it now but I I didn’t like it I’ll be honest I didn’t like it okay Joel that’s the first one actually with the car in it isn’t it Debbie it’s the one with the yeah yeah even just 10 of 20 seconds of it you’ll hear it it’s this just this garbled noise and the sound of running Rushing Water it’s this one Joel I’ve just said I know so there are 18 minutes of audio like that taken over four separate occasions where it’s just automatically clicked on and started to record and she decided as I would have done I’m going to go back and look at the CCTV and see if I’ve captured anything she starts to go through it and she finds the video that’s um I think it’s a minute long and you see now this is a home and it’s on the co so you will see bugs and you know you’ll see dust and all them like that but there some like Dark Shadows that sent they move across this old hallway in the house and you got lots of light orbs coming through see um a solitary see-through gentleman really stood at the window looking out and this hand the turned into an no so I think that’s the 30 second video and there’s a dog in it you can see the dog in the kitchen Chris’s in there with one of her sons um and the CCTV starts and about 21 seconds in you actually if you look on the door jam you see an or and it changes to a hand and then it goes away again really quickly I think you’ve got that one there Joe so Deborah did you catch it yeah oh yeah fingers at the end on the door yeah yeah so rather than going with a team and stir things up anymore now there’s three young boys in the house so that’s my main priority as long as those children are happy nothing’s happening to them then let’s do this with me and Mom rather than ramp things up so I asked her about the boys and anything that they were doing that was out of the ordinary and she said that her youngest son was had started to draw some very dark images of things that he was seeing on his bedroom her older son had drawn a figure a dark figure in the corner that he’d seen human shapes obviously like a I would say more of a shadow being so I asked Chrissy to tell me her history I wanted you to know what was her connection to that house in the land and she said to me you know what funny story how I about this house Deb um she said me and my husband were looking for somewhere in the in rural because we’ve got the dogs a first husband and we wanted somewhere where the dogs could roam free it was run to rack and ruin so she’s had to do lots of work over the years to bring it back to what it was and she said um when they went to look at the house to buy it it was owned by a lady called Mrs Mo and Mrs Mo was reluctant to sell it to her and she said you seem like a really nice girl and I don’t really want to sell it it to you and Chrissy said it’s fine I’ve been having strange experiences since I was a baby you know it’s just kind of normal in my family and it doesn’t worry me whatsoever and Mrs Mo said this house is jinxed I lost my son my son died on a bike accident at the end of the lane but Chrissy was said she was fine with it so they agreed to buy the house so she went to her mom’s really excited to tell Mom that they’ bought this house and Mom said oh you silly girl you were born in that house and we had to leave and um we left before you were two years old because you never settled at any point and you’d be absolutely terrified and you caught as a child and they sold the house to Mrs Mo so she didn’t know that she had no knowledge of that whatsoever it’s like 25 years later you know which is just unbelievable isn’t it when you think about it and I said to her when did you first notice activity and she said the first week I moved in the first week we moved in we started to see like a tall dark shadow that was near the pump house now as I said the house was built in 1830 so was the pump house so I thought right I need to go and look at this who owned that land at that point who would be this this person that was unhappy and she said I’ve always felt like it was almost like a status quo and he’s accepting of me because I care about the house and the land in the same way that he does and I said yeah that makes perfect sense to me he’s putting up with you but it’s hit to him it’s still his home said and that’s quite natural that happens more but I thought there’s more to this what what are the why the small hand I mean he Samuel as I found Samuel would be a big farmer this is a small hand and I kept thinking no there’s more to this there’s more to this case and I was getting hint after hint so I thought right get looking dead and I looked and I found a shipwreck small boat with nine people on it that happened the same year that the house was built it was a lovely day there was nine people on board including the boat pilot because it has to be the pilot takes it out the estra and into the bed he was 41 his name was um Edward Burton and his son Bernard Burton was on with him he was 12 and there were some other children on the boat as well and they were guests that had come from Sheffield to go out and get sire and they get some you know they get cockles and and and kippers and they’d come back in and unfortunately the boat sank and only one lady survived All Souls were lost including B Richard and his son Bernard and three small boys and I thought they’ve gone home to chriss’s chriss’s a mom there’s three boys in the house they’re probably really comfortable there they like it there we’re seeing lots of light orbs happy you know nothing demonic nothing satanic or anything like that and I thought this is this is CH of family in some way so between me and chrisy we managed to find a newspaper clipping of the actual [ __ ] going down and I sent that to Laura earlier and it names the people and everything and and it’s very sad and I found over 50 people that had lost their lives either in the bay on ships that had been named after the bay or in the river itself the last one being Feb this year so I thought this is a virtual Lighthouse for spirit so I thought I said to Chrissy tell me about your earlier experiences your mom said you wouldn’t settle she went up always was seeing things she said minana PR was the same though she used to see things like I see and I thought this is another case where it runs down the generations and I thought I wonder if it connects in any way it didn’t I was hoping I could connect it to Chris but I couldn’t but I did connect it to the guy who had the original house built so Chrissy actually went and found his grave which to me is just just unbelievable and she had a little chat with him and she explained to him that he could go home anytime he wanted but if he was comfortable at the house with the boy she was fine with that as well and she left him a little teddy bear at the grave which I just thought was lovely and I asked her what she did to relax and she said I don’t anymore Deb my mom I’ve got three boys I never get to but before I had them I used to like to sit and sketch and I said to her why don’t you do that again then why don’t you get yourself in a comfortable position and just sit and sketch and the the drawing started to come so there was one that had two School caps floating on the water um another was a a young boy that’s you can see he has a smile on his face when I first started he Disturbed me a little bit I thought oh I didn’t like it because it was like energy you know dra in energy but I sh it to me daughter my daughter said you’re looking at it with the wrong ey mom look at it as a mom and a grandmother and I looked and I thought his story he’s smiling because his story’s Been Told he’s been recognized we know him now we know his name you know and and and he’s passed with his father and that house has been there all of that time so I think he’s anchored there in some way I think he likes to be there so yeah what do you so what protocol do you have for people we dealing with fear then I know a lot of people come to you and they’ll be terrified what some of the advice you’d give them those who are really terrified about living in where they live where there’s something like that number one that they’ve survived it already they’ve lived it and survived it and you know in this case nobody’s been hurt there’s been no nothing satanic or demonic or dark in any way this is more of a brooding Darkness along the lines of you’re a male get off my property and I think that’s why he’s affected the males in the family you know so what I know I tend to do is you’ve got to triage you’ve got to prioritize so chriss’s happy she’s fine she’s not scared of anything the boys are happy and they’re fine they’re not scared anything so there’s no real trauma attached to this one this is more of a case of looking for an answer why is she gone back to that house SAR the universe has put her there for a reason you know she’s there for a reason she had several miscarriages while she’s lived there she’s lost both of her parents while she’s lived there and she said that she feels sometimes that he does actually protect her you know she feels like sometimes he feels like her father so what I did was I went back through ancestra um and I looked and the person who bought the house built the house was called George pets and if you remember the boat pilot was called Burton and George P pets married his sister Sarah Burton so the Burton and the pets have been meeting in that house since the 1800s and they probably lived in a smaller building on that land before that because we she did manage to find an old smoke but if there was trauma involved one of the best things I can do is sit and listen so and I tend to speak to them like this and if I can get to them in the car I’ll do that as well and I’ll go and sit down and I just asked them and to tell me what happened at the time so if it’s been absolutely terrifying we need to break it down into small smaller problem so say it’s like a poltergeist or a a bad activity I’ll normally find a teenager in the house so I had a report not too long ago from two miles away and um and they were seeing a de a devil like f Shadow really a silhouette of a shadow on the on the wall and Mom had seen it earlier and she was a child and I said have you got any teenagers in the house she said yeah I am I got a teenage byy about 14 I said well yeah your energy changes at 14 and it can ramp up activity I said and it can be like a torch for anything out there that’s interested in energy whether that be um something negative or positive you know so what I would do what I did in that case that that lowered it for her because she thought oh it’s not a devil you know it’s not satanic it’s probably energy and if you make it the negative it will and if you you try and pull it back to the positive side it will go positive so I start them on that when they’re comfortable talking about the experience and they’re okay with it you’re not upset then I say what was the first time you remember having something happen to you that you can’t explain no matter how mundane it may seem to you tell me about it and they usually say when I was a small child in my bedroom and I take it from there and you think these people have been frightened their entire lives and then I start to play on the strengths and I say to them you’ve been through more than any person I know you know and you’ve done that and still functioned you’ve got up you’ve gone to work you’ve seen to your children you’ve paid your bills you’ve been a responsible adult son brother Uncle cousin all of the things that’s Society except expects from you you’ve managed that and you’re still standing so let’s not look at the negative let’s start looking at the positive of it you know you’ve managed to do this you’ve reached out to me there’s always an incident that they reach out to you on that’s the one that brought the camels back but when you take it and Amy will say the same when you take them back further there’s been a series of events and over time people have made them feel silly or oh it’s so it’s in your imagination you’re away with the fairies you’re just being dramatic some people have ongoing activity from the day they are born so the day that they leave this earth because it’s a natural ability and it’s stronger in some than others the more the more you accept it the more it builds there’s so many amount of times like IID have conversations with my friend non-spiritual friends who I grew up with and literally like I’d say 90% of the people I talked to had experience when they were younger they didn’t have any spirituality or understanding of spirit now but as soon as you mention paranormal ghost and activity when they’re younger 95% of them will mention a story and they’ be like there’s like there was one friend who had a Vicor at the end of the bed grabbing their ankles just little things like that and people grow up with that fear and it’s always like it’s like locked up for them isn’t it and obviously people like yourself and these shows are really good because it helps people start telling their own story what happened to me let’s talk about it let’s try and explain the par normal even though we might not know exactly what it is at least we can actually understand what our reality is like because it’s not all rainbows and butterflies I mean I work with parents that have got small children toddlers in the room I worked the case recently um um Lily she won’t mind me telling you her name Little Lily she was seeing a man in a bedroom he wasn’t frighting her but he was annoying her he was waking her up she’s two and a half so he’s waking her up and he’s annoying her and obviously worry your mom so I said to her he’s probably it’s going to be an old family member or something like that I said I’m sure the answers will come but for now let’s give Lily a stone you put Lily Stone in Lily’s hand and I say so right Lily that’s your stone you’re in charge of your bedroom now if anybody tries to come into your bedroom just St your stone and just say by the power of this Stone you’re not allowed in here you can’t talk to me go away so we got this little two and a half year old child that’s trying to trans tell you what’s going on and she had a speech impediment as most two and a half year olds do so Mom had to kind of translate for me but it goes like this she goes to Mom’s great what would be her great grandmother which is Mom’s grandmother and they’re playing in the living room and they’re going through all fer albums and she points at a picture of a man and says that’s him that’s the man and Mom says what man and she got the man in my bedroom and she’s like that man that’s my great great grandfather and she said yeah no he told me that’s how that case went so if it’ have been a different maybe a different investigator and they just said this is very dark this is demonic this is satanic I’m quite sure it had gone awful for the family you know and I said to Mom what what have you put in place before you spoke to me what have you kind of put in place she said well I’ve gone around the house and I’ve had to talk to it and I’ve said don’t you be going in Lily’s room you’re not to be upset enough and we’ve painted it we’ve decorated it I said well you did it yourself you come to it and with tier you don’t need me you just needed my permission you know exactly what to do to keep that child safe when did it start for you and she said in my bedroom when I was a kid so it’s generational it is definitely in that bloodline and it will trace it back I I tell if we had all night I could tell you a story about a werewolf case in Bedford yeah that would absolutely blow your mind and that happened in September last year it would blow your mind and you the rabbit hole it’s me down you know he’s an 88 year old man and he was at the end of his life and I’ve known him probably 18 years because he’s been activity on the land for that amount of time but I wasn’t in touch with him for that I was in touch with his carer because his Cara kept it all hidden from him so he didn’t know he didn’t have a clue Laura he had no idea whatsoever which is the way we wanted to keep it so there was like bangs on the house and things running up and down and things on the all manner of scary stuff so long story short it’s all PRI land there’s a tunnel that goes from there down to where the nunery was and there was there’s an old property on it and someone’s got that property and they’ve been doing Satanic rituals within it and cing up all manner of things so 8th of September I’m I’m due to go hospital I’m in I’m actually on a ward in an hospital gown getting ready to have a procedure and me phone starts going and I thought oh my God that’s that’s he never phones it’s got to be an emergency I answers it and he said Deb I’m serious is a real emergency I’m so sorry but Fred’s seen something in the middle of the night and he’s terrified he’s absolutely terrified we don’t know what to do and I said right you need to phone the doctor straight away because if he’s it could be an infection this that that can happen you know at the end of life kind of thing and he did he’d done all of that without me suggesting it so he said to me will he speak to him and I said yeah of course I will put out out so that’s what I did I sneaked out to the car and I founded him I said I Freddy it’s de be and we’ve only ever had conversations before like like me and me Granddad so when I’ve spoke to him on the phone he been I have you been doing and how are you doing and the have the cleaners been in and we just talk like that you know what were the Care New carers like never spoke to him about anything paranormal and he said to me please Debbie I’m so frightened I’m so frightened he’s going to C is he going to come for me and get me and I said to him what did you say and he said it was a werewolf there was a were at me at me window and he tapped on the window at me so I said to him right right let me ask you some questions and I asked him if he was Irish of Irish descent and he said yeah both of his parents were Irish I asked him what had changed what was different about that night than any of the others and he said he couldn’t do the stairs anymore so the carers brought his bread downstairs to the living room and they hadn’t clicked the curtains on yet so normally would be upstairs um the other thing I asked him was had he been thinking about his death and he said yeah yeah I’ve had the solicitors out you know I’m getting all my my things in order and everything and I said to him it’s quite normal when you get to the end of your life that you connect more with the you know with the the nonhuman world but I knew there was probably more into it than that um and I said to him are you worried most people when they pass over are worried about something they’ve done early on and you know it might you might not go to the right place and he he said yeah I I was raised a Catholic and worried about all you know all kinds of things and I said to him that’s quite normal as well I said have you ever heard of the Irish death wolf and he was like no I said it’s not a bad thing it’s not like a shook or anything like that I said there’s the old Legend of OA and if you’re of Irish decent no matter where you are in the world at times of illness and sickness it will come to protect you really to what they call it the wolf that walks your home so it tends to come at the end of life so some people will see it is like a bad Omen but it really isn’t there to take them you know it’s there because they’re connected to it somehow in some way and I asked him to describe it to me and he described it amazingly well he said it had a long snout it had chaining is now we’re talking about a Stockman he’s worked on a farm his entire life his absolute entire life um so he knows his animals so when he seen something like that I I’m standing up and thinking I need to to listen to what he’s telling me but he did he did go into hospital and he did have um he had um an infection and if he hadn’t have seen that thing at the window they wouldn’t have known that he had this he was always borderline sepsis and they wouldn’t have known and he did come home his last wish was he wanted to come home and die there with his dog and his and that’s exactly what happened you know um January passed away in January and you see it as well like obviously a bit different but people with illnesses go through that word hallucination which isn’t a hallucination it’s just them in that right space to be able to see the Unseen World and who’s around them and I remember loads of times in Fever going into loads of different Realms walking around seeing different beings and I came out of it my mom was like you were just talking and walking around the room talking to people like completely gone and she actually got a video of me like walking around the room talking to someone and I was like in this other world and I was like sat down talking my brother I finally came back and I ended up on my bed and I was like where have I been brother was like you were walking around for about an hour talking I was like I remember for one minute there’s something I want to show I wonder if it’s partly um through trauma through being ill some of your body actually leaves you know like when people have PTSD a lot of them leaves but a lot of their light body or energy goes and therefore you are walking in other Realms aren’t you before you call it all back in that’s it yeah he he he’s Cara sat down and and chatted with him about it and kind of filmed the interview so that I could hear it from Fred’s point of view as quickly as possible so that was Jo with in about five or six hours um and I mentioned oh I said you know the hor presses that you’ve got on your fire I said when I was a little girl I used to get two and six of M granny for for shining them and he actually he left them there I’ve got five of them and I I absolutely treasure them I for the rest of time so people say oh Deborah you must be absolutely you know you must make an awful lot of money to make a penny I’m absolute po yeah but I’m rich you know I’m rich in other ways but I’ll be friends now with his carer for the rest of me life because we’ve been through that together and then he he then has the trauma of Fred’s past so he’s he’s been Fred career for 20 years and and shaped his life around him so now he’s got to go out so he now and I think it’s absolutely amazing he’s going around the UK looking at all the places where my strange cases have come from and doing investigations there which I think is absolutely wonderful you know Deborah I have a question um is the Paranormal Activity mostly visual or how do other people sense it because sometimes I feel either I’m sleeping I feel as though somebody’s sitting on the edge of my bed I feel that that you know compression I think I think it’s different for each of us I think for some it’s Audible and for some it’s Visual and for some it’s a knowing so it’s a dream state I think I honestly believe am my entire research has led me to when you are completely relaxed and an autopilot you use the peripheral part of your brain not your 2024 brain and that peripheral part of your brain kept you alive back in the day before verbal communication we had to communicate somewhere between ourselves you know it kept you alive it’s you got instincts it’s all of those things so when you’re relaxed at night and you’re in that relaxed state if it’s something that’s sitting on the end of the bed what does it feel like what’s the feel that you get from it it’s like oh somebody’s there it feels like somebody’s sitting on the edge of my bed but you’re not frightened you’re not scared no no no I’m not but as a child I do remember um being Catholic we had in my bedroom I shared a bedroom so I have many siblings but there was a picture on the wall do if you remember the guardian angel picture with the two kids walking across the bridge yeah okay so I remember that almost as 3D like coming alive okay I didn’t think of anything about it I just thought oh wow that’s we kind of all I didn’t do anything more with it you might be able to tune and then have a chat with it the next time you feel it sit on the bottom of the bed say you know why’ you keep visiting it could be a relative it could be a guide okay yeah and just have a general conversation with it and usually the answer will come at some point along the way but as a child what about the picture that I saw kind of move you probably did see you probably did see the picture move I I work with a number of children that have said I me myself something came out of the wall it’s a terrifying absolutely terrifying me and it was like it was made of the wall and it just kind of came out you know I think when we’re very very young we are still seeing and experiencing this world that goes around us that we don’t see as adults you know and I think you can tune in as a child you know remember daydreaming and people say no don’t Daydream you know don’t zone out that’s meditation you know that’s that’s so you allowed to like Daydream you know but Pardon Me by the time you’re about four or five anything strange that happened people will probably have told you it was a nightmare or it was a trick of the light and you just learn to dismiss it I’ve said it last week we’re the only animal on this planet that doubts our own Instinct another PL another animal on this planet that has a thought and goes oh no I’ll reason that away trained us to do that you know Society has trained us to do that I would imagine if somebody who loves you AE and they are there just to you know yeah and also what about sleepwalking in the middle like kids um especially my kids used to sleepwalk and I would just take them back to bed like guide them back a lot of children do that I haven’t worked any cases with with sleepwalking children um I know my dad said when I was little he came in the bedroom and I was sat up and I was speaking German I would have been about five or six at the time and I said to him how did you know it was German and he went I don’t know actually but you were just sat up and you were speaking German and two years ago I had my um DNA done so it be 52 years later and I’m I’m bloody German yeah part of my Heritage German and I thought is that genetic memory that you’ve got to try and reason it away haven’t you like whoa whoa but that led me down a whole other Rabbit Hole of paranormal cousins they just came came out of the woodw I’ve got a cousin who’s got um an Oscar Nathan or Nathan and he said to me Deb can I ask you something I’ve never met him it was the first time we we kind of spoke and he said have you ever had any strange paranormal experiences and went yeah actually me job every single one of them had a story to tell every single one of them my grandmother was one of 10 and every single one of the children that came off they was 10 had paranormal but they were all different am for some feeling things things would touch them in the bed for others it was just a general knowing like something was about to happen or the dog was going to get ill for others it was full on one of them said oh do you remember when kids used to sleep over at our house and they’d run out screaming I’ve been I’ve been this weirdo my entire life on my own thinking it’s only me experiencing this and each and every one of my cousins have gone through it and each and every one of their parents and you’re thinking this this must run in our it must run in our family lines it must it all of a story to tell otherwise come did you get people um talking about sleep deprivation to you like cases and stuff shadow beide of the bed or to you paralysis complete paralysis and Terror I had that when I was younger it’s like a haunting experience I was in a very haunted house um and as I woke up there was arms around my neck but as I grabbed the arms it was like I’m grabbing my arms now and I remember feel all and and I remember being scared but then this was like what 15 16 years ago but I remember thinking if it happens again I’ve got a way out of this so it happened again and I remember just like really going out my body and going out of it and just getting away from it was really funny because it felt like it was a ghost trying to get me to be scared to feed off my fear and I remember saying to it you’re not going to get me now because I’m I’m going without me going oh [ __ ] no I’m scared well that’s that’s what it wants you to do in it it’s that’s what it wants from you you did it intuitively you’ve took yourself out of that situation and you’ve done it intuitively haven’t you you know and it’s the same as as any attack from anything you know we do what self-preservation kicks in and without thinking we do what we need to do to extract ourselves from that situation and you’ve done that naturally so you should explore on that you should push the boundaries of that and see what you can do with it and sometimes stuff comes to you in dreams as well doesn’t it because in the this flat I’m in at the moment when I moved in I kept getting this dream of a teenage boy who’d been run over and then I realized in the end um he took me out to my hallway here this is all in the dream and I I could see he needed help and because I’ve done some shamanic training and so on with Andrew Well quite a lot um I I one evening I went and created we create like a Sacred Space other people know do it differently we create Like A Rainbow Bridge or something like that some people create a golden doorway but whatever I just spoke out loud to him said some prayers took him by the hand and helped him over his Rainbow Bridge and called in his ancestors to come against him and I felt afterwards that I’d done a really nice thing because he was obviously stuck and he was obviously really distressed and trying to get my attention but I wasn’t seeing it in in daylight or you know in when I was awake the only time I could actually feel it and and and get what the problem was was when I was asleep so but I either way it doesn’t matter does it they if they they are going to try and reach out to you I think if they if you know because to them they’re still I he either lived here or he was in the area yeah and you you like a talk or like aeral Lighthouse so any being that’s out there who’s I think some people struggle one of the hardest things to accept is that you’re actually having these experiences so once you can get somebody to trust that that you know they’re not crazy it’s not all in the head it’s not an hallucination and they get kind better with it it it becomes less and less scary and I think as you’ve crossed him over you’ve given him the option to go you know I just think he’s recognize your energy so if there’s anything out there wandering alone that’s where it’s going to head it’s going to head to the light you know like yeah it’s like he looked for someone who could give him resolve and actually connect to him and he’s like oh there’s actually someone who can actually connect to me and actually know I’m real and so on the dead are like us they just want their story told and some of them don’t know that past they’ve no idea that they’ve passed and they’re in as much confusion as you are and they don’t know how to communicate they don’t know what to do I mean they passed over nobody gives you a book on that do they and you know me it’s always been I’ve always seen kind of shadows out my peripheral I don’t see full on Spirit or anything like that once when I was with my husband that’s it I always see something kind of on the peripheral and I I’m so used to it now if I’m working I’ll say no not today not today but you know I I will make sure I always sit down I have a little ritual what I go go through myself like my protections and then I’ll sit down like say tomorrow if it’s nice I’ll go outside in the garden I’ll sit on the bench and I’ll just close my mind down and I’ll say right show me where to go next show me what I’m supposed to do next so a lot of people when they admit that they’re having these experiences they make the mistake like I did of going right I’m ready ask me what you need of me let me know and it just comes like a freight train thousands of them at once so another thing I’ll work with him for is saying like no it has to be balanced it has to fit within your life and you have to do it when you want to do it you’ve got to learn when to turn it on and turn it off or you be like a battery 24 hours a day you’ll end up drained you’ll be dead ill all of those things that come with that sleep deprivation the whole nine years so I just takes some time sit down you know and you get it eventually it’s just like riding a bike you be doing whe and and that’s it it’s about like sometimes you can’t help everyone because I experienced that once motor way at night I kept I must have saw about nine different ghosts or spirits comeing to ask me to Cross them over and as I was driving to the next point I could see the next face I just said to him look I can’t do this leave me alone I’m really sorry but I’m driving I can’t do this but you could tell like mway are haunted as [ __ ] because of people who died there they’re literally floating around not even realize dead experience of that and it was like what the [ __ ] like the a [Laughter] I mean it’s worse for me because a lot of crypted reports are along the motorways so anywhere Mark chooses for us to go camping I can go oh no there’s a Dogman report there oh no you know report down there that’s like really to the back of my mind when I’m traveling because I like to do everything blind me when I get a case coming and say don’t tell me anything don’t tell me anything I want to I want to get it myself and make sure I’m getting it right it validates me yes and valid the person so like with Chrissy the lady at the house when it was haunted she didn’t need me she just needed to know that she was doing the right thing you know she just needed somebody to say to her no you’re doing the right thing so we had a private chat about two weeks ago where people are saying so what’s happening now Deb what’s got I said nothing’s happening now Chris is quite comfortable doing what she’s doing she started to do automatic writing she’s happy with that and she’s passing them over one at a time as become come and she needs to do that privately without anybody interfering with that so she will either give me an update or she won’t it’ll roll out as it should the most important thing for that case was getting her comfortable in the house comfortable with her own abilities and then getting her to expand them and saying these ghosts are coming to you for a reason so we can either let it go dark and play you or you can say right get in a cube and we’ll do you one at a time and that’s that she’s happy with that everyone’s happy and that’s the way it will roll and then I’m the littlest hobo I went on to me next case which is just took me down another Rabbit Hole oh I have a question about um well a couple questions um so you’re kind of like um a helper a moderator you moderate because does Chrissy has to do it themselves yeah yeah yeah they have to do you can’t come in and do everything okay a coach a coach okay yeah I could do but then I’d be running all around the country doing this for people and I would I believe that within each and every one of us you can solve it yourself you can once you start to accept that it is happening around you we look at the evidence between if they want me to bring a team in are will if they say to me Deb I want you to come in and I say right okay and I’ll get a team together what I tend to do is I look for a an a paranormal team that’s already set up in that area because that’s much better they can communicate daily they get all the time that they need with the witness in in and out of the house getting what you know whatever that witness is comfortable with from a private conversation and nothing more right the way through so full investigation I will try and facilitate that as best as I can but I honestly believe it works like give a man a fish and he’ll eat for a day I think if you can give them the tools and I have little group set up so I can say to them look there’s a number of ladies here who’ve gone through the same thing as you do you want to jump in and have a chat with them and read back through the chat and see their experiences and see how normal it is the more we normalize the same the more we can talk about it at a book club or when we’re pushing the pram as a young mom going to school a normal conversation you start to feel less weird and less crazy and it’s the same way it’s okay to see a ghost and it’s okay to see a UFO but if you see a crited creature of any kind no don’t want to deal with that you must be absolutely crack but back in the day you were considered crackers if you saw a ghost yes but it’s accepted now so you were seeing as a lunatic in the 70s if you saw a UFO but it’s accepted now and I want that for the trauma everybody loves the exciting bit but they forget about that witness that witness is there when they go home yeah and they still have to deal with this once the TV show and they move you know and I noticed that earlier on in my career I was thinking we need to be checking back in with these people we need to be making sure over the next three to six months it doesn’t suddenly go dark on them you know we need to make sure and that’s kind of it was so hard when I came forward my experiences I just thought I’m never no nobody’s ever slamming a door in my face again I’m not having it I’m Gonna Make You know I’m G to make a place where it’s okay to just have a coffee and say you know tell us about your weird experiences and I’ll tell you about my weird experiences and people open up they lost him you know the validation that they get he like oh thank God it’s not just I know you know did you sorry Amy go ahead go ahead I just had the other question and maybe you maybe you answered this in your other interview with the Talking Stick but um what was your most interesting question or case that you had that really left you like wow you just respond comenting to the I think that there’s one I’m working at the moment that’s um I don’t know if you can reveal it’s okay if you can’t reveal no it’s fine it’s abely fine it’s I’m I’m pre-working it so I’ve sent everything over what I do is the report comes in I speak to the witness and I’ll say to them do you want me to interview you or do you want me to transcribe the call so with this guy was transcribed the call but he did have quite a lot of um information I said earlier that I think case’s run in families and I also think it’s the same for land AER so I think if your family have lived on that land for a very long time you connected to it in a way different to me you just comeing for that day so you’re going to notice all the subtle nuances that are different so this chap was um his grandfather lived on the land the F land you know their entire lives he at from the land you know proper outdoors and there used to be in um the area is called bid um it’s in St on Trent in England so our version of skin walker Ranch would be kic Chase well this is within a short drive of kic Chase and it’s also surrounded by lots of other strange reports so one night he’s walking with the dog um a farmer had had some foxes so he was going out to set some traps to keep the F keep them off the off the land so he’s walking with the dog and he said the pass’s made of lime so you can see it even though he said it was uh I’ve got to get it right it was um 198 just after the autum Equinox so it was a harvest Moon and he said you could see the path in the Moon it was beautiful I’m stood on the bridge and I’m looking at this amazing thing and it’s absolutely gorgeous and something dropped from the tree th you could feel it like really feel it so to cut a long story short I thought wonder what bolf means and I asked him what he thought it was and he I said to him there are a lot of reports in the area of like dog manlike creatures and things like that and he said it could have been it looked like a bear as it went across the field it was down an half four you know we don’t have bear in the UK so I looked up I’m thinking right let’s go and have a look and in Anglo Saxon it says like it’s B by um the the digging so basically like a quarry but angle Saxons didn’t come here till the sixth Century so I’m thinking I’ll go back into Old English and in Old English B uh bolf translates as a man who lives next to the wolf so we he said to me oh they got him a a uh Crest a crest of arms do you want to see it and I said yeah and there’s a wounded wolf on it there’s a wolf with an arrow in its arm so it’s been really really interesting kind of working that case if you get what I mean wow the but it’s very new but I’m trying to think of there’s some older ones I’ve worked so many interest yeah you probably did I know and what about the code of arms because I know um what is our family crest so if you uh in in the UK we have a like a a system don’t we so you have the aristocracy at the top it’s like the Royals and Barons and dukes and lws and they will have family CH and that’s probably made like the 10th Century or something and I forgot the little bit they also have a motto that got popular about the 17th century and their motto was we seek for higher things which I thought was interesting quite strange normally it’s like battlecry isn’t it or you know sees the but we seek for higher things and each family if you go back in Generations will have a a distinct just for them you know yeah I have one yeah yeah so I have a lot of like ladies and ladies in my ancestors that fell for curly head gypsy boys and ran off and lost the titles so by the time you get down to me you know those titles are not not there anymore but they they were back in time and I just think it fascinates me that I was also looking at my ancest female ancestors going back in time and a lot of them had been I’m related to a famous witch in island called Mary Butters she was car money witch um but I’m I’m also related to a number of other witches and I don’t think they were witches I think they were just like me and my cousin I think they were just very intuitive and one of them would would kind of predict Mary would kind of predict but the cattle were going to die so when they did die she was seen as a witch all like she’ caused it but she was having a prophetic dream and that dream was saying to her the animals are going to you know and I worked with a lady just last month who said the same thing to me am exactly the same thing to me she said when she was a little girl she dreamt that the cattle were all dead in the field and within about three or four days the cattle were all dead in the field so very so we’ve gone from the 16th century right probably 1980s and she lives once again in a little farm in the middle of nowhere gone back Generations lives with her father she was walking the dog one day about 20 years ago and she was walking down an old car track and I said to her what were you doing nothing the dogs were just you know it was lovely it’s a lovely day the dogs are out in front of me I’m just walking along looking at the floor and as she looks up she sees this thing she said he was beautiful he was absolutely beautiful he was like an orange colored wolf on and all four and he looked as surprised to see me as I was to see it he stood up onto two legs and then he vanished almost like he was sucked into the EA she said like when you do a sketch and you rub it out with a rubber he just vanished so now we’re having things at home so she’s seeing she’s a moon B she likes to go out on moon B couple of occasions she has literally felt breath on the back of her neck she’s heard footsteps on the you know on the ceiling and on the roof and things like that but she also says I don’t understand the relationship I’m absolutely terrified of him but really curious about him as well and that’s more that’s very true to what it’s like for people was the same for me what I saw terrified me but the by the time I was in my 30s I needed answers so that need for answers overtook the terror and I could never understand like the kind of wanting to know more about him was I inviting him in more you know so she’s going through the things that I went through like 20 years ago but she’s very aidite she’s very you know she’s a strong woman she doesn’t need me down there on that farm she’s going to deal with it herself she said I put cameras out I thought right I’ll get you I’ll put cameras out she said I was hearing things around the Pharm so she said I’ve got cameras up everywhere and I heard him near the window and I thought right I’ve got you I’ve got you got you on camera and all you see it’s just this white flash it’s just like it’s that quick yeah so we’re going back in time and I said to her I think you tuned into to the land I think you really tuned in she starts to tell me about Mom Mom saw something she said suddenly one year your mom just stopped walking the fields and when you live in the countryside you forage a lot of your food comes from the field you know I live a similar I live right on edge of town me but I’m country folk so a lot of you your foraging and stuff that you do all year round mom wasn’t doing so when Daisy came in from seeing it on their Farm track she sat down and said mom I’ve just seen something that’s absolutely unbelievable and M was like yeah I know I know so know yeah she’d seen something similar but probably 20 years before incredible so why don’t move on to UFO now and talk about some experience for the last part last half an hour of the show a lot of people have different experiences look up in the sky um I’d like to just share my experience I had which was very profound um around about eight years ago I decided to take a walk near s Tre and uh I laid on a park bench with u my ex partner at the time and we both laid down looked up at the stars and all of a sudden I had to look at this real bright star and I said look at this star and I looked at it for about 10 minutes and after 10 minutes the star changed and you ended up seeing thousands of crafts light crafts coming in and it was a mother ship and was looking at the person with me and I wasn’t on didn’t no alcohol or anything I just said are you seeing what I’m he goes yeah and it was an actual mother ship and you could see hundreds hundreds of crafts coming in and out and I was like to myself am I going crazy I know this shit’s real but it took me ages to actually see it it was like there was an invis something blocking me seeing it but I was able to actually unlayer that and go and actually see what it was it really really fascinating that’s astounding how did you feel afterwards how felt excited I felt excited that there was there was a tiny bit of mean a tiny bit of fear came in a slight little bit but I dealt with it and I just like how [ __ ] exciting and it inspired me because I was in spirituality at the time and it just I was telling loads of my friends about and I was like how [ __ ] cool and I had someone there to validate it with me do you know you’re not crackers because they saw it as well at time i’ never had a UFO experience bought me has I’ve only ever seen my husband scared once in his life he’s a Big Bly Bing I’ve only ever seen white face was W absolutely white and that was only speaking about it that wasn’t the event we we met 20 years ago so I was 18 at 15 when I had my experience in the park and he was 21 when he had his UFO experience um and for all we knew each other because we knew each other families it’s a small town we didn’t get together until about 2005 so I didn’t told told him about my scary stuff then I was working under an assumed name I didn’t want anyone to know who I was I was like I’d been raised to be ashamed of of the things that were happening so I still kind of stuck in that shame and we were having that conversation that you have when you caught in and you say like oh what’s the weirdest thing that’s ever happened to you you know and all that so we never really we both kind of never had the conversation we just I didn’t say anything to him and he didn’t say anything to me but over time he realized that I had this online for Persona and he said like what’s all that about I said oh I counsel people it’s what I do so I just kind of did that and then I i’ worked out early on that a lot of the experiences were happening around ancient sites and like ancient burial Ms and things like that so i’ explained me Theory to him and I said like I think that a lot of paranormal reports in these areas of high energy and he was like yeah and he just blew me off and I thought he’s not like that that’s normally not what he wasn’t or any he just wouldn’t have the conversation with me so I got on your map and I’m looking and I said to him oh I know where we can go I said well go to the Barrow down there near the u tree because that’s the highest point around here and his face went white and he went no I’m not going there and I I’ve never seen him SK I was like what can’t go there I can’t go there and I went what you mean and he went you do you not remember what happened I was like no so he said to me when I was 21 we live in a really small town so back then there was the shop shot at night so if you run out of anything get to walk to the motorway and go to the motorway service station and get you know your pint and milk or whatever so this Mark and his three friends and they’re all about between the ages of 19 and 21 and they’re all walking to the garage and the next thing they all walk wake up on top of the Barrow head to head in a crucifix shape with a light above them and Mark said the light went Zip Zip Zip Zip and it were gone the next thing they’re back at home and they’ve each got each other’s not what they would have bought from the garage but like Dale had Laura’s stuff and Laura had mine and I had amus and they’re all just kind of stood there drunk and I said to him what happened after that and he went don’t know I don’t what you me he went I don’t know he went none of us remember and the next day we were all a bit dazed and tried to talk to each other about it but it was a conversation none of us wanted to have two of them I’m not kidding drank themselves to death over it one of them watches the sky night and day night and day and Mark’s better now he’s he’s out of that trauma now because we’ve gone through it and like he’s heard me councel a million people because he’s in the house when they do it you know and he will recognize a lot of what they say especially the abues and I said to him what was the scariest part of it what’s the worst part if I could take one bit away for you what would it be and he said the missing time I don’t know what happened in that hour and a half and I don’t want to know what happened in that hour and a half and I said I get that completely and that’s normal lots of people so that kind of got me into the UFO experiences because I wanted to help him I wanted to help him in that fear um and it just it ended up very strange like most of my cases do I didn’t live in this town I obviously I got married early on and I didn’t live here then and he still did and I moved back here about 96 97 something like that and um I met up with a few old friends when I moved back here and one of them said to me do you remember that night when we were on Gibson Lane and we saw that UFO and I went no and he was like yeah we were on Gibson Lane it was uh me and you and another girl and we were walking down and it was the UFO I said to him I’ve never been down Gibson Lane in me life and he was like d and he got quite in you know when they get a bit angry and he got a bit quite insistent so I said to him right where were we going and he went I don’t know I said well where have we been and he was like I don’t know what was the girl called who was with us he was like I don’t know I said see it didn’t happen it never happened it was you must have dranked it something like that he was insistent he was absolutely insistent I didn’t even live in this town then I was a single mom I Liv 10 mile away and I guarantee you I was not out at three in the morning being a single mom having to go up for it he insisted till the day that he passed that I me and him were out on Gibson Lan which is The F Track and we saw a UFO with another girl and I have no memory of that whatsoever wow was wrong or he was right I don’t did I don’t think it happened I think that something that happened to him and I was probably a simulation of some Far wow you know put him with somebody that he recognizes cuz I was 10 mile away I working I had a mortgage to pay it wasn’t me you this reminds me so there was a story of mine which I’ve never ever told anybody I’ve kept it to myself and because I felt so bizarre and strange after and I just thought everyone think I’m absolutely crazy so I was staying at a friend’s house and all of a sudden as I was laid down there was like this little weird portal which came up and this gray type being but it had it was full of rainbow it’s like a rainbow colored gray was stood right beside me and it would put his finger out and it was going up and down my body and it was there for like an hour and I went to the toilet and it was following me around the house and I remember thinking I I and I remember waking up the next day and I’m I like shut it off completely I’m I’m not telling anybody about this and it actually was I’d say maybe not traumatic for me but like you say it brought up stuff where I had to block it out like I’ve never told you yeah like this is the first time I’ve ever told someone because I I felt like I shouldn’t tell people stuff like that because I’m just weird what absolutely perfect you are what Dale is supposed to be you learn very early on to co compartmentalize your trauma which tells me D if was there any experiences with nightmares when you were a child in your room with a light or anything like that uh there was quite a few so what I used to do is I used to talk in my sleep loads and have like night terrors and stuff like my mom used to come up in the room and I was saying saying words and noises and like getting up and making noises like most nights you just hear me in the other room asleep making all these noises so I did have those like night terrors um I didn’t have much like really negative nasty stuff I felt I had loads of dogs and cats in the house at that time so I felt like a lot of that was those helped out with those experiences without them I think it would have been completely different um you’ve been tuning in and out since you were born yes what about Mom and Dad and grandparents have they had any experience with any kind of phenoma so my my nan died for half an hour or 20 minutes and she came out of her body and she saw my granddad and she looked at his T-shirt and he had a stain on the back of his shirt and when she died and went up she looked at and she goes Colin you should have Bloody washed that top she was going up when she died she saw that say on my grandad’s F when she can’t woke up said Colin that t-shirtt like that’s lovely that though isn’t it think that if you had the opportunity to speak to your ancestors I think you would find that going back Millennia they’ve got some form of strange you know it’s you know you just you you’re exactly as you should be yeah and like it’s not your fault that other people can see what you see and you shouldn’t be giving the answers just because you have that experience D doesn’t mean you getting you have got any answers for them you know you just don’t know and it’s people who don’t believe or haven’t had their own experience they demand these answers so what was that what was that creature where did it come from you know what did it you know this gray how how do they make and you think I don’t know I saw him in my room I had an experience with him and then that experience was over you know so I I just think let’s put the hus back on the others and say no you need to explain to me why I’m not seeing you know why you’re not seeing these things because we are we’re not the minority I you said everyone you asked 90% of people will tell you the dad in experience you can’t explain and if they haven’t that one their Auntie has or their grandma has or you know their uncle has or the friend everybody knows somebody that’s had a strange experience human beings uh and a walking EMF meter and we pick up on that energy at all times as we’re walking around it’s nice you’re talking about the ancestors because Amy Dale and I do a lot of like ancestral work in our like shamanic pra practice there’s anybody out there at the minute and they’re not sure how to go forward but you think it’s something ancestral then lur is the person you need to talk to he is isn’t it that’s what you know that’s so getting in touch with you things like angels and I haven’t had any experience with with that that kind of activity so I get a bit lost when people say that to me and I think oh I can’t help them so it’s great you know new connections where you can send them over and say I think Amy and Jay are probably you need to speak to or you need to speak to Laura or Andrew you know because you know yourself there’s so many people having so many different kinds of experiences out there said to me where do you start where does it end yeah exactly I think you can have more positive experiences I would just in my own experience say maybe don’t use a Ouija board start you don’t know what you’re calling right that is for me that that is just a no no don’t use that and to get a positive experience um I we give offerings to the ancestor of the land whether it’s somewhere we’re visiting or when I moved in here or any new place I go to even if it’s like an apple I go out the land and I talk to the ancestor I know this isn’t foreign to you Debbie you would totally get this I go out say a prayer say that we we come in equal co-creation is some of the words we use in other words you know we can coexist here because we actually recognize that they’re living on another dimension in the same space they’re not miles away they’re here and they were living here probably before I lived here so they they’re still trying to carry on doing what they do in their Dimension and it’s just recognizing them so that they don’t hide your car keys and do like mischievous things like that so a little story my son um moved into a bungalow and um they had all sorts of things like his wife would put a cake in the oven and take it out and the middle bit of the cake would go missing or doors would Slam in the night and so on and David wasn’t terribly into this but he wasn’t scared so I gave him I just said you actually need to not confront but speak to them in a kind way but a firm way and when it started happening in the middle of the night because there were three kids there he up I got to hand it to him because he wasn’t really into this he got up and he spoke kindly to them but said we have to share this space but you know you lived here once he actually found out that it was an old lady who died on the doorstep and she lived there he said you you lived here once but we’re living here now and we have to go exist peacefully but if you know if you’re ready to move on and he in his Mind’s Eye created a golden doorway for her and invited her through the golden doorway and after that they had no problem and that is really not a non-spiritual person non-religious as well but do it without fear without fear because I said you just imagine that you can actually see them just because they’re not on another they they’re on another dimension and you can’t see them doesn’t mean to say they’re not there so just speak to them as if they stood in front of you and I think helps I think communication works over everything so even if it’s a crypted that somebody saw in the woodlands and they’re absolutely terrified of going back in that Woodlands I’ll say like just have a conversation with them in your head and say I did not like that one of the things I’ll say is what would you do if it was a man that usually if it’s it’s happening at home I say what would you do if a man walks in your DA’s bedroom well I wouldn’t let him and say well you need to put those same boundaries in place and you need to mean it when you say it and you don’t ever frighten my child again you will there’s nothing as face as as a mom you know so you know do not ever upset or scare my child again and then you do it for your grandchildren as well because they’re going to have experiences because blood but they are so the generation now are so accepting they have no problem at all my grandson’s 10 year old and he’s already taking reports from his friends of of UFOs and scary things that we’ve seen and he say oh you need to talk to my now because he’s grown up with her I had I started my my job oh 15 years before he were born so he doesn’t know anything different and when he was about three or four I had to go into his bedroom and close it down for him because he said he kept seeing this hairy wolf that was coming in the room and it was frightening him and I said to right well there’s something we can do about this me and you going to have a conversation with his tonight and I made best I got some mint and some lavender it’s not what you give them that that just gives them so like Thor as a hammer it’s not the hammer that saves them it’s just the they need something they can say right this is the power can of puts the control yeah I said to him right I’ll make you a b we’ll H this up over the bed I said he can’t come in the room if this is over the bed and we’re going to tell him that and we’re going to say you’re not allowed in this bedroom and when zay’s 13 or 14 if he changes his mind then you can come and talk to him but between now and then you’re not welcome and that’s how we did it you know then I ended up doing it for the lad Three Doors Down who was artistic he having night terror I did sh for him and I said to his mom whatever he tells you just accept don’t say he had a nightmare don’t brush I’ve just say to him oh this just happened son and we don’t know why and only last year I spoke to a a young man and he deserves a medal because things have been happening at home and I said to him what have you told the children and he said I’ve told them and what you seeing is real and it and it is being experienced we just don’t understand it even adults don’t understand and I don’t know how to explain it to you and I said to him I wish you’d have been my parent when I was growing up because I needed that he gave that boy permission to say what I saw was real this really happened to me and I don’t have to go out of my way to prove that yeah it’s accepted in the same way that whatever a child tells you you believe or when they tell you that they’ve got an imaginary friend or they tell you that something’s coming in their room you sit and you listen to and you believe them and then you find a way putting the the the the power back in their hand whether that’s I’ve give a child a torch before today and said if it comes in your room Shine Your torch on him and tell him don’t come in my room and I’ve got this like you just it just intensifies the intent that was the word I was looking for you need to concentrate that intent the object that I give him like Lily in the stone that’s just so she will concentrate her intent on that do not come into my room yeah yeah that’s lovely I have the best job in the world don’t I really do have the best the no I do recognize that I do recognize that I think I just think every single day is a different day for me you know tomorrow it’ll be another case it’ll be a different case well I think when you I know you do counseling too so when you start to be able to bring in some of the we’ll call it shamanic for want of a better word using the protections using Crystal you know the old the ancient ways okay what what they probably used to do you’ve just added a whole range of things to a toolbox that you didn’t have before yeah loads of people are scared and you try saying to them well you wouldn’t let saying you wouldn’t let a bully into your house to beat up your child and yet you’re letting this unseen being come in and do that and frighten your child so do what you need to do what you need to do ask it to leave and the way you ask it to leave is there are you know many ways that you can do it whether you say you like speaking to it but I love the way you talk about empowering that child in a good way you know either with a crystal or or lavender or whatever it is the child feels empowered so they actually feel they in control because otherwise there’s that whole loss of control and fear and you don’t growing up that that I spoke to a lady last week and her she said it was really hard growing up because Mom was spiritual and she was into the Paranormal so seeing ghosts around or what she would call the Dead one she said Debbie they turn up and they’d have like their injuries from Death that was fine but if I saw the Fay or I saw something else it was like I was a witch and would got somebody got a psychic in to basically dep possess her because of the things she was experiencing she said I shut myself down at 15 because I just wanted to be a normal teenager you know and she just needed mom to say she said I could never get the Jes to position of all of this was wrong it was witchcraft but see in spirit was fine it was accepted and I thought I understand that completely that must have been really really confusing growing up so this is bad and this is good and it isn’t like that is it it’s you get good be and bad beans in everything there’s nothing out there just positive or just negative and I mean obviously she’s a she’s a woman in my age now so she’s kind of worked it all out for herself but I I remember saying to that must have been so hard growing up having to deal with that you know going forward and shutting yourself down and and and and and just really she I don’t think she ever really came to until she was an adult and moved out and she said I actually saw her a f Dev like you know like um like a SATA like pal run across and she said I saw a little man when I was a stick she said when I was a child leaves had a luminescence they would twinkle and Sparkle she said and even as adult I can see that and I thought you’re tuned into the elements you are tuned into the elements and you can see that energy as it moves between them you know so if only had have been able to meet a mom back then and say there’s nothing wrong with the child you know the child is seeing like you know those children who see um they see New York sitting then they can just sit and draw it yeah oh yeah what she was like so we’re talking about a different spectrum of the brain neuro neuro Divergence so another word for weird what sounds far better is neuro diversion we think and EXP experience things differently than your average person we see things differently we experience them differently we were working with different senses but senses all the same they’re all given you know we all got them so like I would I’d love in future to do workshops me where I can bring out of people and say you know valate for them you know kindy of get let’s make an army of people who just like I am not weird this happen how it happened you know so there’s a um so in my sessions I work with people um at a younger age who used to cut themselves and you see it time and time again like there’ll be times where you see people literally all the arms all the legs everything has got slashes on and most of the time with that it’s that the child was possessed and there was literally a demon doing that and embodying that and a lot of my sessions not a lot of them sorry but the people who have had that you have to deal with the trauma of that because it really [ __ ] them up so they’re not in the body all the time they’re always anxious they always worried and a lot of people’s traumas are from unseen experiences as well from when they were from being haunted or being this and that um so yeah it’s important to take into consideration all those different aspects as well and the diagnosis I don’t like the diagnosis I don’t like children seven being diagnosed with anxiety all natural empaths so when I was a little girl if he was a really weird man in the room he’d be coming off him like so and I’d be I’d be edging to get away from him but me olders and me betters were saying don’t be disrespectful go over there and no you know so they kind of dismissed it in me as a child so then that gets labels anxiety so I work with you people like you as you said that where they’re self Haring or they’re thinking of suicide and things like that because they’ve been told her at entire life there’s something wrong with them and that pill won’t fix them so we basically handed them futile and asked them to live it so everything that you’re experiencing it’s this natural ability is being shut down everything that you know is you’re being told it’s wrong and then we expect this child to go out into the world and become a functioning adult while still giving them diagnosis after diagnosis I’ve had every diagnosis Under the Sun there’s nothing wrong with me there is nothing wrong with me that a Phil a pill will fix it won’t fix it I experience things in a different way and they are the same it feels like you want to crawl out of your skin this skin doesn’t fit you because Society is the biggest cult in the world yeah and the minute you step out of line or show one iota of difference you’re strange you’re weird you’re this you’re ADHD you’re they are neuro diversion and give them the power back and say that feeling that you had about that man you were spot on yeah you are absolutely spot on that feeling you had when you walked into that room and you felt like you wanted to that’s a real feeling and we need to celebrate that not say have a pill I’ve had night terrors me entire life my entire life and only last year before I moved our dog sleeps on the bed with us um and my husband I just suddenly wake up in the middle of the night and I’m screaming and I’m fighting and he’ll put his hand on me and I’ll calm down I’ll go back to sleep but my husband said the dog was awake for 20 minutes and it was whining at the door and it wouldn’t take his eyes off the door he said and within a split second it launched and he shot up in bed my dog knew I was going to have a night terar how how if that’s a physical thing that’s happening to how do the dog know yeah we we had that experience Deborah in one of our um trainings we were doing basically someone came to see us with a dog and the dog always acted strange and started barking and and anyone who came near the dog or anybody that used to grow and get them and the dog was acting so weird it was even gr at all the people around him because that lady then had kind of like an anxiety attack and a breakdown the dog could pick it up an hour before and it was looking around like something’s gonna happen and all of a sudden then it all happened the the breakdown and that change you know there not a on the market that can stop that just got to get a drink it’s physically happening to that person and dogs don’t reason it away yes only we only humans do that yeah absolutely and you get you get situations with children and it’s it can be sad because they behave really badly but actually it’s not the real them it’s whatever is haunting them at the time whatever they in their innocence they’ve allowed in you know because like you said they’re like something can come to feed off of it whether it’s you know like an Karma or something like that and they don’t know what to do with the children and they get worse and worse and worse because they won’t actually look at some something that shamanic that has been used for thousands of years to actually help not just children but people who have who can get haunted my grandmother sorry I didn’t mean to jump in there my My grandmother used to her dad when something bad was going to happen yeah and that was accepted but as a child I was naughty because I saw things in my bedroom yeah what if it was my ancestors trying to help me because I was frightened yeah yes y yep you know it’s just generational just generational misunderstanding yeah yeah sad that is it when you think about it if we if we knew about our ancestors and our connection to them from birth you know the thousands of people that have fell in love to for us to be here if we had an understand you don’t get that understanding I don’t think till you later in life I don’t think you you appreciate your Anis in away when you’re younger because you don’t know their stories no exactly and a lot of that has gotten lost we don’t do stories around the fire like we used to the oral teachings and there’s a exactly that we don’t do that anymore the word um it’s always like I see the word and this is something I’ve gone over Andrew loads is when you realize they our ancestors is about bringing them into like the word of your own knowingness yeah and knowing they are there not they might be there but you there’s a knowing and once I experienced my knowingness it was easy to be able to see them like as I shut my eyes I can see them uh there’s a spirit guide who comes to see me all the time he’s got like a he wears like a black suit with a white tie and he was from my dad’s dads dad’s dad’s dads and he owned a newspaper um workshop and he actually is was the father in that lifetime as my daughter now and he was asking me questions about opal and he was just and I could see him and I remember saying to Andrew this guy’s following me around all the time let’s have a conversation with him and he’s and he’s he’s one of my Spirit guides and then the knowingness came where and imagine if we Tau that to Children about spirits and they grew up with a knowing just imagine what the world like then yeah inste of we teach them to run and be scared and I was scared I was scared till I was 35 terrified absolutely terrified I made every mistake in the book because I I was told to be scared you know of it it was awful and bad things were going to happen and you know I’d be condemned and the whole nine yards and I had no control over it I couldn’t stop it there was nothing to make it go away and then I just got told I was naughty all I was just exaggerating so I just down and dealt with it on me own and that’s not a healthy way to deal with anything you know and and I just don’t want young kids today going through what I went through and many others you know I spoke to it the chat when I was talking to you about bolf and the the wounded wolf he had that experience and in 1999 he sits there with his dad and his dad says to him you know when you’re walking down near the pool you never see out strange and he said no and he never told his dad that story and his dad said to him when we were kids um the the chicken house was open one morning um and we kind of blame the younger brother for it he said but the feathers went into the Woodland so they followed him in there and they couldn’t find the Now normally when a fox kills it leaves carcus he everywhere doesn’t it it comes back for him no carcasses or anything like that so they decided that night they were going to go down there and they were going to sit and wait it out and she was say so we’re talking probably like 1950s 60s something like that and they’ve got Grandad’s big great coat on because it’s absolutely B in Wind he said and we sit there and we wait and wait wait nothing happens and me me dad as a b something grabs his brother’s coat and pulls it off and they run back to the house and they were terrified and he still didn’t tell his dad that he an experience couldn’t have that conversation wow strange is it’s really strange how we’ve kind of locked it up it’s like just Pandora’s Box do you know when I think it is J I get on my soap box I think it’s so we go to work the next morning we are completely trapped in this Society aren’t we we just want us like blinked on this one thing don’t look that way or that way don’t noce things out there we need you in work at 6 o’cl in the morning there we go we need to we need to supply all the answers you’re not allowed to find answers on your own you rely on us then you rely on us don’t you to if it’s all right you guys I’m G I’m gonna have to pull up we’re gonna end the show yeah we’ll wrap it up so thank you so much Deborah for coming onur Laura showed me YouTube a few weeks ago I was like this is going to be fun and again this is a second show and we’d love to have you on again will anytime you want me just let me know and I’ll pop back and it was lovely meeting you a yes you too I would like to offer an invitation to you guys to come on to my show and do a live stream at some point if you wouldn’t mind yeah to and Andrew would to yes yeah I think I think I’d really like to listen to your experiences where and I’m not talking I’d love to know more about you guys so if we get that start Deborah how how can people get a hold of you if they want to you to help them with their own paranormal experiences and speak if you can look up my name on Google I will pop up if you put Deborah hatwell and UK up I will pop up there I’ve sent some links over to Laura that she can pop into the description I’ll send them over again when we finish talking a minute my my investigation company is called bbr investigations I’m on Facebook I’m on YouTube I’m on Twitter I’m everywhere I’m absolutely everywhere but just getting T my email is Debbie hatswell gmail.com or lowercase I’ve made it that easy for people just send me an email getting TCH leave a comment and I I’ll do what I can beautiful Amy more about yourself yes everybody can get a hold me at the UCM community at community. Universal citizentv.co.ke and we me and David Ellis are the admins over there and we have free resources meditations free documents for legal and business and AI tools and certified courses that you can take live with us beautiful Amy thank you and Laura yeah so you can get a hold of me at laura2 feathers gmail.com that’s with the number two um I do um self-empowerment sessions take you to your ancestral fire to meet your ancestors and so on so using like a variety of shamanic tools we can get you to a more empowered state of being beautiful and you D and if anybody would like psychic surgery sessions with myself if you’re feeling tired drained or there’s something going on and you need a bit of help head over to deen.com I’ve also got an up and cominging psychic surgery Soul retrieval Workshop so if you’re wanting to look into learning psychic surgery Soul retrieval how to start scanning your energetic body how to learn to begin communication to your ancestors your soul surgeons around you um it will start on the 13th of July on the 14th of July 6 till 900 p.m jool if we got a picture of the image um just to give you more of the information I don’t know where that’s gone H so the training will there we go so the training will include light generation Advanced energy clearing Soul retrieval and entity clearing learning how to do ancestral balancing in in a um practitioner format how to read the client’s energy field correctly Shakra recalibration surgery self psychic surgery how to send treatments backwards and forwards in time so if you’ve dealt with trauma you’re able to learn how to send treatments back to that past self and start changing the very essence of the past also um psychic surgery as a practitioner level as well so if you’re wanting to expand your energetic tools um join the workshop on July the 1 13th 14th and we also have £100 off summer solstice special so it’s only £600 for this lifechanging and ground breaking Journey thank you and again thank you Deborah thank you Amy thank you Laura you and as well those listening on rumble or YouTube or anywhere please drop a subscribe a comment a like and yeah thank you inspiring this thank you thanks debie bye everybody bye guys bye is not charging it say charging yes is now
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