Full Council Reconvened from 20 February 2024 adjournment, 27 February 2024, 7.00pm | BCP Council

A meeting of the BCP Council. Agenda, reports and other documents are available from:
https://democracy.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=284&MId=5386

[Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] good evening members and um members of the public and any press attending um this reconvened full council meeting of BCP Council on 27th of February 2024 I’m Council Leslie Deadman and as chairman of the council I will be

Chairing this meeting and I will be supported by vice vice chair counselor Simon bu um I will now set out the housekeeping arrangements for this meeting please note that the meeting is being recorded by the council for for live and subsequent broadcast and it will be published on the the council

Website for a minimum of six months um in order to assure this meeting is managed effectively please could everyone follow the ground rules if you wish to speak please raise your hand clearly to indicate where there appears to be consensus in the meeting for a motion I will ask if there’s any

Dissension and when a formal vote is required this will be carried out by a show of hands unless a recorded vote is requested which requires support from a quarter of the members present at the meeting and um if members wish to leave the meeting can you please just indicate

To me that you are going in accordance with the Constitution I will allow for Comfort breaks as appropriate um it would be helpful if we don’t leave the meeting actually during the middle of the of the debate um and points of order raised from the floor should State the applicable constitutional

Provision um I will assume that all councilors uphold the highest standards of conduct and treat each other with courtesy and [Applause] consideration as a reminder this is a meeting being held in public and not a public meeting the public are in attendance to observe and and observe the proceedings and the

Debate so can I say to all members of the public I can s see in the gallery and possibly at the back um please remain silent through the items so for this meeting we go on to first of all this agenda has item one apologies chief executive can you read out the apologies

For this meeting this part of the meeting sorry G thank you chairman no problem uh apologies have been received from councelor Hazel Allen councelor Julie Bagwell councelor John Beasley councelor Philip Broadhead councelor Judy butt councelor Patrick Canan councel Brian Castle councelor John challiner councelor Joe Clemens councelor Peter Cooper councelor Bobby dove councelor

Wayne far councelor David flag councelor chrispen goodle councelor Jeff Hannah councelor Mark how councelor Rachel mement councel Karen rampton councelor Michael Tarling and councelor Lawrence Williams those are the ones I’ve got recorded thank you um Chief oh sorry yes councelor rice apologies from councelor Pete miles thank you anybody oh

Yes okay thank you anybody else know of anybody who’s missing right I’ll move on to agenda item two then chief executive can you report on any Declarations of Interest received thank you chair we’ve had no Declarations of interest at this point but if any member is required to make

Any declarations and could they please follow the flowchart that set out in the agenda Castle North over is indicating um I’m a trustee of uh Russell coat so we’ll leave on item 16 thank you anybody else right so um we now move on or back to item 12 the tency strategy for

Registered providers of social housing 2024 to 2029 councelor will will uh councelor Wilson sorry I understand you’ll move the recommendation and I think Council ear is going to Second um would you like to um move the recommendation thank you chair um the localism ACT requires councils to prepare and publish a

Tendency strategy for social housing providers as part of its strategic role for the area that sets out matters which uh providers should have regard for when formulating policies relating to the type of Tendencies they will grant we as a registered provider of social housing must also have regard to our own

Strategy the strategy set out supports harmonization of the approach to the use of flexible fixed term Tendencies within the council’s own housing stock all tendency strategies held by the previous Legacy authorities supported the discretionary use of flexible fixed term Tendencies the use of flexible fixed term Tendencies has been however

Relatively low and most providers have moved away from using them the reasons for this are that they do not achieve their aims create uncertainty for tenants add complexity increased resource requirements are required to manage them effectively and they can act as a barrier for supporting tenants to manage their tencies the revised tency

Strategy supports the use of life time Tendencies rather than fix time Tendencies to provide uh more Assurance to tenants contribute to sustainable communities and ensure effective tendency management it will continue to allow the discretionary use of fixed-term tendencies in appropriate circumstances where it aligns with efforts to make use of social housing

And where it helps to sustain tencies um provided so um I’m very happy to bring this forward thank you CH thank you councelor Wilson um councelor Earl will you second yes thank you chair happy to Second counselors um does anybody wish to speak on um this recommendation I’m looking around for

Hands no I think that’s um right so um councelor Earl did you actually wish to speak were you reserving your right or were you just not speaking I don’t think there’s any need right councelor Wilson do you need do you wish to sum up no good thanks

Chers right counselors um we need to move to the um the vote the appropriate method might be consensus do we have any dissension so I think that’s a consensus vote thank you very much on to item 13 active travel fund atf4 councelor Hadley um I understand you’ll move the recommendation and then

Councelor Burton will second the move councelor Hadley thank you chair um last year the chief executive under urgency Powers accepted 3.78 million from the Department of Transport active travel England um for walking weeding and cycling improvements we were successful in no small part in attracting funds

Thanks to the efforts of our officers um in in coming up with a complete um local cycling and walking infrastructure plan for the BCP area and in bidding for a generous allocation it was actually four times the um the indicative uh sum that we were told the money is earmarked for

Specific schemes as as outlined in the basis of our bid which is attached to your papers tonight um this paper requests Council delegation to implement the schemes which extend and connect previous work and there’s four schemes to be built so that’s Wallace downroad phase three um measures to support

Permanent School streets at Four Street School streets we’ve already identified as being permanent um the beta footpath and cycleway improvements and Bournemouth Gardens uh path including the branken wood road crossing and then money for development of U um of design and consultation for a further two schemes um the Wallis down Road phase

Four which is um alongside the university boundary andb University and the Wallis down Road Phase 5 at the crossroads which is a particular um crash um hotspot um it’s something of a technic is the council for the council um because um the chief executive has already um signed off uh the the the

Award um as I say last March um but uh clearly we need to to go through through the process because because of the the value of the overall uh sum um so we’re ask asking Council to ratify the chief executive decision and to delegates getting on with it to the

Service director for infrastructure in consultation with myself thank you thank you councelor Hadley councelor Burton yes I’m more than happy to second that chair and um I reserve the right speed if needed thank you councelor bur um councilors who wishes to speak councelor rice I was just wondering why uh it’s

Taken so long for it to come to council I got very confused with the dates um but thank you for the clarification any more questions before I ask councel Hadley to elucidate uh yes councelor rby uh thank you mad chairman yeah just a very very quick one um really pleased

To see this com to council I just wanted to focus on the um School streets permanent measures and really welcome them um in the last meeting of the environment and place overview and scrutiny um board we went through this quite a lot and done really good review

On it with some positive and negative findings I think um the committee found overall that it was a really good thing that we were doing so we’re really pleased to see this um Coming forward and looking forward to seeing um more opportunities for it to be rolled out to schools in the future

Thanks thank you counselor thank you chair is a question with regards to point 18 summary of equality implications um so it’s saying that all schemes will be subject to individual equality impact assessments I’m just wondering if someone could give a bit more information about that and are we

Being asked to make a decision about these schemes in the absence of those impact assessments thank you any more hands um councilor Burton do you wish to um speak before I ask Council Hardley to sum up thank you I don’t too right councelor Hadley would you

Like to sum up and as you know there’s a question from councelor Rice which you may be able to clarify thank you chair um yes um it it is a good question uh the the team have been busy preparing the ground and and starting to do some

Of some of the work um I think it’s really about tying up the the the loose ends in terms of a decision that the chief executive has already made um the the the bid was actually made under the previous administration um and uh and and so I wasn’t involved in it at the

Time but but certainly as Council R’s highlighted very much welcome these schemes coming forwards um the the concept of um of the equalities impact assessments being with individual schemes they are very different schemes um obviously the beta one extends what we’ve already done at White Clift so the equalities impact assessment we hope

Would be very similar to that um The Wallace down Road ones extend what we’ve done at Wallace down road so again you there will be similar work but it is different for each of the scheme so we need to go through the eia to go with the designs of the individual schemes

Rather than rather than this which is just about receiving the money and spending it councilors um we now um move to the vote do we have consensus or should I ask for a show of hands any dissent councelor Bartlett so we Sor oh so do we need thank you councelor Bartlet we will

Record that on to item 14 South part of the Beach Road car park councelor Cox um I believe you’re going to move this recommendation and I think councelor Slade will second councelor Cox I am Madam chairman yes the um the Beach Road car park has been identified uh for

Potential development since about 2015 15 after almost a decade of discussions uh the time is right now to some do something proactive and positive with this site uh proceeding with the disposal of the southern part of the car park uh on the open market will generate

A capital receipt for the ccil uh this will help fund our transformation program and enable the development uh of new homes for the by the private sector uh alongside an improved and retained public car parking so therefore I would recommend uh that the council approve the disposal of the southern part

Section of the car park on the open market subject to Future cabinet resolutions to uh appropriate the site for planning purposes once the car sou car park has formally been closed to delegate the authority to the corporate property officer in consultation with the Director of Finance the director of

Law and governance and the portfolio holder for dynamic places to select the preferred offer and to finalize the detailed terms of the disposal and finally to support the reprovision of the car park uh and the development of the business Case by the director of infrastructure for the modernization and

Improvement of the retained car parking area based on the use of uh credential borrowing in consultation with the director of uh commercial operations the W counselors and the relevant portfolio there thank you thank you councelor Cox um councelor slay do you second I reserve my right to

Speak thank you right um thank you counselor so um item 14 do we have um any speakers on the motion councelor h thank you madam chair um I hope that members have actually seen and read the I believe there were at least two statements that were actually submitted

At the meeting uh earlier last Tuesday regarding this item um and I think it’ll come as no surprise that I’m I have serious reservations about the sale of this car park many residents that live within the local area have experienced fr rtion of inconsiderate parking on a

Busy day and the loss of this car park is perceived as adding to this problem um it’s interesting the choice of words that councelor CX has used proactive and positive action I have a feeling that the residents that have actually written to me of which there have been numerous

Would completely disagree because they do feel that this car park should be retained um and one of the primary reasons that they’ve stated this is because Rockwater has arrived rock water wasn’t there when the land was declared Surplus in 2015 um and since then they have been

Very successful the car park and Brom Chine is now completely full most days even during the day and in the evening and Beach Road would be the natural overspill car park to actually cater for the patrons that are actually attending Rockwater I’ve had so many people write

To me about this um and one other thing that’s actually been pointed out to me is that it’s it’s just really interesting that we had the budget setting last Tuesday and there was a lot of comment made about resources being completely stretched that we had to make

Cuts and so on and so forth yet here is an opportunity and I can read the room that chances are this is actually going to be voted through but before you do that members just think that you could actually achieve a much better sale price here for this piece of land if it

Was sold with some kind of outline planning because it would actually give a potential purchaser an idea of what is achievable and therefore what would be deemed as a reasonable price so actually to sell it off as a piece of land I think actually would not fetch you best

Value so therefore if we’re really that stretch of resources I think you need to rethink whether you’re actually acting in the best interest of our taxpayers by accepting what is potentially a lower sum because you’ve decided not to go for any kind of outline planning um I think I’d actually finish off because

Obviously we don’t have that much time that um I have had representation which may have actually been circulated to some members here from the southern pool leaon chairman Group which is basically all the residents associations that actually border onto uh Beach Road car park and indeed some actually have Beach

Road car park within their geographical area that it says that a comprehensive transport survey including parking at Beach Road car park needs to be implemented independently and that um they had actually carried out a comprehensive survey are you winding up yes a comprehens it’s just us looking at

The clock and it’s said 151 that’s all minus sorry sorry I am really sorry uh Madam chair I I will I will wind up by saying that they felt that a three-day survey in August cannot be deemed as comprehensive thank you thank you counselor good try there um councelor Kate sammon I think

You were next thank you chair um so I um sit on the cross party strategic asset disposal working group um takes most of my time to say doesn’t it um and um I’m aware that this report says um that the sale of this bit of land would support transformation savings my understanding

Is that the Strategic asset disposal work is pointed directly at transformation funding the transformation work um and it hasn’t as far as I’m aware come to the working group I might be wrong and I’m very willing to be corrected if I am but I don’t remember it coming uh while I’ve

Been a counselor um and I and so I just wanted to to raise that and I I also think there’s an option in um the paper that’s not referred to or there isn’t an option in the paper around what another option we could something we could do

With this land might be uh to use it to build social housing or to um find a register provider to put social housing on that land and I want to know why that option isn’t in there um so that like those are my two kind of questions and I

Think they’re slightly linked but I probably haven’t linked them very clearly I apologize thanks thank thank you councelor salmon councelor Andrews I believe you wish to speak thank you couple of points um obviously this has been predecessor Council pbar council’s policy for some years to get rid of this car it’s in the

Local plan po local plan um if you look at the papers the income is very poor on this carart and that speaks for itself in terms of its usability but bared in the report is the recommended option of actually selling this site unconditionally in my view that won’t

Get the best price I’m sure many developers who will be bidding will offer a very good price but with conditions such as hey x million pounds if they get say y number of bed spaces so that sale would be better or an overage provision that’s came mentioned

In the report uh more is paid if say particular number of flats is allowed the actual resolution though we have before us is quite open in its wording and can be interpreted my way really my main suggestion is to take advice from whoever is the appointed selling agent

As to the best way to get the best prize for this Council and for our residents thank you thank you councelor Andrews councelor Trent I believe you have indicated yes thank you madam chairman um I was pleased to hear the ward counselor acknowledged that this had

Been on the agenda for a long time because before I lost my seat on paor Council in 2015 it was being talked about and um you know it’s it it seems to have been Surplus to requirements for a long time but a comment was made about a planning um

Application I’m sort of scking fact facts here um was there a planning brief on that site because I seem to remember seeing a planning brief um way back I can’t remember whether it was pre or post um bll Council days on that site and um I think without sort of going

Into any detail unfortunately the way we work I think a previous question said about um social housing um that’s that’s one of the irritating things for those of us on planning and so on is that there would be no way that you would get away with putting um social housing on

That site unfortunately but I would like clarity as to whether or not there was a planning brief on that site because s seem to remember there being something of that type thank you councelor Trent any more speakers oh um councelor rice um yes I would also like to

Understand why social housing is not possible on that site thank you councilor Hadley thank you just on the on the the car park and Rockwater I yes Rockwater has has arriv right on the scene clearly they they despite their um appeal or or the suggestion that they would

Support health and fitness there’s an awful lot of people drive there um I I think the car park this car park is only open in the summertime and and I think it was recognized when we discussed this at cabinet that’s opening all year round in response to the way people are taking

Their Leisure and going to the beach all all year round and the way that rock quter has been very successful would be a sensible move to increase the revenue of the half that remains but given the the the damage and the fact that um under the previous pool Council Administration

Um it was initially started this this car park has been pretty blighted so half of the car parking spaces are not actually usable anyway um so you know we need to invest in in in the half of the car park that will remain and we can

Probably only do that if we get rid of the other half thank you thank you councelor Hadley do we have any more speakers before I ask councelor Slade if she wishes to speak sorry I I I thought I’d better just waited Your Role yes thank you yeah

I will be brief uh I think just uh to say this this has been on the agenda for an awful long time and I know that throughout the whole of that period councelor Hayes has has maintained a position of being uncomfortable with the proposal to sell it as you would expect

Her to being her Ward um and you know so so absolutely understand why why may would would maintain that situation this was a scheme that future places were looking to develop this was a scheme which future places uh did not develop and uh future places were um you know talking

About the sale of this site way before so I think the reason it probably hasn’t come to the Cross party asset working group is because those decisions had already been taken way before this Council came back in in May um and I think it would just be delaying

Everything to keep going back around around the Vero round this site was s deemed Surplus many years ago it has taken way too long to be delivered it could have provided housing by now um I don’t think this personally is is is the right site for affordable housing I

Think that would be a um a you know that would be down to a developer and and fundamentally if social housing or affordable housing wasn’t delivered on this site it would deliver a significant financial uh contribution uh which will benefit the The Wider The Wider Council so I do understand the issues regarding

Rock water I’ve had plenty of people lobbying around you the impact of rock water on local plan uh local parking facilities but this car park is closed from September until April anyway uh so all of those months this car park has has been closed and people have made alternative Arrangements in where to

Park clearly with rock water and the beach in the summer this car park so this area is going to be more popular than before but I don’t actually think that rock water makes the massive difference in the height of Summer that it does in the depths of winter I think

The joy of rock water is it’s made that a year round destination that it wasn’t before so actually uh the difference in know in the height of Summer some of this car park is used some of this car park is full but only some of this car

Park is ever open because if you’ve been to see it you’ll know that less than half of spases are actually usable The Proposal here will allow us to have the capital to be able to to look at improving uh what remains and making what’s left a really good usable car

Park up to Modern standards which it absolutely isn’t at the moment so I think we need to stop delaying we may get more money if we’d sold it with planning permission but we may be in a situation another five years down the line of waiting for that planning

Permission to go through or going through an appeal or going through a second or third attempt and I think actually a bird in the hand is worth two of the Bush uh and I think about time we actually sold this site moved on gave the local residents some security about

What’s going to happen uh and brought some capital in into the council so absolutely recommend this for sale thank you councelor Slade councelor Cox um are you going to Su up for us well I don’t feel as though I need to because I think councelor Slate’s just done it all

Actually she’s done I’ve been through all the notes and she’s she’s answered every single one I do I do honestly sympathize with the with the local residents I can completely understand uh councelor ha’s point of view but what I would stress is that the parking that will remain will be virtually just as

Much as the parking that they can use at the moment um there is a very tiny uh reduction in the in the total car parking space because it’ll be reconfigured and as has already been mentioned a few times there are a virtually half of the car parking spaces

Are are completely unusable um I think you’ve heard about the the reason it’s not come to the cross party uh committee that was because it’s come out of uh future places um as to why it can’t be used for um social homes I’m sure it could be used for social homes but

Actually the capital that we will get out of it will be used to help with social housing later on and other things so I think it’s be the best use of this site will be to sell it to a private developer to actually U build some hoses

Uh and I I completely take on board what councilor Andrews has said I think that’s a good point we we need to make sure that we get the absolute best value for this site uh and we need to offer it with with the with the relevant conditions thank you thank you councelor Cox

Um I feel there may be dissension so I’m going to ask to vote uh with a show of hands so all those in favor thank you those against and extensions please right thank you uh members that was carried item 15 budget monitoring 2023 to 24 quarter 3 councelor Cox again I

Understand you’re going to move this recommendation and I think councelor Brown is seconding councelor Cox indeed Madam chairman thank thank you um I would like to recommend to council uh this particular motion which agrees the acceptance of Grants uh Delegate delegations for delivery and capital viment of schemes over a million

Pounds as set out in appendix c um it’s worth noting uh that we are projecting a surplus of 2.8 million pounds uh which has come from a deficit of 4.3 million pounds uh the reason for this uh turnaround uh in the last quarter was due to the changing of the MLP

Provisions which we’ve discussed in detail and the increased recovery that we’ve got from from the NHS recare placements however it it must be stressed that this was offset significantly in by additional pressures in children’s and operations and of course an additional half a million pounds for the cost of future places

This has been finally put this thank goodness has been finally put to bed um and a sign but a significantly different picture than would have been portrayed by the leader of the opposition for finance uh if we if we who wanted to spend the contingencies we needed those

Contingencies because of um uh pressures in children’s and operations and we will need them next year as well uh given this um Council given where we have come from this Council and the fact that we started off with one6 million pounds plus of unidentified transformation savings um I think the return to a

Surplus is actually quite an achievement so I recommend this report thank you thank you councelor Cox um councelor Brown do you wish to Second yeah happy to second that but I’ll reserve my right to speak thank you councelor brown um counselors who wishes to speak on this um

Recommendation I think the answer to that is nobody right um in that case um councelor Cox do you wish to sum up I think I probably had said enough so that thank you I’m so sorry councelor Brown you you reserved your right to speak and now as

Your time go I I will just say a couple of words um I mean actually this is a really s positive result at this point in in the year in terms of the budget monitoring to show such an improved position at quarter two you know we were

Looking at um overspend and now we got that back under control um and I think it’s also in no small part to the fact that we’ve had expenditure free as well which is not easy for offices and not easy for departments to sort of to to to

Handle but it’s been necessary to make sure we can manage the council’s financial position in year um I think for me one of the most noteworthy bits of the report is around future places and I think the numbers when you look at Future places it just does go to show

That was a very costly misplaced project for this Council to to to go go ahead with and I think actually it shows the Prudence the council I think in September when a 4 million pound provision was made to um handle the costs of that and that’s being used here

To to manage the closure and the winding up of future places um but yeah I think a sad chapter in this council’s history as far as I’m concerned thank you councelor brown and apologies for missing you out there councelor Cox you said you don’t want to sum up is that

Right I can sum up by saying it’s a fantastic fantastic report and uh recommend it to the coun thank you members is there any dissension to this recommendation right I think that’s a consensus thank you right we’re moving now to item 16 and this is the funding arrangement to

Support Russell coat’s art gallery and Museum to become an independent trust councelor Andy Martin I think you’re going to move the recommendation and I think councelor Cox will second thank you madam chair uh I’m very pleased to bring this paper forward in what I hoped tonight will be a significant moment in the

Future of the Russell coats um for context in January last year the previous Council agreed to apply to the charity commission for the trust the ship of the museum to be transferred to a new entity a company limited by guarantee I notice the um the clock’s

Not on by I just men um this in turn followed concerns from Arts Council England uh and the charity Commission in 2018 that the governance Arrangements were not meeting the needs of a modern charity the current the council is currently the sole trustee by the way

The museum has long been in a poor state of repair and one of the main drivers of externalization is the opportunity to secure greater investment from the HLF from with grants individual donors and other found foundations to ensure it’s better maintained for the next 100 years it’s long been obvious that local

Government does not have the kind of money to invest in that the Russell coach needs and we need need to give it the best chance to flourish externalization will open up all sorts of opportunities for investment and that is desperately needed the Russell coats is a huge part of bma’s history and

Heritage and of course will remain so it enjoys a local Regional National and international reputation couple of points I want to make clear the house and collections land and Freehold do not belong to this Council they have always belong to the Russell coat charity and are listed in

The charity accounts and they will remain with the charity one or two queries have been raised about the potential disposal of assets I know there was some concerns and I hope in subsequent conversations these concern concerns have been allayed over how assets are and will be protected in brief though the Russell

Coat’s assets are held by the charity and are subject to charity law and as a museum accredited by Arts Council England by the code of ethics of the museums Association there is no change in the position of the assets so this upfront Financial package is one that has been discussed

Extensively with the Russell coats board members over the last nine months they are happy that this gives the Russell coats a solid Financial base with which to move forward to the next stage of externalization which will require parliamentary approval can I finally pay tribute to our fantastic dedicated and passionate

Team at the Russell Coast LED by Sarah Newman and supported by a brilliant management board we can have the greatest confidence in them so I ask the council to support recommendations A and B relating to the 5e financial settlement and the transfer of the exitor road study center item c2f um

Were resolved by cabinet thank you thank you councelor Martin um councelor Cox are you going to second I’ll second and reserve my right thank you thank you members um do I have any speakers right yes counselor oh sorry I don’t know who was first now yes go

On is it okay if I speak sitting down okay thank you so um this this is a really important um item and you can tell this for when we discussed it in our group meeting we did discuss it at Great length and had great difficulty coming um to a conclusion but eventually

All agreed um how we should vote on this item um we decided that we cannot vote against it because the wrestle coat needs um needs the money we don’t want to stop them getting the money and we know that they’re really Keen to um run their own

Organization um and so we we don’t want to do anything to stop that although we would like some assurances that the BCP counselors that will be on board will be um have full voting rights and will be appointed the same way as the other outside bodies so so we decided we

Cannot we we cannot vote against this um but at the same time we are very concerned that we don’t want a president to be set um in this particular case it’s an organization that is a registered charity already owns the land um already very organized asking us for

This rather than us asking them to do it um we do not want to see a president where this is over to um us asking organizations to take on something that they might not be ready to do um so we feel we cannot really vote for it so we

Have decided to abstain but I thought that it would be useful to explain those reasons thank you thank you councelor um counselor Bartlett thank you madam chair um I think this paper reflects an abject failure of successive administrations to meet its obligations and responsibilities as a trustee but I do

Think that this Administration is doing the right thing now uh to give the uh Museum an opportunity to flourish and I congratulate the administration for taking these steps um what I would say is that how is it possible that a house now needs 4 million p pound spending on

It we’re not talking about the collection we’re talking about the house you know that that gives some kind of measure of the uh the poor way that the council repeatedly for years and years have not met their responsibilities I really wish the new charity well and every success and they

Are as has been pointed out a wonderful team and it’s thanks to their dedication and persistence that we actually in this position now of taking this very very important step it is a jewel in the crown it needs to flourish and I really hope that they do well and

And I wish them every success with this thank you chair thank you counselor um councelor fer thank you yes thank thank you chair um I’m so completely happy with this paper it’s just going to ensure the future of the Russell coats Museum and I know we’ve

Got a lot of new counselors here um on this Council and I’m sure there’s quite a few of you who’ve never been to the Russell coats and people listening to this meeting online it’s an absolute gem it’s a small Museum it was a private

House that was given to the town by uh s and Lady Russell coats it was their private home and when they died they left it to the town of Bournemouth and it’s got wonderful pictures wonderful artifacts it’s just a terrific place um I I hear what councilor Bart says about

Why has it got 4 million to be spent on it it’s a very old house you know it’s over a hundred years to get old and uh just putting a new roof on any of our houses goes into the tens of thousands it needs a lot to make it viable but it

Also needs people to visit it and I feel this is going to ensure its future um some of the exhibitions that I’ve seen this year there’s one fantastic exhibition of photos of Old Siam if anyone’s not seen it it’s absolutely worth going to um the people who run it

Are dedicated it’s also a a very um valued wedding wedding venue it was I hope it still is um and I think this is going to ensure its future a council isn’t in a position to be keeping a gem like this in the way that it should be

Kept and I’m fully supportive of this paper thank you counselor counselor Hadley thank you chair um yes it’s interesting having having been around there there are some some definite signs of neglect and I think as Council Bart has suggested over a long time period the council has not perhaps looked after

It um as we might but part of it is actually the atrim area which was built in the 1980s so it’s a testament to the shy workmanship of the 1980s sadly because that’s that’s the bit that needs to be knocked down and rebuilt um I also

Have sympathy with the the view from the labor group around a president because I’m I’m I would contrast the work that we’ve done in in the pool Museum uh which is great you know and we’ve got um a lot of support from from the lottery foundation and others for for that um

And it will be brilliant when it’s reopened and I think you know we we have two really good uh quality attractions there with with Russell coats and and po Museum and I and I I I hope that we can we can um support difference and and and and encourage people the other really

Interesting thing I found was that there’s only 10% of of locals so 10% of their visits are locals so it is a real tourist attraction and despite appearances this Administration does want to encourage the tourist to come to to to BCP area and to to enjoy what we

Have and as as has been said it is a jewel in our um in our facilities thank you thank you councelor for thank you sorry I had a a moment um thank you chair and I’d like to thank uh councelor Andy Martin as the portfolio holder for um customer culture and Communications

To uh introduce this paper and so sensitive L um lay out the position um that faces the council um I thanks to councel Hadley to remind us um that I remember visiting swanic um long before I moved to Bournemouth um to uh to visit Brussel coats and I still remember my

First visit um absolutely wide eyed and stunned by The Collection um strangely enough I was wide-eyed and stunned by the uh the men’s WC for the standing tiling work for the victorians that are in there in cic and glaze tiles um that

In itself is a is a work of art um but I digress a little so I didn’t think back then that I would be in this chamber being having the opportunity to vote on the future of the Russell coats and its existence um I see the paper here that

It was 1908 on that it was gifted um to the uh to the people of Bournemouth by uh sir Russell and uh Lady Lady an um and that fulfilled a promise that mer gave to the people of Bournemouth and that connection but 130 years ago mer Russell coats was also the mayor of

Bournemouth so the connection for the Russell coats collection the museum the building Etc for Bournemouth is very very strong so it is with an objective and pragmatic thought that I can’t vote against it going because it it the way for it to survive for future generations and visitors to

Enjoy is for it to be given up so and obviously I can’t vote against it but I will be personally abstaining for which I am sorry but but just before I finish up I wish to um uh offer my thanks to the leader and to the portfolio holder

For their best efforts to maintain that link with the office the office of the mayor and the trustees to appeal to the new board should this be voted through to ensure that there is an honory position from this moment forward as it was 130 years ago with the mayorip of Sir Russell

Beron um From This Moment forward so my thanks to the leader and my thanks to the portfolio thank you thank you counselor councelor slay I think you indicated thank you um Madam chair um so uh the first thing I have to say I did have to chuckle councelor fer um that

This this beautiful house built in 1897 is an old house would you like to come and visit Paul or Christ Church where we can show you some very very old houses because I do I love the fact that actually for Bournemouth this is one of those original houses and that’s what

Makes it so special so you know but it did make me chuckle that it is not very much older than my house that I live in which is which if it ever needs 4 million pounds of of work doing on it counselor slate there’ll be trouble

Um so I really just wanted to touch on a couple of things about the Assurance around counselor representation on the board you know I think we have to be mindful that the foresight of the people who gifted this to the town to gift it in the way that they did has enabled us

To pass it on because if it had been left to the council goodness only knows where we would have been already um but this this has enabled it to move forward and with the protection of the charity commission um to protect it you know for the long term so I absolutely

Agree this is the right thing to do um and it’s the right thing to do for not just um the generations now but the generations to come um the other thing I just want to say about is this was built as a birthday present and one of our

Members here have a birthday today so I’m wondering what birthly present we should give him not a great big house in bourma Richard not today um but there there is something here about the Marl te and I think we have to be really clear with the public about it is in the gift

Of the leader to make appointments to outside bodies and that means that those appointments have to be in the form of counselors and when the mayor is behaving as the mayor they are as a charter trustee and so it’s that’s the reason why uh it would be wrong to make

An appointment of the mayor as the leader I think the right way to go forward as you suggested councelor Fara is for um a letter to go um once this has been approved to say that I would be delighted to make um you know the the regular appointments of

Counselors to uh work with the team but that that on honorary position in a similar way as we have the honorary roles in PED in terms of our relationship with the CH with um Sher Borg and other organizations so you have my commitment to do that and I think

That this can represent a a really good positive way forward and perhaps when it um when it starts its new life I noticed that it was officially opened by princess beatress that maybe they should invite our new Princess beatress um to come and uh and and sort of relaunch it

On this next uh next hundred years of its Journey so uh thank you for your support everybody I totally understand why um some members feel that they need to abstain but I think uh it’s good that we’ll have enough votes in the chamber I hope to take this forward thank you councelor councelor

Smon so um somebody mentioned future places earlier and I feel like future places should have taught us to be a bit wary about setting up independent bodies to solve the council’s problems and whatnot and the sums of money being discussed here are vast there five or

Six times the amount of money that the council saved last week by closing down our libraries which is something I’m still very bitter about and I get for changing the ownership model is going to be really good and allow the Endeavor to be better funded by external grants and

What not I mean that seems like the right idea but the devil’s very often in the detail with this kind of thing and this sounds like this was a self-created problem for the council you know this didn’t have to go this way it didn’t have to get quite so bad and I think

With this kind of self-created problem when you’re looking to sort it out the quickest way out leads straight back in you know and knee-jerk decisions and whatnot and I’ve got every faith in the individuals involved I’m sure everybody’s very hardworking and whatnot but I do worry about the institutions

They are bound to I worry that at the moment our counsil is somewhat data blind horrifically under resourced and whatnot and so I just I just worry when I see that we’re giving 2 million pounds you know we giving all of this money up front that maybe just doing that alone

And going okay you you go off and you deal with that now as a independent charity and whatnot maybe that will not sort all of this out I’m just too skeptical to to get wholeheartedly behind this and I wish we could see more more of a robust plan as to what how

This was going to work you know which I which I haven’t got from the documents here in front of me but yeah that’s it so I’ll be abstaining like others have said Do we have any more speakers councelor Cox you reserved your right would you like to speak just like to say

A few things if you don’t mind mad chairman um I I I wholeheartedly approve of of this paper um I’m not as screamish as some afraid I I I think this could be a model uh to for future Heritage assets uh if the circumstances were right and in these this circumstances it’s the

Right thing to do because this will bring flexibility um to the to the charity to the organization it will and it will bring outside expertise and fundamentally it will give them the ability to raise more money it will give them money ability to raise money that

Which we will not be able to afford to to give them and that’s the that’s the reason uh and I wholeheartedly agree with councelor B Bartlett you know it is an object fa fa it’s an object failure of local government holding assets like this because they never put prioritize

The money to be spent on repairs and and maintenance on these kind of assets I have to say this is the first time I’ve I’ve spoken in favor of of a of a of an a paper where where councelor F has agreed with me so I’m I’m

Absolutely delighted with that so um and as for councelor Fara um you’re welcome to the National Lial Club there are til Victoria uh all over the place not just in the G toilets uh and a as for the uh as for councelor salmon there there is no liary closures

You said there was Library closures there was no Library closures may be restrictions in library hours but no Library closures and I would like to say that we should have a bit less skepticism a bit more optimism because I’m I think this is a great great move forward thank

You thank you councelor Cox um councelor Martin um would you wish to sum up at the end of this debate yes just just very briefly because I think the leader and the portfolio holder for finance are both summed up as well so thank you for that

Um I’d want to start by just picking up what uh councelor salmon said this is not an e jerk reaction this has been discussed for many years the the underinvestment by successive formouth councils has been going on for years this has been talked about since 2018 2019 so it’s carefully out the people

Who are on the board are very I won’t name them but they are incredibly experienced individuals in the town and in business and in arts and culture so please accept this is not something that’s been cooked up overnight that’s really important I’d like to thank um uh

Council Bart and councel fer for their supportive words um it is a jewel in the crown uh and the fact the fact that we’ come up with this this uh package gives a hopefully gives it a secure future nothing’s guaranteed in this life as we

Know but I can tell you that the the uh the board and those at the Russell coats they have asked for this we didn’t we’re not pushing the Russell coats away they’ve asked for it so we are they are confident that they can make this work and obviously there’s been lots of

Conversations already going on with HLF with the Arts Council with the charity commission so this isn’t a say just not cooked up on the back of an envelope this has been going on a long time um the other point I wanted to make was was look at what’s happening in other parts

Of the country where museums are being closed because they don’t have the funding uh and that’s not happening here and I think that’s also an indication of the C this council’s commitment and I said it last week and I’ll say it again and I’ll keep saying it our commitment

To arts and culture across BCP and the final thing I would say is yes um I mean the leader already already SP mentioned about represent representation on the uh on the on the um on the new charity on the Trust on the trust charity um and

That is baked in that that is that will be we will have a representation on there that’s baked into moving forward with the charity commission um and thank you uh councilor Fara nobody’s never really uh um accuses me of sensitivity so I thank you it’s the first I think

And the last thing I would say and I think it’s wor I think it’s fair to say the work that’s got in by the officers on this has been really intense and given everything else that the council’s been challenged with in the last nine months so I’d like to personally thank

The chief executive who’s worked really hard on this and I would also like to thank our outgoing chief operations officer who has also been instrumental in putting this package together so thank you Jess thank you grant thanks very much thank you councelor Martin um members um I think we had better have

A show of hands on this all those in favor those against abstentions thank you that was carried thank you very much members um we just wait for the council to come back in oh no there she is both counselors sorry both counselors to come back in um councilors members we are on

Now to item 17 the Royal arcade bosam B with towns fund update and councelor Slade um I believe you’re going to move this recommendation councelor Andy Martin to Second thank you councelor thank you chair so BCP Council was granted just over 21 million pounds in March 2021 uh

Through the towns fund program for bosin uh which will see a major investment into uh this part of formouth including new homes public realm improvements new community facilities and and significant retail support one of the key projects within the plan was the proposed purchase of the royal arcade which is a grade two

Listed building and this would support the Regeneration of boson through retail office food and Leisure facilities it’s a beautiful building that many of us know and it would have really transformed this part of the project the funding for this element of the town’s fund was coming partially through the town’s fund

Um a proportion of the 21 million pounds also borrowing from BCP Council uh of of 3.4 million and a grant from the Heritage Lottery fund over time things have uh become a little more complicated in terms of the the purchase of this site and as with many other projects the costs have risen

Really sharply and you’ll see in the report that um the costs of purchasing the property uh doing the critical repairs and the conversion of the property um simply can’t be covered with the amount of money that’s been set aside through those three funding pots this leaves the council with a

Difficult decision around whether it could seek additional borrowing um drop other key projects from the towns fund plan or withdrawal from the purchase of the royal arcade and just taking through those options without a business plan to um it’s very difficult for us to um agree to borrow more money uh We’ve scaled

Back the level of our borrowing over the last 12 months um and we really can only borrow if we know we can repay that borrowing over a reasonable amount of time the other risks involved with this development are high uh developing a listed building is always difficult so

Whilst we can set a figure on what it would cost now you have no idea what is going to come down the line and there is no money there is no Magic Money Tree uh to pay for this the borrowing uh it was set aside for this but this is the only

Amount of borrowing that we could justify based upon uh the income that would likely come in the other projects that are set within the towns fund are hugely important to the people of bosum the Regeneration of bosum and businesses um and therefore it would be completely

Wrong for us to take money away from those projects in order to keep pumping money into one project that leaves us really with only one option which regrettably is that at this time to pull out of the oun counselor can you wind up now I will I forgot about the time I’m

So sorry do very well thank you we do wish to uh complete the planning application for this site so that private sector investment could be enabled um that is happening very soon and um the board of the towns fund will be making a decision on what to do with the

Rest of this money so I want to reassure the the council that the money that this would release back from the towns fund does have the consent of government to be redistributed among the other projects it cannot fill any new projects but it can be put into the various

Projects and they’re listed within the paper and I cover anything else in by summing up chair thank you councelor Slade councelor Martin councelor Andy Martin you’re going to second I believe yes sorry happy to Second chair yes are you reserving your right to speak or was that

It members um not forgetting that there are some appendices which are exempt so we we don’t need to move into exempt um exempt session as long we don’t trespass onto that area so um counselors who wishes to speak oh councelor Connelly thank you thank you so the issue here as you said

Is that there was funding lined up including towns fund money for the compulsory purchase repair and renovation of the royal arcade in bosam and this was to be the flagship project for the Regeneration of Boston Town Center uh it was promised to play a transformational role in kickstarting

Generation through the whole area and we’re all really excited about it but it seems to have taken so long to get off the ground that the cost to get the planned Works done is just unaffordable so instead The Proposal is just to get the planning permission and then see

What the private sector steps in uh and then allocate the the planned towns fund money around smaller projects which I appreciate the the confirmation of so don’t get me wrong we want to make sure that towns fund money gets spent in bosam now our preference would be to go

Ahead with a compulsory purchase and essential repairs with an ie for then further transformation work down the line is as and when possible so the paper suggests that this has been ruled out as it wouldn’t meet the criteria for the town’s fund so this is a bit I’m

Unclear about that and whether there really is no possibility for some other option that would allow the compulsory purchase to go ahead and then still have that option for for further work down the line so having said that we of course agreed that keeping the money within bosum is far better than losing

It so despite appreciating these Limited options as presented I can’t support the abandonment of the flagship policy for boson particularly without a new strategy or Vis Vision in its place um I’m personally really disappointed about this the Royal arcade regeneration was supposed to be the heart of this new

Strategy for bosam I recall the the previous leader bringing the Secretary of State down to great ffir but it it’s just been such a delay uh that a significant opportunity to regenerate the area has now been lost and this always seems to be the case bosam always

Seems to get forgotten about um and and is Left Behind yet again but it has so much potential so if you’re not going to go ahead with the big regeneration project I really want to see a convincing new strategy in its place so we’re not going to be able to support

The proposal to drop the plan uh without that and hope that some way might be found it’s possible to go ahead with the development at a future time uh so my challenge to you is this before we finish if you can’t do this regeneration of the royal arcade what is the

Alternative strategy in place for bosum and its regeneration um we need an ambitious New Vision for bosam uh we Keen to to talk to you about our ideas for that thanks do we have any more speakers councilor F thank you um I find this really disappointing um we’ve been talking

About the Regeneration of bosam for years I was on the original board at least five or six years ago and there was such Joy when that amount of money was given to the town’s fund I’ve lived in bosam all my life I was born there grew up there and still live in bosam

And I think it’s very disappointing that we’ve been talking for so long and nothing is apparent yet it’s just been a long talking shop and this as Council con said this is the key to it all it’s a beautiful covered shopping area that’s so desperately underused and just to abandon it because

I assume much as we need more housing I assume that the money for the Kat Town’s fund will I I know it’ll be it’ll may be in boson probably in the hawkwood road car park uh new build of houses there but there’ll be nothing BOS that was going

To be the key that was going to be the the attraction to have a beautiful indoor Center um for shops or for markets or for restaurants whatever it was going to be and it was going to bring it back to its former Splendor and how very disappointing that after all

These years and such hope and such passion for it all it seems to be fizzling um and personally I would like to see a definite plan for what’s going to happen to that money if we’re allowed to use it and something to happen quickly you can’t just carry on talking

For another five or six years and still nothing happened so I will I’ll be supporting this but with greatest regret councelor Hardley thank you um chair yeah this is a really interesting contrast to the the item we’ve just we’ve just passed um because the the museum really wanted to to to to change

And the owner of of this building didn’t really want us to have it um and there there is there is a a real real contrast I I’ve lived most of my life in in in this area and obviously passed through Boston I haven’t lived in Boston but um it’s always been difficult in

Terms of how do we make Boston a great place it’s a really um attractive place in terms of some of some of the the Arts and the the the people who are who make make it colorful place but it’s um it’s also got a lot of

Problems and I I do hope that the money is spent wisely in in in the area but I think we are taking a responsible decision in cutting cutting off um something that could become a real money pit for us and indeed um for the present owner and and you if

It Chang his hands for any owner it is it is a real challenge so I think we are we are taking responsible decision in in in saying no actually we can spend the limited money we’ve got more wisely on other schemes and we need to make sure

That Ward C are really part of that so I hope that will be part of the alome thank you thank you counselor anybody else wish to speak councel Martin did you reserve your right yeah thank you chair but I don’t really have anything to add thank you thank you counselor um councelor

Slate then would you wish to sum up yes of course well I did get a chance to say because I rambled for too long uh Council Colony so I must apologize is that it’s not uh the decision of this administration of where this money goes the towns fund board which includes both

The ward counselors and the portfolio sorry the lead member for um for our project um they will make the decision at their next board once we have taken a decision tonight about how they would reallocate that money I absolutely need to stress that there is an absolute

Commitment to bosam this money cannot go anywhere else it is it is defined in fact when there was an attempt to try and stretch the location to put some things on the fringes of the area of the town’s fund it was rejected so I think you know you can take that that this

Money is not going anywhere else one of the things which is incredibly frustrating is that time scale you know it’s taken three years to get here since that money was agreed how ridiculous is that I I can’t answer that question I’ve only been in this role for um seven or eight

Months but what I do know is that this money has to be spent by March 2026 that is not very long away and so this these projects we don’t have time to go back and go back and go back the reason why we can’t just do the base

Level of work works as I understand it is that one of the conditions of the towns fund is around jobs generation and actually if we just did that critical work but didn’t actually open it up for what it was designed to do it wouldn’t fulfill that criteria and we would then

Put at risk the rest of the project I understand counselor filer’s concern about um just homes but I would never use that phrase because homes are so important and I think you know if we don’t deliver those homes in the heart of boson for families we don’t have a

Hope of generating bosum however wonderful the Royal arcade would be I think it’s ironic isn’t it that we just agreed to release the Russell coats because we can’t afford it anymore um but actually if we held on to this it could consume everything and put at risk

The chances of us as doing the other things we know the community is passionate about their Community Center that they want they want something far better than we would otherwise be able to afford to do so I hope they use some of this money for that I’ve seen the

List of other things they want to do and I would encourage the ward counselors and the ward counselors of the neighboring Wards to engage as much as they can because I’m sure this is a place where the neighboring Wards go and visit too so you know although they’re

Not on the board I’m sure that the councils of springborn and and eastcliffe and of of um uh southorn and pokesdown and you know bosam are equally as interested in what happens here so I I think this is agree with you a very heavy heart um but with so little time

And such tight restrictions I think it’s time to do the inevitable thank you councelor Slade um members I’m going to ask for a show of hands on this um if that’s okay with everybody I think so um members all in favor please show those those against and extensions thank you members that was

Carried we move on now to item 18 dolphin Shopping Center pool update um and as before there are exempt dependencies so um I trust that we won’t Venture into those councelor Slade I understand you’re going to move the recommendation and councelor Earl will second the move thank you chair this uh hopefully

Will be a a brief one in 2017 B of Paul as it then was and LG entered into a an agreement which required both sides to do a number of things uh over the the uh following period some of which are in the exempt paper some of which are in the main paper

Many improvements have taken place over that time uh including improvements to the actual shopping mall the M by the by lmg the multi-story car park by the council the toilets the facades of some of the buildings and a real transformation of what goes on inside the dolphin

Center on completion of the things that were in that original agreement new leases were going to be uh created uh new responsibilities will be set out and a new way forward but for a number of reasons including the covid pandemic and the significant change in the way that

We all shop which probably brought forward more quickly by the covid pandemic um some of the requirements on both sides are no longer viable and they would no longer be sensible to progress so we’re faced with a situation where we either sit tight with the current agreement and just hope that it goes

Away and hope that nobody presses the nuclear button um we enforce those improvements which won’t necessarily give the town of Paul what it wants or need for the future and could become extremely expensive and the only people to benefit would probably be lawyers um

Or we could lay it to one side and sit down with LG and say what do we want the place pool and over the last couple of years anybody that’s been to pool will see that it’s absolute Renaissance going on um in the the commercial center of

Paul if you haven’t been there I would definitely encourage it because the model of what’s gone on in the dolphin Center under the ownership of LG is really a model that we’re trying to do even in in Bournemouth we don’t have in Bournemouth a single landlord model that

Has enabled pool to transform the dolphin Center used to be the dolphin shopping center but it’s now where the hospital out patients is it’s where the council’s own adult education center is our life liary a customer contact center a working um U Works joint Works Space a children’s play center and some shopping

U and every time I go down there there’s something new and I think we should celebrate that so this paper really just allows us to put a line through that previous agreement and say you know what doesn’t benefit anyone to hold us to something which is no longer fit for

Purpose and I think sometimes we could all learn by just laying things to one side stepping forward and starting aresh so I think this gives us a chance to start aesh with Paul and I hope that it’s something everyone will be able to support thank you um leader councelor

Earl you wish a second yes thank you chair happy to Second and are you reserving your right to speak I will reserve my right to speak thank you counselor um right councelors who wishes to speak on this yes counselor uh yes first of all I’d like

To say thank you very much for bringing this forward um this is really important to Paul Town um when I was um standing for the election a lot of people were saying what’s happening with the dolphin Center why is the Argus um part of the dolphin Center still got boards on it um

What what’s happening with it and there seem to be no information and nothing seemed to be really moving forward and although um things have been moving forward because that one big shop was uh standing there empty there was definitely a perception that things just weren’t moving with this project and I’m

Really Keen to see things I’m really Keen to see things moving on this so I really do welcome that this has been brought forward there is just one little thing I’d like to ask in um your B of recommendation B um all those uh officers in are going to be um looking

At what happens next in consultation with some portfolio holders can we please add the ward counselors that list as well um because I’m sure we’d all be Keen to uh be involved in um helping to shape the future for the dolphin Center and um give the views of our of our

Residents on that thank you thank you Council R and head um councelor Trent were you indicating yes thank you madam chairman um I think I’ve sat through many and many a meeting over the years where there was a lot of Blue Sky Thinking about what what would happen with the

Dolphin Center and whether there would be a dolphin center phase two and things like that and nothing has happened from it and there were one of two ideas that I sort of nursed for example bringing the railway station to the bit that would be the dolphin Center to sort of

Extension but you know that is obviously pie in the sky but what I have noticed and um I was privileged to be able to attend many events opening up of different bits and pieces is the number of things that have happened in the dolphing center which have been positive

Um the kingom Cresent improvements were good there’s um there are some quite quite unique uh um shopping experiences there and I do think that we have we can see a germ of optimism going on there and possibly a clue to how we might develop our shopping centers in the

Future and so um I think we’ve got to sort of move on in whatever the most practical way possible is but I’m encouraged by what I’ve seen and I think that you know we can actually move further in that direction and sort of make the dolphin and the High Street and

Link the two much better then I think we’ll have a positive outcome for Paul you thank you councelor Trent councelor Hadley thank you um yes as as Ward counselor sorry I do need to declare non-un interest I’m a director of pool business improvement district um and and

I think you know the the the U um the the good things about about po High Street and and and the dolphin Center have been raised by others particularly in terms of the dolphin Center and legal and General’s work um on that but it is a partnership and it is also because

Decisions that this Council has made to put the adult education in there um to put our Hub Hub in there and to to to change the the liary into a multifunctional space so I think you know we we have been at the table as as the NHS as as the leader mentioned um

And it’s also because there is U um quite a bit of housing very close to the town center and there’s a you there is there the historic housing but also new new uh uh new housing and further regeneration that we’d like to do particularly on the power station side

And I think these things all work together and Paul really is thriving which is great to see um and again there’s a contrast to the previous papers because both parties don’t really think this agreement suits us so why not rip it up and start again but we do need

To make sure that it it suits the community of of pool as well as legal and General’s ambition so I think we do need to make sure that there is a um um a process a means for the public to um to get their inut put to it so I’m sure

That will be part of what we as World counselors and we as as cabinet and as Council will will seek to do thank you thank you counselor councelor Brown thank you chair um yeah just a few words on this um I think the dolphin shopping center has been said there’s

Been significant changes in retail and dolphing shopping center sort of has suffered shop closures we as we’ve seen on every High Street across the country but the difference with the dolphin is that it’s a well-used shopping center so whereas bills went into Administration the bills in the dolphin shopping center

Then reopened because it was a profitable operation and now we’ve just seen the announcement that Wilco are going to reopen one of their first does in the dolphin Center in their old unit because the businesses know operating in pool is a profitable operation so it’s worth re worth doing that but I think

The development agreement that drawn up between pool and legal in general actually has been beneficial because it’s driven a lot of that it’s driven the diversification of the dolphin shopping center from being retail to as it’s been said more into Leisure and education and Health Care provision not to mention the independent

Traders on Kingland and if people haven’t experienced it I did virtually all of my Christmas shopping in the dolphin shopping center and on the kingling present in the independent Traders and the startup businesses there and I’d recommend it and it really does show The Way Forward I think for for

Retail in a lot of parts of the country and I think it’s a real pragmatic way forward to approve these recommendations to release the parties from the obligations and to renegotiate it I think is just a pragmatic Way Forward and we’ll help dolphin Shopping Center progress into the future things

Are going to keep changing in the future we need to sort of change with that are there any more speakers before I ask Council ear if she wishes to speak a second councilor ear then would you wish to speak uh no that’s fine thank you short answer thank you um councelor

Slate will would you like to sum up yes there’s not really much to say apart from just for clarity in Item B um this isn’t about designing a new P Town Center uh with which clearly the board councilors need to be at the absolute front of that and fully involved the

Recommendation B is specifically around a cabinet report over a a head leas restructure uh and if you are so minded to want to be sitting down with us and talking about head leas restructure I don’t mind subbing to you because it’s not the thing that gets me out of bed in

The morning um but you’re absolutely right in that you know the ward councilors need to be absolutely embedded within uh what happens next in pool but if if it’s about a headle restructure um I have no objection to having you there but uh you know you

Might want to rethink on that so unless you have a specific interest um but yeah thank you for your supportive comments if you haven’t been and done your shopping um there you know I would recommend it is lovely and you know who knows actually you know that we have a a

Similar Center um in boson with the Sovereign Center you know what what could be done with boson with what’s there that could actually take a Lea from from what’s gone on in Paul and I you know if you want to come and have a look and you know meet uh the manager

There and see just what they’ve done I think it would be a huge benefit it um because I do think it is a great um a great model for the future so yeah I think Paul has a a very good future if we can just uh give us a chance to start

Again thank you counselor um do we have consensus on this is there any dissension councelor Hayes I’d like to abstain please Madam chair thank you is everybody else content and we mark councelor ha’s exstension thank you thank you members okay um item 20 questions from counselors um we have got three

Questions from counselors for this meeting but councelor canaban is unable to attend so um he will have a written answer to his question and uh that and the answer the question and the answer will be recorded in the minutes um supplementary questions counselors they are available for councelors to respond directly to the

Portfolio holder um but these questions must be indeed questions and not statements following on from what the portfolio holder has said um I will stop any further dialogue if it doesn’t bring further Clarity to the issue or doesn’t relate to the matter of the original question um and the time limit for

Asking and responding to a question is three minutes can I just say counselors that we’ve been doing in my view from up here extremely well on our timings and I think that might be the clock and I must also admit counselors that there has been a little teething trouble up here

But nothing really nothing nothing to go um nothing too nothing too bad um so I’m going to go in now to um ask councelor Fara uh you have a question to put to the leader of the council and the portfolio portfolio holder for dynamic places who is the same person councelor

Vicky Slade on escalation of arguments to decision makers councelor far thank you very much uh Madam chair and uh I don’t find the clock as a tyranny um but I’ll try to uh keep within it and perhaps um some clarification on how long I can have for my supplemental

Because I don’t think that’s necessarily covered um by the Constitution um the question is this I cabinet on the 7th of February I asked a question relating to the definition of non-essential spending and how as members we can challenge a refusal by a decision maker to not to

Allow for pre preventative or essential maintenance repairs replacement remedial works the reply from the section 151 officer confirmed that there was the ability for people to argue their case and that that conversation then can be reflected upon my question is this how does a member escalate an argument

To a higher decision maker or director or leadership when a manager officer has given a no answer within their area of responsibility or authorization level councelor Slade thank you councelor Fara for your question the financial pressures facing local government are well documented and BCP council is no different the budgets

That that we have been working to deliver since we formed the administration last year has required every Department to consider its spending and to ensure that budget holders actively drive down the cost of the service current and previous procedures adopted in respect of a freeze or non-essential expenditure

Place a lot of onus on the budget holder to be satisfied that they are adhering to the established criteria it also allows for escalation as high up as the chief executive although it would be expected that this would be exercised through the budget holders line management structures to service and

Corporate directors in the first instance if a member is not happy with the decision of a budget holder it is suggested they email the budget holder’s line manager or service director to consider it further furthermore there are regular meetings that involve Group Leaders with the leader of the council

And Democratic services and this sort of issue can always be flagged during such meetings and as I confirmed in my email to all members today my door is always open open and if there are specific issues I’m always happy to talk them through and see if we can unlock the

Problem councilor Fara a supplementary question thank you very much Madam chair it would be rude not to um thank you very much for that reply it does give me some degree of um uh understanding um of the decision making process to say yay or nay based upon the circumstance of

The issue so my question is this I appreciate that there isn’t a documented way of um uh moving up through and I really appreciate the leader’s explanation for an offer of her door being open but to work around this pressure which is upon decision makers and budget holders is

That sometimes I believe as a ward counselor then some things which are not beneficial or even hazardous to the health of residents are being overlooked because we need to save the money so is there a nuclear button perhaps there I could press that to say I have a fear or

A concern for public healthy or Public public health or for the services which are agreed to be delivered by the council to actually escalate that would that be listened to thank you councelor SL can you um respond I can councelor um rice could you turn your microphone off thank you

Um speaking as a ward counselor if I was concerned that there was a matter of public safety health and safety personal safety I would automatically pick up phone to the appropriate service director it would not cross my mind mind to worry about a more Junior member of

Staff who was worried that they didn’t feel they could do that and I think we all have a responsibility if there is a genuine problem however I would say that we should use those things cautiously because I would not want every one of the 76 members suddenly running to our

Service directors and claiming health and safety because we all know what trouble that gets us all into but seriously you know we do have to use common sense we do have to understand that our staff are put under you know pressure they have to keep within their

Budgets and last week we heard the aspirations of of all of the other groups and we know the aspirations of all of these people here are the things we’re not able to do because we don’t have enough money and therefore it would be wrong for us to just say yeah go

Ahead and spend the money when actually we know the things we can’t do and that other people are being told no because someone over here is being told yes so I think it’s right that we respect our officers when they make a decision and that we go through a proper process of

Escalating it and saying help me understand what went wrong there but if it’s a matter of public safety or personal safety just pick up the phone use teams drop an email to somebody who can make that decision and if necessary you can go all the way to

Graham sorry I thought you going to say something accepting responsibility very true um councilor Fara again um I understand you now have a question to put to councelor Kieran Wilson who is the portfolio holder for housing and Regulatory services on reporting of graffiti councilor Fara thank you madam

Chair I was distracted by um getting the chief executive’s um number on speed dial um what steps is the local Authority taking to alert report and monitor to rectification the reporting of graffiti or non-public installations I.E commercial premises service buildings and installations such as cable boxes and roadside Furniture post box post

Boxes and telephone boxes and how can these be improved to ensure that graffiti is removed in a timely fashion and service level expectations for ins uring our public realm an immunity does not deteriorate to a point of neglect uh thank you councelor Fara for your question um as a local Authority

BCP Council have limited powers to secure action by private property owners to remove graffiti from their own property there are powers under Section uh 215 of the Town and Country planning act and section 43 of the antisocial Behavior crime and policing act 2014 which can be utilized for specific cases

But is far from a timely solution due to the administration investigation and legal challenges and has to be prioritized in line with other statutary duties within the Environmental Protection Team where the demands are significant I’m sorry can you are you okay um where the resource permits and certain thresholds are met with regards

To offensiveness and or severity of the adverse impact officers will identify those responsible and where necessary serve the relevant notices this can be challenging and understandably owners can feel victimized twice by having criminal damage to their property and enforcement from the council to clear afterwards um residents can report

Incidents of graffiti to the relevant utility companies and other asset holders requesting action as detailed on our web page incidents of graffiti are the responsibility of the property owner and they should be contacted directly thank you councelor farar do you have a supplementary question I do Madam chair

But if you forgive me I missed the last sentence by the pfly order there councelor Wilson can you repeat that um the incidents of graffiti are the responsibility of the property owner and they should be contacted directly so where where the graffiti is on the person’s property it’s their

Responsibility thank you very much for that answer and uh Madam chair I do have a supplemental based upon the answer um and my question um and the fact that uh appropriate legislation was referred to because of the limitations of the local Authority will the portfolio holder

Undertake um to explore um I think you mentioned section 125 um I’m not sure which particular act it is but to troll through the appropriate acts such as the 2005 cleaner neighborhoods and environment acts to see what pressure can be brought to Fair particularly on features of our environment because

I’m a great believer that like ATT tracks like and should a franchise um of you know a retail outlet or should a particular cable provider not look after their equipment then very quickly as we’ve all seen on our own boards that um there’s ferv graffi um gets attracted

And that sense of neglect that sense of loss of immunity continues to escalate so my question to the portfolio Holder will we once again look at how we can improve our reporting to those parties that are responsible for that property such as telephone boxes and ensure that

It goes through to a reasonable level of service level agreement because at the moment I’m sure that they are making some effort but perhaps that’s not serving the residents of our free towns um thank you councelor yeah I’m more than happy to go away and you know work

With you have a meeting with you and look with officers on how we can improve um this I I do understand though that it is uh very resource heavy thing and um I I I mean if you have individual cases I’m happy to contact the utility um companies directly you know if there’s

In particular ones that have been causing uh particular issues but um in general I think the initial part of my answer still pretty much stands but I’m happy to go away with you and uh and kind of discuss this offline hope you thank you councelor Wilson um item

21 I’ll ask the chief executive to advise members of any urgent decisions taken by him than you chairman just one decision which is to uh receive the accelerating reform fund Grant from the Department of Health and Social care uh where I I think they gave us about five days uh

Notice and had to have a signed confirmation by then so it was an urgent decision um we received about 700,000 over two years from that right thank you thank you very much chief executive um members I believe the feed will be going off in a minute and

We can close the meeting so thank you very much for the debate