Esteban Ocon Opens Up About Teammates, Alpine 2024 & Racing Max Verstappen

Sharing the experiences from his remarkable journey to F1, Esteban emphasises the significance of self-belief, respect, and attention to detail on the road to high performance.

🚨 Whether you are planning your next holiday, a business trip, or are interested in becoming a business owner with your own Travel Counsellors franchise, go to: https://www.travelcounsellors.co.uk/hpp to find out more.

Esteban Ocon is a French Formula 1 driver racing for the Alpine F1 Team, and is regarded as one of the most talented on the current grid. In this episode, Esteban shares the reality of racing from a young age and the astonishing sacrifices his family chose to make to support his dream.

Esteban reveals the pressure he was under throughout his youth and how his childhood was vastly different to his peers. His parents decided to sell their home and working garage to finance his career, in order to chase his dream of racing in Formula 1. He shares the impact this has had on him as an adult and the immense gratitude he has towards his parents today.

Reflecting on his rise through the ranks, Esteban opens up about the scrutiny and criticism he faced as a young driver. Rather than letting this impact him, he shares with Jake and Damian how he used this as motivation, transforming the negative feedback into inspiration. They discuss his 2019 hiatus from Formula 1 and the invaluable lessons he learnt during this time, observing the workings of the Mercedes team from the sidelines.

This episode is a deep dive into what achieving your dreams looks like, exploring teamwork, self-belief and why trust is so crucial.

0:00 Introduction
1:14 What Is High Performance?
3:27 Growing Up
4:48 Parents’ Sacrifice
8:28 Travel Counsellors
9:34 Childhood Pressure
13:06 Hope & Belief
18:54 Fighting With Max Verstappen
21:11 Calling Toto Wolff
25:45 Fighting On Track
32:00 Force India
35:08 Mercedes
41:25 Lewis Hamilton
43:28 Two Hands Two Feet
44:54 Regrets
47:07 First Win In F1
56:33 2023 Season
57:34 The New Season
58:04 The Vacant Seat At Mercedes
1:00:00 The Human High Performance Centre
1:03:07 Quick-Fire Questions

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#EstebanOcon #Ocon #F1 #Formula1 #Alpine #Renault #Mercedes #Ferrari #LewisHamilton #Hamilton #PierreGasly #Gasly #MaxVerstappen #Verstappen #LandoNorris #Lando #AlexAlbon #Albon #GeorgeRussell #Russell

I like to have good battles side by side fighting you know that’s what racing is all about I had a lot of weight on my shoulder very young with the amount of sacrifice that my parent puts you know we are living in a caravan basically dedicating our life to racing

And did you ever lose believe no I think I need that pressure Now set myself a high challenge to be able to perform I received the message from my engineer you are leading the Grand Prix you are leading the Grand Prix Seb is behind I’ve managed to hold him off we

R so all the pain that we had it was just all worth it just for that moment everybody’s human doesn’t matter who it is two FS two hands if he’s capable of doing it you can do it as well we were hey everyone it’s Jak kit listen

Before we get going I just wanted to drop in and say a huge thanks to all of our new subscribers this channel is growing like crazy and here’s the truth okay the more subscribers we get the bigger the channel becomes the bigger it becomes the greater the names that we

Can attract so before you watch this video please just spend 5 Seconds hitting subscribe it’s good for us but it’s also great for you and it really helps grow this channel thank you so much and enjoy well estban welcome to high performance thank you so much for

Welcoming me what do you believe high performance is um I I believe high performance is a mix of of a lot of things um I think a good routine uh that’s one thing good sleep um all the part of building basically and preparing you know to

Perform at the moment you know it’s it’s all the part that the eyes back that you can’t see um and it’s not just at the moment that you have to perform and you call it high performance it’s all the rest that you need to put together and

Be happy with to be able to perform at a high level so that’s what I believe high performance is and I wonder how much sacrifice plays into high performance for you because from all the people we’ve spoken to and all the research we’ve done about this conversation

Sacrifice was a word that cropped up time and time again what what does what do you think about when I when I say sacrifice yeah for me sacrifice has been part of of my whole life really um for some reason you know it kind of had to

Come all the time um at one stage in in my career if you know when were when I was young with my family doing doing go-kart at a national level um you know things were about to stop so uh my family decided to to sacrifice their own

Life for me to be able to succeed continue to pay uh the rest of my career and um luckily you know I got support from uh Formula One team Formula 1 management you know to continue um but then a bit later in 2014 when I won the

Former Rory title again you know things were about to stop and you know I was about to go back to work with my dad you know as a as a mechanic um and all of the sacrifices that we had to do were on the edge all ways but man made us manage

To continue uh the story and to continue the story um where we are today there’s no regrets to have you know I had a very different life um than most kids but there would be nothing now that I would change it for um no regrets So when you

Say you had a different life than most kids can you give us an example of that yeah different life than most kids I I never went to to ski on holidays for example um we were going on on racetracks driving on the wet driving on

On Ice uh that’s what we were doing um I never really went to birthday party of other the kids um we are rarely going on holidays or weekends you know with with my parents um it was all about going on onto the racetrack training um yeah all everything was was going

Into there so um that’s why I say you know I had a very different life compared to kids I had a lot of weight on my shoulder very young because uh with the amount of sacrifice that my parent puts um I had no rights to fail basically I had to succeed otherwise we

Are going to be in big trouble so yeah it’s it’s a different life being adult at a very young age is not an easy thing but um I mean where we are today uh I think we everyone in my family and everyone uh close by uh of us uh is

Proud of what we have achieved and uh could have gone uh to the other way to the wrong way but we’ve always believed it was possible and uh I’m glad that we thought like that so for those people that don’t know your story you you made

Reference to at the age of eight your parents decided to put their life on hold to support you would you tell us a little bit of the detail of what you mean by that yeah when um so when we were doing the the national championships you know some uh kids you

Know had the luxury to be able to be in in race teams or in Factory teams uh all of that to be in the big you know T and have you know mechanics lot of different engines and and all of that I had uh one use chassis uh two used engine uh that

We choosed carefully and we were recycling tires at testing you know going to the bin taking some tires from other kids that were still warm but still in very good condition putting them on on testing so just practicing like that and then we knew that arriving

To the race itself we would be uh having the same tools as the others um at the time but yes I mean we didn’t have the same amount of money um when we were younger compared to some others but it didn’t stop us from doing things well

And you know my dad and my mom they were doing the job of of 10 people with you know the catering the uh the T the the go-kart the engine everything you know we’re living in a caravan basically um for for five years um going around all Europe uh training and practicing and

And basically dedicating our life to to racing what was their job then that they stopped doing to do that so my my dad um was a mechanic yeah and my mom was working with him um to our little garage let’s call it so my dad was repairing

Cars and um yeah fixing car selling cars uh when when I was younger my mom was doing all the the paperworks helping him to to uh to do that business um but there were only two only both of them yeah and uh and they stopped doing that

Sold the garage sold the house uh the house in the garage was the same place anyway that’s where I grew up they sold it to support your racing yeah to support the racing yeah at what age uh that was in 20 2009 I would say 2009

2010 yeah so you were How old uh well I’m born in 96 so yeah 12 13 yeah do you remember the the day that you kind of had this conversation with your parents where they said estban we’re going to sell the house so you can race yeah I I

Never really had that conversation and I think that’s that’s where it was a good thing is that I was realizing how much you know you know work they were putting in uh you know for me to be able to to continue my passion um I was doing

Homeschooling as well on the side uh you know in the Caravan sending you know the the exams and everything by post wherever we were uh so it was quite crazy but yeah I mean I knew it in a way but they protected me super well um you

Know from that pressure and I was just enjoying everything I was doing I still have a memory I remember we are doing the Monaco cat Cup race and obviously we couldn’t Park in Monaco with a caravan to sleep so we are parking on the on the

I Monaco parking lot uh and I remember opening the Caravan door and having the SE view in front of the Caravan and uh and I remember at that time thinking yeah I’m GNA be racing in Monaco in goap you know and so it was it was just great

Memories tough memories at time for sure um very tough moments we’ve we’ve been through hey it’s Jake look I just wanted to dive in very quickly to talk to you about travel counselors and this is particularly for people who are looking for maybe a big change in their life so

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Just check out travel counselors. co.uk HPP it might just be the most important thing you’ve ever done are you aware of that research that child psychologist often talk about when you’ve described you you experience pressure and child psychologists often say that as children we experience three types of pressure we

Talk or stress they talk about there is a toxic stress where it feels intolerable yeah there is a tolerable level of stress and then there’s a positive framing on stress I’m interested in what your parents did to protect you from that toxic level of stress to enable you to go out there and

Cope with the pressure of having to deliver results I think they were probably protecting me in a way that all the stuff that I had to do was really the onrack thing you know they were leaving leaving it that to me and they were taking all the maximum of their the

Weight on their shoulders you know in the in preparing everything the truck getting the Caravan ready getting the go-kart ready all the loading thinking about all the paths that we needed going to talk to the right people and you know I was then sat in the go-kart having to

Think only about the racing and that was the main part that we had to do obviously but it was always you know a positive pressure um there was times of course where it was it went a little bit into the second stage of pressure that you you mentioned I remember uh we were

In Portugal and at some stage you know we were doing two or three days of testing at the time and uh we saw another driver that were going I was going running you know around the track on the evening and at the time I was you

Know quite skinny quite lean um and uh and my dad was like oh I’ve prepared you the bike uh you know so you go around the track and you you go cycling you know and I was very tired because we did you know three three laps of of the

Track and uh and I remember at the time he said no you still go you know and I’ve seen in his face that you know he was afraid that I would lack something maybe physically or something for for me to to get there so at the time that also

Transfer a little bit the stress to me so I went I was very tired but I didn’t really say that to him I I took it on me and I I went to do the laps you know around the track and I was what 13 at

The time um so I went cycling because I couldn’t disappoint him couldn’t disappoint the people that were you know working so hard you know with me and uh yeah we had to to make it happen we couldn’t fail so living in a caravan though I imagine there’s not many places

To go and hide from each other from your parents and there must have been moments where you did need to process disappointment or anger or or or or all those other complex emotions that as a teenager you’re navigating your way through how would you do that without like

Exposing those emotions to your parents I I I don’t need to hide I mean they I’m very happy to to share the emotions and any anyway the emotions that we have myself and my parents are the same ones they’re always linked to what’s happening on track what’s happening with

You know my career uh in general and it’s still the same thing you know we don’t need to even have a chat about that we know if something didn’t go the way we wanted we are going to feel exactly the same way so there was no

Need to hide we’re just talking about it um and then figuring out the solution it was always this the same process that we were going through and it’s still the same process nowadays can you talk us a little bit about Hope and belief yeah so when your parents as they would told the

Village the family the friends we’re selling up we’re going to buy a caravan and travel around Europe supporting estan how many people doubted them oh it’s a good question everyone for sure everyone people thought yeah that’s crazy what you guys are doing um even if I if I go

Back to it now I mean the strength that my parents had to do something like this it’s not you know if I was in the in their position now I would probably not be doing that taking that much risk you know but they saw something in me that

They believe it’s worth taking the risk I guess and um and as as I say we are proud about the the outcomes and how it went now but can give you an example there was that teacher that one day at school that teacher basically said yeah estan you should probably stop you know

Because it’s like tennis you know a backand and everything can be over it’s not nice to discourage somebody that young I think it should be the opposite you know you should try and motivate and and say it’s good what you are trying to achieve like best of luck uh you know

Not saying yeah don’t even try you know where we come from it’s not possible because that’s not true so tell us about your own self-belief then you’ve got the the the added pressure that no one else has that you’re racing against with the decision your parents have made so how

Did you keep believing and did you ever lose belief no coming in coming out yeah would describe that though because lots of people would love to be able to do it I think it’s harder when you are you know older to to make that go through and

Pass and make it go away but when I was younger I had that I had that capability even more to be to be doing that and the only thing I was dreaming about is is drive that go-kart on the weekends um you know seeing my dad working on it

And just go back on the racetrack that’s that’s where I felt good you know in that little 4×3 M Square t that we had with all the tools and everything and and the dog and the van and that’s that’s where that’s where I wanted to be

So when you were taking tires from bins of your opponents that they discarded how much of it did you use that as fuel to say it’s about my quality behind the wheel rather than the quality of my kit yeah but that’s that’s one thing you know it’s it’s not because we had

Secondhand chassis or secondhand engine that it was worse than the other in the the race teams for example um like my dad is probably the best mechanic I know I can comfortably say that um one day I would love for him to to work in Formula One I think that’s probably a tricky

Thing but um he would be definitely capable uh straight away to to be working in Formula One but he had this magic in his hands that you know I knew my go-kart would never fail for example there was always a safety you know in it he was the ones for the hardcore you

Know go-kart fans or people that know a little bit he was the one um creating that safety you know on the sprocket with the chain to have two bigger sprocket on the side and never have the chain jumping you know like the bicycles you know when you have the

Chain going off we had the double safety so when I was going on the curb the chain was never jumping and now people I’ve seen are selling this device because my dad had no idea you can put the rights on it and then people had to

Buy stuff from him but he basically made that uh first we made making them the best out of what we had in hands I think it’s the most incredible story and I love the fact that your face lights up when you talk about the memories of that

Time and it’s easy to you know discuss the the people that didn’t believe it or the challenges of being in a caravan or the pressure that was on you or the loneliness of not being able to go to kids parties but the Caravan was nice

You know but look at the way you talk about it now and have you have you taken the opportunity to just say to your parents like wow like you did this for me and I’m so grateful um maybe I should no we I mean we we

Chat about the good old times and you know sometimes I I just arrive I give them a hug um I think an action is probably more acts more than than words for us in our family you know we don’t need to talk you know that’s that’s what

I’m saying we just need to look at each other you know give a hug have a little laugh and we know you know what what what is was important to me is to give them back all the hard work they’ve done everything they’ve done for

Me um you know I’m I’m proud now and I can say you know that I’m giving back what what they’ve uh done you know they’ve got a house now I’ve helped rebuilding a house for them uh they are working for me now the garage you know

It was very tough my dad was doing a 20 hours work a day um you know on cars he was by himself so um you know even if he’s a superhero to me um there’s only so much a man can do um and yeah they are now working for

Me and and for the right things and and uh yeah it’s better that way so I’m giving something back you know to them they will have lose a lot of of time in their life you know working the way they did to me but I’m happy that now they

They are in good in a good situation I want to talk about the actual racing now cuz I think this is really interesting and I I know a lot of people will talk about the fact that you know the first time you came across Max fappen who’s

The big rival in uh in Formula 1 was when you were racing together in the junior categories and in goka it was those years you know when we were with my dad against you know him and his dad you know his dad at the experience before because he racing goar so they

Had a little bit of an advantage on that side but my dad and his dad at the time you know they were doing a little bit of a similar similar thing so really H off to them as well for what they’ve done absolutely so what was that rivalry like

Then between you and him and between the two dads as well because I’ve seen the go-kart World it can be fiery yeah it was to be fair it was very fiery but everybody was was uh a little bit scared you know of of J and and Max at the time

Because y was driving Formula 1 before so uh he is’s knew for his how Fierce and how you know um scary can be you know talking to to other young kids and all that uh on goar tracks but you know my dad and and myself we were never scared

Because we just wanted to race you know and wanted to race hard and we’ve raced hard we’ve race really hard and at times we cross lines you know um at at certain go-kart races um what do you mean by that well we mean by that is that we

Sometimes didn’t finish to the place that we were supposed to finish because of how hard the fights were you know in go-karts but all of that you know made me learn a lot um on how to race and and I hope you know it made him learn you

Know a good amount as well um and then we’ve met again in Formula 3 later you know from go-kart in 2011 three years break and then we met in Formula 3 racing for the title as well and and there I was hard racing as well so I’ve

Enjoyed know the racing with Max I’ve always enjoyed I think you know tough racing is always cool cool to me you know racing side by side being very close that’s what racing is all about um there’s nothing nothing else that uh makes me that exciting so when you raced

For the title in Formula 3 together who won it I did yeah I did but the following season after that he moved to F1 right yes yeah and you didn’t no I’m very interested in exploring that moment from your perspective you know you beat the guy and he gets the nod how was

That yeah I mean it’s things that were out of our control let’s say and and that’s the moment where I was actually about to go work with my dad as a mechanic as well yeah because the program I was in uh which was called ltis F1 team Jr and gravity sport

Management had no money for me to continue uh at the time and uh uh in in this transition from 2014 2015 um I was on the phone constantly calling Toto at the time and asking him you know if there was any solutions for me or because I’ve met him during that year

Because I won with a Mercedes engine in Formula 3 and um and with Gwen Toto and and Fred at the time Fred Vasser we found a solution for us to be able to to continue racing and to race in in gp3 and I won the

Title as well so I got in the m this junior program and from there on it was back on route but you know from Max winning the tie not winning the title finishing third and then going into F1 and me not having even an option to continue racing that was tough to

Swallow for sure um and I was very pissed off in those times but and how did you deal with that yeah that was that was difficult that was very very difficult cuz to me it was it was not fair that not saying that I would go to F1 because

I always believed that my time would come that if I put hard work enough got the results my time will always come but in those moments I wasn’t sure that I was going to even continue racing and for me that wasn’t fair and I’m glad that you know Toto Gwen Fred all these

Guys so that was not fair and uh found solutions for me to continue but what did you and I’m I’m always interested in The Quiet Moments where you said you were always emailing Toto and different people looking oh phone call calling looking for Solutions but I’m interested

When you go back to your parents home in Normandy at that stage what are you saying to them what are they saying to you that keeps your spirits up and stops you falling into despondency yeah well did you call Toto did you have him on the phone um so again they were coming

Up with Solutions yeah yeah exactly it was always about trying trying to find a solution but imagine you know I’m 17 years old at the time um and you know I’m I’m calling constantly one of the biggest faces in Formula 1 you know um but I remember just being honest you

Know and saying you know if you don’t have a solution for me that that’s it you know that’s I’m going to be stopping racing um so you are my only chance that’s what exactly I had uh for words you know to to Toto and uh and I

Remember him saying yes okay um we wait a little bit if your current program doesn’t have a solution I will find you a solution he said that and days have gone you know um 10 days 20 days 30 days and we’re arriving into late moments and I remember thinking you know

Toto has only one word and he’s going to call back and he did call back and and he said okay we found your solution what have you learned then for how to deal with pressure when it really applies itself to you I think I need that pressure now um

That’s the thing if if there is no pressure and everything is easy I don’t think I’m able to to perform as well you know so I’m in need of that little pressure that’s going to boost me a little bit more you know to be able to perform I think it’s gone

Into that way now where to get the best out of me I need to set myself a high challenge um and if the high challenge is there then I’m going to be able to perform but if it’s all chill all easy yeah I’m going to be you

Know 98% instead of 102 you know so a lot of people talk about the fact that Michael schumacker used to create Challenge and create obstacles and create friction cuz he knew it would make him perform better and I’ve sort of watched your career unfold you know whether it is the early races against

Max whether it is the time that you clashed and then he pushed you after the race whether it’s the you know the stuff going on with czecho um even you your current teammate when you both got paired together all the papers were writing oh everyone knows they they

Don’t get on with each other and all this sort of stuff so I wonder whether you’ve throughout your career had to do that to get the best out of yourself whether you whether you’ve gone looking for a battle rather than looking for friendship no I think I think that’s that’s not

Necessarily the right way um you know to say it I think the challenge you know it comes from more you know not knowing and uncertain about the future always yeah that’s what I’ve been growing with basically my my whole time and and it’s always been you know that’s it you know

I’m going to have to fight you know for that um and not being settle has been a strength of mine um in being able to perform uh you know at a better level always yeah so I don’t fear that a lot of driver would fear always this this uh

Issues and for sure you know it’s not a nice position to be in but you know I know that once I’m on track and I got the chance I will be able to perform you know if uh if you know I get the right pressure and that’s going to be pushing

Me but no the the the teamate things and the fights with Max we’ve never been able to be fighting on the same league let’s say because in Formula 1 because Max had a winning car and I had a Midfield car so those are circumstances that’s never been you know on the same

Page you always want to beat everyone that you race against um you need to work well with your teammate you know for the team to be able to get the car to a better place but on track yeah you need to you need to to finish in front

Of anyone that you can doesn’t matter if it’s your teammate or someone else that you are fighting with you you need to finish in front and uh and I like to be you know a tough opponent that’s it so explain what you mean by I like to be a

Tough opponent how do you go about being a teammate in Formula One what’s your what’s your approach yeah no teammate in Formula One what is important is to have a good relationship you know inside inside the team and whatever people write about you know um if it’s with

Pierre if it’s with with Sergio if it’s with Fernando whoever you know inside the team it’s always been you know good atmosphere we’ve always been chatting sharing setups uh sharing um ideas and and moving forward you know with with the team so it makes me laugh sometimes

What I read but it’s it’s really what people wants to hear um on track you know depends what Target you want to have of course you can’t you know collap with your teammates that’s not good but I like to have you know good battles that’s that’s what excites me you know

It’s it’s cool to have you know cool racing doesn’t matter who it is you know with if it’s your teammate if it’s someone else you want to beat everyone um but to be able to fight cleanly and to fight closeth and and have a proper battle you know no no one likes team

Order you know we are we have to obey to the teams that’s normal um and sometimes s it doesn’t make sense because you know we on different strategy and stuff but what’s good is to be you know having the same Tire age same strategy and then

Race you know that’s what we all love otherwise it’s it’s a fake Sport and uh and that’s what I grew up with um watching TV is is fighting you know fighting on track you know uh having the the switch on the exit different lines little bang of Wheels you know that’s

Cool that’s what I like you know that’s that’s what excites me about the sport really there’s research that says what you’re describing there about having a rival can actually enhance performance it makes you more motivated it they’ve done studies with athletes where you run faster if you’ve if you’ve got somebody

As a Target that you’re going or competing against who do you regard as your rival then that gets the best out of you and it’s true that you know any teammate that I got you know there’s always something that I’ve learned uh you know with um doesn’t matter who it

Was in junior categories in Formula 1 um I’ve always learned something and that’s important you know as a as a driver if you want to grow you need to always pick up something because if you don’t improve the others will and your level is going

To be obsolete you know you are going to be going backwards instead of staying at the same level so doesn’t matter it is you need to pick up the right points try to add them to yourself and then the the things that you see that is not doing as

Well obviously you leave them on the side but you can’t just be blindfolded go like that and not look you know on the side to towards what they do because it’s important to watch learn and then put it in place so when you were when you had this rivalry with Max in Formula

3 what was the biggest thing you learned from him yeah um but I was not in the same team at the time so it’s a little bit harder it’s a little bit more away um but the good thing is that I knew how Max was racing always you know in

Go-kart and I knew from go-kart you know how not to attack him where to attack him um I knew how he was going to be you know closing the door there or not closing the door there so you know I knew how to race against someone when you are racing for a

Championship is very important um and it’s something I miss now because I’m racing against many guys CU I’m not racing at the front so I look forward to be able to do that again we should talk about that in a moment and what your future might look

Like but I want to rewind a bit to your time at force India because I’m fascinated by towards the end of the force India period you knew the team were in financial trouble you were given the message don’t crash but at the same time you know you’ve got to push

Yourself to the limit to make sure that any potential team that might be looking decides that you’re the guy um and there was so much uncertainty outside of the car I’m really interested in what your mindset was like in in that period in your career yeah it’s it’s been a very

Strange period that one um cuz the onrack performance was was very decent um I was performing super well in qualifying good in the races as well got a bit unlucky at times so the championship order didn’t finish the way it should um but the pace itself was

There and and a lot of teams have seen it um what looks very dramatic shouldn’t have been you know dramatic cuz you know I’m not going to say the whole story there but we had two contracts uh on the table and two options and we knew I was not

Going to stay at force India that was that was very clear at the time but we had two contracts of teams one was signed so I just had to sign it I was going to race for the team in 2019 um but yeah we decided to not go to

This one and go to the other and it didn’t work out with the other it was for a misunderstanding between parties and things that I was not in control of um and that again goes to the point where it’s not fair you know because it’s not on performance it’s not on

Merit you know if if I had a a Bad season um and you know the performance wasn’t there I would have understand you know for me to be on the sideline but the fact that that was not the case again goes back to the point of 2014

Where you know this is something not in my control it’s not normal we have to find you know Solutions so I in the end I didn’t lose a year because I’ve learned a lot you know with Mercedes in 2019 being reserved they were dominating um and there are still plenty of things

That I use now um and makes me more of a complete driver when I came back in 2020 but yes I’ve missed driving so much and that gave me I would say the love of the sport even more because I’ve realized how lucky I was you know to be

Racing in there and when you are so focused on performance performance performance getting everything around you forget how lucky you are to be driving one of those cars and when I came back in 2020 I really I said okay now you’re not going to take the smile

Away ever from my face when I’m driving a Formula One car so that’s why I’m always happy that is a crazy story you’ve got to drive because you’re driving for full sen at the time plus you’ve got another Drive lined up and all you to do is sign it and then you’ve

Got another team that wants you and you end up with no drive at all exactly yeah yeah that wasn’t really well executed when was the moment that you realized there was going to be no drive for for that year but I found out it was not going to happen you know by

The end of 2018 it was clear that there was everybody was signed and that was it you know and um and then turning up at the first race and speaking to Mercedes of you know when was I going to be testing the car and they say they said

Oh yeah you are going to test in three or four months then I came back in the car back then and and I cried in the parking lot I remember and yeah luckily we found a solution to come back again but was that one of the was that one of

The lowest or was that the lowest point in your care I think that was the lowest yeah Australia uh 2019 CU I was super happy for the team also on the success that they were having because I was part of that I was contributing with the simulator work the all the

Development but I was like you know what what if I was driving that car you know on the races as well it’s it’s so dominating it’s so fast um yeah I I was seeing myself but not being there you know on track and and yeah that was quite tough I guess it

Makes it harder when the car is so fast right yeah for sure and you to sit and watch yeah and then of course smile in front of the media smile in front of the two drivers are driving the car for sure for sure and try and be the ultimate

Professional in the garage definitely definitely yeah man what was that like having to do all that yeah tough but it’s my job you know that’s what I have to do I have to be uh I have to to get all the information from you know the simulator

Being able to have clear feedback to them tell them what was best for them to be able to put that on the car on Saturday before uh the qualifying um and yeah then seeing them you know doing poll and WIS um which was great because you know that valued also

My work and and how much I was doing you know good choices uh you know with with uh with the simulator work that I was doing with the whole team but yeah that was that was tough to you must have been feeling frustrated and angry and the

Sense of Injustice where did you go to what did you do to be able to process those feelings and move on I think you always need to to think how privileged we are you know even if that was not the situation that I wanted you know um if I for example

Put my dad in that position you know that he would also want to be in a better position and be driving but if I put it there you know I could have been working with him you know in the GU and I was still getting

Paid you know to be at the races to be working with the best engineers in the world to be developing the kind of simulator and there is always a perspective to have you know and I think that helps a lot in saying you know look

Open your eyes could be a lot worse you know you could be not there in the Formula 1 World at all you have the past for the whole year you are you know all the team bosses everywhere we are going to find Solutions you know there there’s

There’s a whole things that was waiting for me and that’s I think what helps to combat that frustration what did you learn about you about the sport about the people around you that was really helpful in that time yeah yeah it’s super super helpful it’s not I’ve learned that it’s not

Only the results that can lead to you know a good future or an opportunity you know you need to take the lead on all these uh you know contract negotiation and all these things you personally me personally on my team you know I’ve I’ve I have full Trust you

Know in my team and that was not because of them that things went wrong you know it’s it has to be straight conversation you can’t go into you know a couple messages or whatever it has to be a very clear conversation and you need to take

The lead and you need to be in advance you know uh having chats like that so those are things that you you learn um I’ve learned that this is not my favorite uh subject in racing clearly not I hate I have to say I think it’s uh some

People like these challenges or managers yeah because what I like about the sport is the performance is the on track is the cars um all the lines on contracts uh this is not what excites me it’s not it’s not fun what did you learn most from standing at the back of the garage

Of at the time the dominant most successful team in the sport and seeing how Toto wolf LED that team yeah yeah that was that was incredible to see um and I’ve learned how what a team needs from a driver uh basically in those times um and how a team works from the

Inside who communicates with who at what stage um and how it can be quite chaotic at times as well um I mean that everybody thought you know it’s it’s easy for Mercedes you know everything is perfect procedures uh everything works super fine um they’re going to win every race um they are

Going to have no argument during the races or stuff like that but trust me on the inside it’s it’s fire um you know people sometimes are shouting to each other and and you know there’s crucial moments you need to take a decision people are not sure but it’s how they

Overcome these moments and learn from these you know that made them as strong as as they were at the time and as strong as they are still now um and you know everybody’s human you know and and that’s that’s where you can see that everyone can be achieving these things

You know because you can’t you can’t expect someone you know to be so much better than you you know two feets two hands as my my dad always you know said doesn’t matter who it is two feets to hands if he’s capable of doing it you

Can do it as well with work so was there a moment where you watched the work that Hamilton did aside from his natural ability and thought that’s incredible this is something that you remember seeing yeah what was that definitely um I remember Louis coming from like different marketing events and all these

Thing in the race weekend um you Lou is a very busy man uh you know apart from racing that’s some of the differences compared to to some drivers you know which are more focused into the the racet track he’s got you know a very busy life in general and

Seeing how he switch his Focus from one thing to another for me that that kind of amazed me um that he was straight away on point back with his engineer after something completely different um and he didn’t like take 10 minutes to refocus and rework with his Engineers because

You don’t have time to do that and he always had his you know paperboard uh with notes um and he was always having notes not to forget things from one year to another or from one session to another and uh this is what I do as well

Now so did you make notes before then no I was not doing notes before then and now I got all my notes inside here uh always inside my my phone so when would you make these notes you know performance meetings problems to fix um you know all of the points that we have

To go through um that I I’ve put basically as an example and then I’ve just phrased things to then being able to retransfer to the engineers at the right time um but if I don’t write them at this at the exact moment that I’m going to come out the car I will not

Remember exactly or they’re going to be much more vague you know if I go to a marketing event on the on the left and then come back and I’m like I had something very interesting but I don’t remember it imagine how much that would cost basically to us to our performance

I love that phrase he D two hands yeah is reminds you that everybody else is on the same yes starting point as you do you have anything else that that you use just to remind yourself to be in the moment and go and perform I think no

Regret is the important thing as well you know to arrive to a race and and think you know that I’ve done everything that I can in in in my in my power in my capability to be able to be ready um you know know before before a race so there

Is no regret I think that’s a super important thing imagine if you retire from your career and say what if I would have done this or that you know I think living with regrets is probably the worst thing ever because there is a certain time in your life

Which is crucial um that’s probably when you are between 18 and 30 or 35 then your life is probably done that’s probably very rude to say sorry we’re done it’s all over very we’ve been gone a long time no but your carer is settled you know what I mean from there um and

And if if you don’t take theor guys sorry no offense but if you don’t take the opportunity when it rise up or if you if you you know don’t think that you’ve done something right if you live with regrets yeah I would I would not you know forgive myself so do you regret

The mistake mes that were made that meant you had a year out of Formula 1 or have you learned to process that and take the good things I don’t I don’t think so anymore at the time yes for sure but um I think now looking at it I’ve

Learned a lot definitely I’ve met some awesome people um at the time some people that I’m working with now for example uh that have joined my team as well um yeah um no because I had a different you know path after that of course what

If you know that uh that year uh was and I would have driven I don’t know what it would have led into but um let’s not leave in the past let’s live in the future that’s what I believe do you think Alpine got a better driver because

Of that year that you sat and watched probably a more complete driver yeah why because I’ve learned you know things that I would not have learned if uh if I was driving at the time um I’ve learned to to have an outside eye see how a team Works see you know how a

Team you know need his driver to operate in certain moments and I was able to to bring quite a lot of things to to Rena at the time as well um and I think because of that I was much more complete for sure and do you think that the fact

That you had that realization that it can fall away like that I mean it’s over in an instant that also changes your mindset I look at someone like Daniel Ricardo now and I think like you know how quick this can be over I think it almost re-energizes a driver B for sure

For sure and that’s what I’m saying you know that you are not going to take my smile away you know when I’m on the racetrack because I’m racing you know the fastest cars in the world and I’m extremely privileged to be you know placed in one of these seats um and when

You are so focused into your thing you you kind of forget that sometimes so talking of smile let’s talk about the smile of the day you won your first race in Formula 1 I say first cuz not last right first thank you um I want to just

Go through that day with you because I was rooting for you at home I know loads of people were like it’s amazing when a driver gets their first win in Formula 1 and I knew your backstory I knew what you’d been through to get to the sport and I remember like Sebastian man

Constantly he was looking down all the time wasn’t he he was constantly sort of Faking and I know and I and I was thinking what is it like in that cockpit right now it was long it was a very long race but yeah what a moment um first thing a decent qualifying a

Decent qualifying because we qualifying in the top 10 um who qualify eight you know unexpected then to get closer to that than eight because eight was really there was not more that we could have done with the car we had at the time uh um but seeing the rain you know coming

Up um and the opportunities that it could bring uh I remember oh there’s may be something good to play here um and uh and yeah arriving into turn one chaos arrive um I’m coming out second uh after the first Corner what you thinking at that point then I’m

Thinking at that point you know okay you know that’s it’s going to be an interesting race uh at that time Lewis was still in front so I knew you know I couldn’t get you know LS I could not have gone closer or being able to overtake him but Red Flag straight away

So red flag we see the track still wet um so everyone goes back on in then going out on track again everything’s dry and I’m like but now we have two bucks but I’ve never experienced anything like this where you are not racing but you need to box

To change tires so I’m I’m second there so imagine thinking about losing that place to box but it is the right thing to do so what do we do you know and then I see seven time well yeah seven time world champion not going in the pits and I’m

Pitting and I’m like but they usually don’t take the wrong decision so am I taking the wrong decision then I look behind everybody’s done that and I’m like okay you know that’s good exiting George Goes in front but he did he was not allowed so I was going to be racing

George at the time or Nicholas I don’t remember if it was George or nichlas and then um I received a message from my engineer saying you are leading the Grand Prix then I’m like I didn’t think you know I could hold the lead for the whole

Time because we are not the quickest on track but I thought a strong Podium position is possible so head down let’s get into it you know and then and then you haven’t got to the main bit yet no I haven’t got to the main bit and

Then and then yeah Seb is behind um I know how aggressive Seb is in a race and how he studies you know where the other car or where the other driver has a weaker spot and quickly I realized my weaker spot was turn one which is not good because that’s the

Overtaking how did you realize that because he was he was catching up so much more in 2 turn one so I knew that was the place that he would try something and he was catching up be braking later every lap compared to me and uh and I was ready to just close off

Last second you know if he was going to be coming in and uh yeah I’ve managed to hold him off good Pit Stop really good Pit Stop I’ve managed to pull a gap at the pit stop which was a crucial moment and then the other scary moment for us was the blue

Flags when there was uh another car in in front of me cuz I was losing lap time and Seb was really pressuring but yeah we’ve done enough uh to to hold him off and then yeah unbelievable we we won the race when did you think I’m going to win

This um on the last two laps how did that feel well not good because then I’m like stop thinking about that you know something’s going to happen you know it’s there’s a phrase in France that say yeah don’t think you are going to win until you win because that brings to bad

Bad moments um so then I was refocusing again and going again into it but yes I when I crossed the line it was just yeah Revival moment um and I really saw you know all the the hard moments you know that we’ve been through me my family and

All the people that that are close to me and yeah it was just all all of these difficult times or all the pain that we had it was just all worth it just for that moment moment so yeah beautiful and how long did the moment

Last um I had a good holiday because it was exactly summer break after that so I was the last winner for a month and your parents weren’t there were they no they were not there but I called them very quickly on FaceTime I remember my all my

Family turned up to my house um and they all you know cheers for me with a glass of champagne so so nice yeah it was it was great front page of leip yeah yeah front page of L it’s cool cool it’s it’s not something that I’ve dream as a kid

But it’s it’s awesome to see and it was a very nice nice uh yeah page so thanks to that and I’m interested like you described that ability to drive with a smile on your face to appreciate how lucky you are to be doing it was there any time during that that particular

Race where you gave yourself a moment to just appreciate that you were leading a Formula 1 race did you did you ever consciously do that no at the time I didn’t have uh you know that thought I thought let’s do a proper job we enjoy after now at the time honestly the focus

Was you know that that that is my chance I can’t I canot seize it and talking about regret I got one regret in Formula 1 um at One race and that was Baku 2018 um Baku 2018 I could have finished uh on the podium uh very clearly um but I had that touch

With ronen um on on to turn three and um I was probably I didn’t see him on the on the right spot and I’ve touched him uh at the time and we both retire from the race but that was a chance that I didn’t seize um and uh and

I always thought you know if the chance like that’s coming up up you can you cannot not take them it’s not possible you need to seize the moments uh when it arise and that is something I’m trying to you know remember all the time

Amazing and what did it do for you as a driver to be a race winner um I think it really boost the confidence that that you know you are capable of winning a race um I always believed in myself being able to to do it but you never have the fullprof so

That was the the confirmation the proof also the fact that we are doing a good job um you know as a team we are doing the right things and that is super powerful in giving you confidence for the rest of the year um and yeah all of that obviously brings

Um calmness um Peace inside the team and when you are about to take a crucial decision you know that it’s it’s the right one and and that is the right thing to do and I’m interested in also what it did do for the team I mean I

Love the fact that a French driver wins in a French car for a French team I mean that’s a great story in itself but actually for the people that are working in the team they’ve now got a race winner driving their car did you notice a difference with them because I think

People from the outside don’t understand that you’re you were what 25 then 24 25 when you won that race and you’re trying to lead a group of mechanics a group of Engineers a group of technicians like as the lead leader you’re the driver as the leader you’re now leading them as a race

Winner yeah so did you and they feel that I think you know our team you know always trusted us as as abilities and being able to you know do a do a good moment and I think that’s very important also for a team to to believe that you know they

Have the best driver in their cars you know to be performing um and I didn’t see a huge change you know in that uh in that way um because you know I’ve seen images of of them you know cheering and those moments and and it’s like if they if

They kind of knew that it was it was going to be okay you know uh when I had the opportunity and and that’s great you know to have such a a trust uh you know from your team to be able to see you know how much joy it brings to them you

Know after such hard work and and every time you know we we have these moments in the team can rewatch The images after because I was racing obviously and I see how much it means to them and yeah that means the whole world really nice well let’s talk about your confidence then

Ahead of the new season um how do you describe 2023 as a season first of all 2023 has been a season of little bit up and down I would say um it hasn’t been the the smoothest season um on all all means uh we’ve had some very good moments um but

Tougher ones at times um we’ve seized a podium in Monaco um that was amazing as a team we’ve seen we’ve seized another podium in zort as well uh which has been has been great um but we I felt didn’t improve as much as we did from 21 to 22

Um and as much as I would have liked from 22 to 23 I think we we kind of went a little bit backwards on on many things um and that’s what we’re going to be working on uh this year to try and and maximize you know our potential you know

On and off track in a way and uh I hope that this is going to be successful for us and what about you personally when you reflect on last year what what what would you like to do better in this coming season yeah there there’s a lot

Of things um that I would like to do uh better I think I’ve never really been 100% happy with how I felt you know inside the car um it hasn’t been as straightforward as it has been in 21 or 2 too um and I want to get that feeling again um to

Feel that we move forward you know every time we do a session because I look at 2024 and I think in so many ways it’s the perfect season for EST ban Aon because you’re a driver that thrives when your back is against the ball or when the pressure’s on right you’ve got

One year left on your contract to Alpine 75% of the grd are out of contract at the end of this current season we know that one of the most coveted seats at Mercedes is available we know you’ve got a great relationship ship with Toto and you remain a part of the sort of

Mercedes family so if ever there was a time for you to deliver 2024 is the time right yeah I mean it’s every year is important in Formula One you know that’s the political answer no but that’s that is true you know you’re only as good as

Your last race you know that’s what we say in Formula One but yes it is an important year um in my career that’s for sure um and I want to do the best I can I don’t want any regrets you know at the end of the year um it’s going to be a

Lot of work on uh and outside the track there’s going to be chats obviously because I’m I’m in my last year of my contract have those chats begun already um come on we like the truth on this podcast yeah I know um yeah for sure for sure you know things have

Started um already but for everyone it’s it’s normal um and how are you dealing with them differently you said said they experience yeah I’m not a big fan I’m still not a big fan of these chats but you know I’m in a different place um that I was uh back in

2019 um you know I know a lot more about these Sports I’ve done a lot more races I’m a race winner I’m a Podium finisher yeah there’s a lot more arguments that goes into um into my favor but yes the most important is the job that you do on

Track always and I believe in that I believe the political side is is secondary and I hope that uh it will remain and I know you’ve also got the human high performance center at Alpine as well where you’re looking for those little 1% I’d love you just to explain

To us the kinds of things that you do in your day to find the edge like the food you eat the exercises you do the time you get up in the morning what does a day look like for you preseason now when you’re fully ready yeah preseason

Happens for me not in the HPC anymore that’s when I was younger it happened there at endstone um and I’ve learned a lot there but I do train um in a center called 3:1 perform and you know together with my coach Tom as well uh we link

With with the center there um and we work on all the different aspects you know there is the coordination side of things the eye tracking side of things the reaction work the balance work the mental side um and every year it evolves in a way that every year we find

Different things to work on on how to get better um you know the the things that I need to work on now are different than 2018 for example and that takes us probably 50% of the time compared to the normal training and which are the other

50 um the other 50 is the normal gym sessions and physical the cardio um and all the cowork the nek work and all that but it’s um yeah you would be surprised to see how much goes into uh the mental side and and how much goes into the

Cognitive work basically because we we need to be fit yes we need to be strong especially in case of Crash and we need to um have a good cardio not to you know feel dizzy or blurry after half of the race but we need to react quicker we

Need to to be more sharp on our uh reactions on our decisions we need to talk clear to the engineers we need to remain focused for 24 races um and all of that it’s it’s a big work it’s the part of the iceberg and the part of the

High performance that I was talking about is that if all of that goes perfect then you are able to perform well on track and that’s what I call high performance and is there one particular mental exercise that you do that you feel gives you an edge yeah

It’s we have an exercise called working under pressure and that’s an exercise where realistically you can’t get 100% wins but so that’s the pressure because it’s going to be too fast for you doesn’t matter who you are but you need to respond as well as you can to to this

Pressure and make as many as little mistakes as you can for example so you are if for example you do a mistake you need straight away to be back you know know to your focus zone not to be doing more mistakes because if you judge yourself for example after doing one

Mistake you’re going to do two or three more and uh and that’s an exercise that we do quite a lot listen I’ve love this conversation before we finish we’ve got a few quick far questions problem run through these right I think you’ll enjoy these apart from you who do you believe

Is the most naturally talented driver on the Formula 1 grade at the moment um Charles lir Maxin yeah why I’ve raced with them since what Charles 2005 Max 2010 and doesn’t matter what conditions we were you know always um neck and neck or in the top three always so them who

Is the greatest driver of all time and why uh Michael Schumaker why because he was the more complete one if you could see one driver apart from yourself win the title in 201 24 who would you choose I think Max is going to win again anyway yeah and the

Year after as I don’t know about the year after but this year yeah I think I think he has he’s the favorite for sure what pre-race rituals do you have um there are a few things that I always do um I always jump on the same side in

The car always on the right side so that’s one of the things that U that I will do um superstition I don’t know it’s things that um I feel better in doing what message would you give to a teenage estban who was just starting out on his Motorsport Journey

Um probably don’t worry um everything be be all right I think if if I knew you know things would have been all right I’ve yeah I would have probably enjoy even more the things you know there are times where even if we we had the you know enjoyment and all that

It was tough times you know this Caravan period um but yeah everything be all right it will work so enjoy what’s the best piece of advice you’ve ever been given the best piece of advice I’ve ever been given Um there are so many so many good pieces of advice I I’ve been given probably from my dad um at a very young age yeah probably nothing is unclimbable or the if you want it to be achieved um you can you just need to put the right

Mindset into it and the right effort um that is probably a very valid uh you know point from him and it’s it’s a different topic but you know my dad told me recently that uh CU he was a cyclist and he was when he was younger he he’s been

Um you know very good but he didn’t have the chance to continue he didn’t have the right people around him and he told me that one day he was 15 or 16 knew his career was over he went on on his bed like that and thought if one day I got a

Kid he wants to do a sport um I’m going to do everything that I have in my hands that I’m capable of uh for him to succeed and not have the failures that I had so very early on in his life um he

Had set a plan you know for me to get to where I wanted so um yeah it’s it’s a different topic but I had I had to say it that is that’s quite moving actually isn’t it all those years ago your dad you Dad thought that

And it happened and look it’s been a great conversation the final question is what would you like to like to leave our listeners and our viewers thinking about what is your Golden Rule to living a high performance life I think there’s one golden route first of all is doesn’t matter where you

Get to if you succeed in anything always remember where you come from uh that’s the most important don’t forget the people that you’ve helped that have helped you and um don’t turn your back uh ever um it’s important to be respectful to to everyone around doesn’t

Matter who it is um that’s a golden rule that I always put in myself and that’s how I’ve been born and raised um but yes to have a high performance life um I don’t know if it’s English to non neglige anything is that English no what does it

Mean to take care of every little details that is that is the most important thing you know any details that you you can think of even if they’re not the most important in the end they will make a difference listen I think that everyone that’s listened to

This conversation will have you if if you’re not their favorite driver already you’ll be their second driver for the thank you for the grid this season it’s been a great story and a great conversation thank you guys thanks for having me thank you pleasure