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Good evening, apologetic Irena Arena welcome to the Arena channel apologetics today we have a guest who will talk about the origin of the Cross his name is Denis Silva Denis Silva and he will talk about the origin of the Cross I Have you researched the origin of the

Cross and I learned segin the cross is a symbol widely known and has origins ancient ones that date back to different cultures traditions around the world address some of the main ones here for you to have a guide to what will be covered here by our guest

The shape of the Cross was already used as symbol even before Christianity in antiquity the cross was present in diverse cultures such as ancient Egypt where it was associated with eternal life, finally crops were also found Mesopotamian cultures eh eh for example of the Celtic cultures, too pre-Columbian is where it had

Meanings related to Life fertility and divinity then Crosses Enough with the sausage stuffing and let’s go call our guest Share this Live but before calling the guest let me see who’s in the chat with us I want to send everyone a hug special for our dear Paulo Alexandre present here in the arena

Apologetics a hug Paulo Alexandre welcome Jean present skeleton attending Leandro Sérgio Costa let me see Marcos Lola dear Marcos Lola hugs to you that’s it and We also have Cronos here scoring presence Look, guys, the guy’s name Cronos Have you thought Diego Mesquita big hug for you Léo Batista let me

See who else is here with us Well, Cristiano in crisis, let’s go Share this Live here you go while ch while I call the vignette to the guest enter will share this Live there beauty And remembering that today the super chat will be open ok Beauty then, no more delay, let go vignette Good evening Denis, welcome dear and So how are things, boy? likes to study about the Cross, huh? So Denis, what are you in charge of? Good evening Elton, how are you? Good evening, everyone who is following us here too our conversation is It’s a pleasure to be talking to you now

Right, the first time I’m participating here I would also like to thank you for the opportunity to freedom of expression I’m fine thanks to God Everything is calm And today we are going talk a little about this subject that certainly mainly for Christians it is a matter at least

In my opinion, something quite relevant and important huh huh very good eh you because you, for example, are not very common for people to talk about the Cross right, why did you choose this one? subject What drew your attention to you call to talk about this subject What’s good about this subject?

Here you as a young theologian yes you can say thank you for the young man is the cross how fore you even brought attention When did our conversation begin? here bringing the allusion that we we will talk the cross is one of the most well-known symbols if not the

Best known throughout the world, besides Within the religious context we find cross in different situations in our world contemporary even in music t-shirts tattoos in art and so on before and many all that many people think that some doctrines or some customs due to the fact of having that

Label carrying the name Christian has origin of Christianity or and origin of Judaism due to the fact that Christianity originated of Judaism, right, but unfortunately with the As time passes, we will analyze further compared to some some rituals some objects were introduced into Christianity, right?

That’s what I’m going to try to make an effort here to address this Wonderful subject, so that means you recognize that the cross It is well even before what was presented in the context of Jesus yes yes quite old and it has access to have information information

Regarding this subject, not with the fact from the internet materials we got understand this well then many things What I’m going to bring to your attention here isn’t it? It’s such a secret, right? For some people right Uhum and wonder me I do want to talk, don’t feel like it I want you

To interrupt talk and a question that I want to leave It is quite clear here that the idea is not change anyone’s mind, right? We have the right to believe that we want to believe we have the freedom for that, right? So who are we for? try to dictate things to other people

People are free to believe Whatever you want, the idea here is to get up, right? arguments counterarguments is to bring archaeological issues documents old academic materials so that hereby to people alone Analyze and draw your conclusions, right? important is to add knowledge and that This strengthens our faith as Christians or Uhum

Eh Wonderful Here we have a speech from skeleton skeleton who knows Greek boy, but he’s a Greek, okay, I looked like modern, right, Adelfo is missing oo Here it is, right there, Adel Adel Adel And in this case it has to be in the plural because

In the singular it has to be AD because two brothers you put it there so you Nal said, he wants to say a big hug here it has to be in the accusative case right Elon and Denis to you brother my brother thank you skeleton a hug for you how affectionate

Nobre was in this case, right AD, it was plural thank you dear, a kiss to you and Congratulations on the Greek, it’s very good, eh dear Denis, I wanted to make you one ask the following This is where you first identify the presence of the Cross there is a culture

Specific where you can say aa cross she has been since that time and not the cross is Since the time of Jesus and for back no one has ever spoken before but we have ali mesopotamian culture egyptian culture we have other cultures there too I wanted you to help us

Understand if there is a start to that one of these cultures would come here eh eh emancipating the question of the Cross exist that We have references, right? academics in the area that helps us try to follow the story as much as possible try to follow try to do a study

To reach the maximum of what really some cultures believed right archeology even to try reach this beautiful world that existed, right? in the past but for example responding I have your question with me here Hands over to the V or Vine dictionary, right who?

Prefer let me give you a Cruz a close up for you to present your dictionary Wonderful dear wow under the word Cruz There goes talk about stauros later We can even comment on it he will explain what it means stauros it must be distinguished from ecclesiastical form of the two-beamed Cross

Then the dictionary says it like this for us, the format of the last one had the its origin in ancient Chaldea was used as a symbol of tamus being in the form Mystic of such, right, the initial letter a letter T ne of your name in that country in

Ter of eh ADC engento Egypt as even you said there in the 3rd century the churches had distanced themselves and parodied certain Christian doctrines in order to increase the prestige of the Ecclesiastical system Apostle the pagans were received into uhum church and dependent on your Regeneration, in other words, they didn’t need it

To convert they simply needed adhere to Christianity, right Uhum and some symbols and customs were introduced over time within the church the name D is syncretism, not absorption of Perhaps an older religion new religion it does not take care of a once and for all but she will gradually absorbing this custom, right?

Uhum, I left you one too slide I would like you if you can, right? give us the image number a Wonder had even forgotten to fishing The fishing slide now Wonderful moment then guys and here is the Denis, firstly I want to thank Denis, right for his debut here in the arena

Apologetics where he comes bringing a new subject which is about the origin of Cruz is Denis So congratulations primarily for this initiative and for you are interested in something that no one ever touched on the subject of origin da Cruz, right, generally to people bring values ​​related subjects

To the Cross, not in itself the cross itself as you’re doing well here so you can continue Denis in the meantime I will fishing here your slide OK, let’s see if we can do it here at no slide El will put it for us there I

I separated there were many other images that eu I could share it with you here, right? but soon he will put for example we have a raw image of the mother goddess of 2500 BC is not found in the Museum Archaeological National in Italy we also have a cruciform idol

From 300 308 3800 to 2500 at the museum Cyprus and also a cruciform idol of goddess of Canaan from the 15th century there in the Museum from Israel, right? So we have this these Idols who literally had the shaped like a cross, i.e. a God with open arms, right, we have this

Difference you managed to share with us there now Yes, here’s the image, right? Image illustrative, right? obviously So look at all of them TM this similarity an image of a God of open arms that we will see even in the another context going to now walking a little bit of history coming to

History of Rome in Roman times It was also quite common to use the Cross by both the Romans and the Greeks, right? just different than many people think that the cross was simply a object of torture or condemnation against those who broke the law Romana, right, and everything else wasn’t

Simply an object of torture but literally the cross it represented One God for the Romans and the Greeks This was also known as the trophy of Victory trophy victory every time the Romans won a battle armor of the soldiers who were defeated were hung on this wooden structure representing that

That God is usually the sun God he he was responsible for the army Roman managed to win that battle for example, we have image two if you can put it to us some examples let’s go with this Victory trophy you will put to We wonder that there are two images, right? ISO

So we have the reference, right? eh trophy da victory trophy Julius coin Caesar Roman trophy there in the wars of Anas of the year 113 and the victory trophy of 1st century is in the Berlin museum, right? more illustrative but which gives we have an idea uhum regarding that Welton yes even

The church fathers they speak Justly about these victory trophies that he came to na in his time I I can share it here by reading may may for ex Tertullian in his Apologia he speaks like this if some of do you think we worship supposing the cross in this adoration you are

Sharing with us we showed you before that your deities see only are made in shapes modeled on the cross or it is eh object was made an image of Sera and was placed on that Cross but you too worship victories because in your trophies the cross is the support of the

Trophy the religion of the camps Romans is entirely directed to the cult of we see this a lot even in films or a collection of banners above all gods well those images shown on the stands are ornaments of Crosses that support it All those things hanging on your banners and flags are garments

De Cruzes then Tertuliano makes it clear here that the cross represented a God sometimes more than one God, right? mainly the sun God Roman God that for the Greeks, Apollo was also the eh Justino in his Apology he says So also in the topic, right, the cross unknown by demons says so

And even their own names leave manifests the strength of this figure This is the your banners and trophies Victory with which everywhere you carry out your marches showing the signs of empire and power until it does leaves without a voice to give his own against them images of your emperors interesting what the

Emperors they were also considered Gods and History shows that when they were dead they were too an image of ca was placed in this in this Victory trophy for What with the idea of ​​them joining the Gods elsewhere they would become a God after his death then continues are consecrated by you with

Figures and you call Gods in your registrations and finalizing, right? the parents of church some of them right opment said Here you have Marco Minúcio Félix in your work he says like this, you who sanctify wooden Gods well probably love wooden crosses as portions of their Gods, then, archeology, right, objects

Found but old documents such as for example the church fathers speaking to respect for the Crosses and what he saw in that in their world in which they they lived, right Uhum, it shows clearly that the origin of the Cross of The fact is that pagan religions have no way

Escape from this truth because it is archeology is documented and as time passes of time this was added to the Christianity and that’s what we’re going to see here later on uhum Ok if you want I can go to the next one image next image Uhum it’s a topic quite interesting

Right, the idea of ​​an instrument instrument you can even place the instrument number three or instrument TR number not TR image sorry Ah calm down, oh It’s an instrument that’s what it can be ask, right? Is this wood? especially in the middle, I think that participants can understand what is that there

The vast majority of people don’t know that in addition to that of the Cross being represented like a God with open arms and many customs that were added for example the sign of the cross was made in the past for protection against evil spirits or demons today we see the cross

Planted, for example in cemeteries, right? Where did this come from for the Romans? before entering a battle they placed the cross on the tombs of warriors who made a difference, right? battles and who died what was the Their aim is to bring the spirit for the protection of the army so that

Somehow that spirit was helping in battles and the other function of the Cross was to protect against evil spirits right, so it was stuck sometimes and the Crosses on tombs to prevent Enemy spirits get in the way in some way also the life of the Romans

We even see seen we see a lot this for example in vampire issues right, the cross is used to fight the vampire is something that these types of custom, right, in a very subliminal way, it was adopted on the issue of the Resurrection for example use this symbol, right? Just look at this

Image there was quite a piece interesting because there was the God of victory that the Romans used to use in her battles she asked for this protection of the victory of this God but also when it was to punish then den So Danis means that the cross doesn’t even

Has always been seen as an instrument of torture but was also seen as a object of worship is That’s exactly what he was for the Romans. literally a God represented a God in arms open that’s right interesting, but look, there was also a punishing God known as God

Priapus this God he took action when the victim would be then Eh asfix in this structure and this helps us understand For example, what some church fathers spoke about this structure that There was a very interesting object Tertullian example against Marcion he Say it like that, it certainly wasn’t the intention

To be a rhenoceros rhinoceros We remember that he has a horn, right, just on the nose right with the horn or with the Minotaur with two horns but in him Christ is nominate a bull according to your characteristics for some people Ruled like one judge to another

Kind as a savior here speaking the church fathers already adding Jesus, right? we saw here an allusion already from the Fathers of church placing Jesus the figure of Jesus related to the Cross but that’s what we’ll see later in our conversation here but later

Say it like this because in the antenna that is part of the Cross the ends are called horns while the middle stake the entire structure is the Unicorn What did Tertullian want? say that there was a one one structure in middle of the stake Central where the person who would stay there

Is fixed he would he would sit on that in this structure but it was not just a car seat was an object shaped like a horn that would be used for impale the person beyond the torture itself right, she was subjected to this structure, that is, it was literally a

Stupe that was happening and it was the Deus man there was impalement in the CR, right? it was impalement on the cross uhum by the as parts intimate this private God if you see in internet put priapus has some images of him he is represented in a God with giant male organ

Showing that he was a phallic God, right? a God that he caused this kind of punishment torture against victims for example Nat also here Justino right in dialogue with tryfon he talks like this in his work is in effect an ace of the Cross rises vertically and the part emerges from it

Higher when adjusted to transversal its ends appear from a side by side like horns united into one single horn in addition to the stake that rises in the middle and on which the the body of the crucified is also like a protruding horn This also appears to a horn configuring the spike with

Other horns So even the father of the church called Irineu he also speaks to respect for this piece, we can say that it existed in the act of Crucifixion of the Romans, right? it was a way of causing a Suffering greater against victim only interesting Elton, yes many people many people, right?

Within your your faith and your honestly, the idea is not to get into this merit, right? Uhum, maybe you’ll avoid analyze some some some subjects I may not know due to lack of interest or even for another reason but then it kind of ends veiling some questions perhaps out of fear

To face some situation truths within that faith that she has Well, maybe, I thought, I believed it about this, but I realize that analyzing the History therefore has to be something based on analyzing the history of documents archeology and the Bible mainly maybe she people avoid dealing with some

Matters and stays in an accommodating manner You simply receive information, but don’t try to guess if that really is true or not OK can continue we have just another image three let’s see here here oh I have one more image number 4 that shows how was this impalement process was

To this day, somewhere some places on earth if it is done impalement yes, for example, an image of British museum, right, I ended up cutting it there which would be the origin or when like when this object was found but see we see there a way of impalement, right Uh, interesting that

Some translations Zon when he says that some passages, right? Tell me that the king Babylon hung some people there, right? that they had dared against their sovereignty they hung him in Madeiro uhum when you say hang in Madeiro hum a We understand that if the person was hanged

Don’t you generally understand this to be the case? right, a person was hanged, but in fact the which is bringing attention to the fact that there was a impalement related to some rule that was breached in those Nations ancient, not a palace where hung the person by the private parts

Or even by the head fixed to that structure by the throat person then this historical context helps to clarify some questions some biblical passages, right? For example, I have here I don’t know if You can zoom in, go to this image where is the british museum

Right where it shows a form of palament in Babylon or Persia I don’t know if it’s possible see the person being impaled here for the neck means that it sticks, sticks the instrument sticks through the neck even is for genital regions no too And then this generates a death by the fact dear

Was immediate So in quotation marks because the mainly in the genital area person had to have their own weight person doing what they do with what slip so to speak um so until reaching a part where the person TRS 4 live hours in some cases, right because

No organ was fatal, it didn’t happen There are no vestments that people they stayed alive longer, right? Exactly because until you reach one, because until you get to a part that hit something fatal, the person would stay in that agony until then, right? I imagine So that’s the question of da da

Of the Cross, right? We learn here that it is not simply an object of torture but there was something there was always something religious behind has always represented Gods for the nations wants to be Egypt Babylon Romans Greeks culminate in na Interesting question about Jesus, that’s right some cultures had a cross as

An interesting sacred object, right? This seems like it’s really, really historic It even seems that the Mesopotamians already they had this tendency No, you know would say something about this is aa questions of of of ancient cultures, right? associated as we commented about from the people of mesopotania, egypt Babylon

Right Uhum Babilônia, for example, large her customs are introduced today into contemporary religions, right? a slightly changed shape but it’s there present and that’s what happened example with some questions from Christianity for example if I take here again the dictionary feel free Like Egypt dealt with this issue of the Cross as if

In Egyptian culture, it was the cross for Egyptians the question of the Cross she always had the see with life resurrection uhum I even commented when when oh Denis I apologize to you for me to interrupt you that It happens to us when I’m with an atheist there

They will say oh Elto will become an atheist when I’m a Calvinist and I’m going to become one Calvinist when I’m with the witness of Jehovah you are Jehovah’s witness yes When I’m with Jehovah’s Witness Elto will become a testimony of Jehovah People What do I do? I bring who here?

I’m going to bring I’m going to bring Jesus here on live here only if it’s for the love of God, which is That’s it guys What is this if I turn around Jehovah’s testimony, yes, what do you have? and if I become yours What do you have, right But

If I don’t turn around, what do you have? also that’s that’s that’s a lot of stuff this thing, sorry Denis, please you can continue, I apologize It’s okay, no problem, it’s here next to me see, right, bringing up this subject that you You said, here is a place that is open

For opinions, right, and the idea is say what you want here or here here is your home for anyone who come here I say this really clean liente, each one is enough, right? ideas absorb what is valid for she she absorbs what is not her absorbs including you including you

The opinions of others are to be congratulated you are to be congratulated because none of the da da de We evangelicals came here to make a presentation that you are So, congratulations to you and Congratulations also to the Witnesses of Jehovah, don’t you know if I’m going to become a Witness?

Of Jehovah because Jehovah’s Witnesses Today some Witnesses met with me of Jehovah and they handed me this one pamphlet what would I call this from here, pamphlet, pamphlet, right, we call of leaflet leaflet leaflet is leaflet ee very polite people Congratulations testimony of Jehovah were very polite, you understand

Oh what is this, right? Continue Okay, so the question of the data of symbols, right? was always a symbol of reviving of resurrecting, right, a cycle of life for example until the one that gives the symbol of zodiac we have that Cross right, that Cross that is a direct cycle

Uhum, we always see a cycle of income of life, right in the question why example of the immortality of the Soul, right? what is taught is always aggregated in these cultures, the ancient ones are a symbol that brings life, right, so that the person can can always continue a cycle after the

Death that’s why the cross I I commented specifically for example in the in the tombs is the question of Resurrection right Jesus in this case Of course it is a biblical question Jesus is the resurrection only this This doctrine is in citrus in this question is adapted from Cruz, right?

Isolate one thing from another, right? of the Resurrection that was grafted onto the Christianity related to this God of open arms, right, then it was added to the Cristian right then means that let me ask you something else and I’ll I heard some lines that say the following that Jesus He died of

Open arms or died with arms like that up as is how would you say that Jesus died from this position or of this Jesus following according to the scriptures he died in the Jewish way although The vast majority they they tend to the Roman side due to the fact that soldiers

They led Jesus there to Emperor Pilate there that was bringing him attention to the people so it always leans to the side Roman but if we analyze the scriptures objectively we will see that Jesus he was placed in that structure to the Jewish Molds and the Jews they

Never used Crosses as a form of punishment never used Crosses all scholars and theologians I don’t understand Sorry that’s a Roman idea, wasn’t it a Roman idea? exactly both Roman and other people that we only saw here a very important question arises interesting about that too Elton

Eh, as much as Jesus Christ was Let’s assume here we come to the conclusion that Jesus died in the Roman form of execution now we have to worry with another question What shape was it that because in punishments even the parents of the church they bring attention very well

Pay attention, there were many forms Exact punishment existed in the form cruciform there was the shape of of already stake form reta straight stake punishments were used also very frequently both in the Egypt in Babylon by Assyria by the Greeks, for example, there is a representation here at the museum of

Louvr where is a sculpture from Greece can you give a joke to me there oh oh the museum of praise I don’t know if it isn’t That’s how it’s pronounced, I don’t know, let me see we have this representation in a single more Museum deeta tries tries to put more Try adding more

Hey wait Louvre Louvre Louvre ah té se say no to this business documentary shown on the History channel crucifixion phd jonathan reid professor from the university of vermo california regarding whether the punishment carried out by Alexandre grande Ah sim Alexandre grande right at that time, it’s also the time that

Also highlighted the issue of SIM talk about all this stuff I’m talking about presenting much of it I’m not advertising because I’m not making no money from it The objective here is to share material Uhum, you can buy them, right? people there who are watching us can

Buy and take advantage of, for example, cross o the cross a pagan symbol in the middle Christian So this book here I bought It’s been a while since I remember how long I paid and it brings a lot more archaeological reference historical and biblical, logically speaking regarding this matter that we are

Scrutinizing here so elor beauty let’s come to the conclusion Jesus died in Roman form what was this form let’s go enter into another situation because no one can come to the conclusion that Jesus died in raw form so It is simply a tradition of the Church Catholic as well as other traditions that

She imposed it, right, and as time passed, grafted onto other denominations So, in this question, define define for us laymen defines for us laymen eh eh to this type of crucifixion specifically for us to understand is when speak crucifixion in our world contemporary we understand that it is a

Person with open arms ready and finished right Uhum I understand this is this is a crucifixion anyone who speaks oh cross we will soon remember in the shape of a T, right? That’s going to be natural But why why, right? Then we return to the question, is it good?

Good to understand this so we can get the thread of the skein, right? Then we’ll get into it question whether Jesus died in Jewish form or in Roman form the scriptures sacred when she talks about the object that Jesus he was submitted She uses a word called stauros stauros sei stauros stauros né

You’re a Greek teacher, right? a pronunciation is including some people confuse these with kiasmos, right? questions of kiasmos that kiasmos will give an idea of ​​crossover give an idea of Contraposition Balance How much staros gives an idea of Cruz exactly and that asms right that you

Brought attention to chiasmus that refers to is something cruciform isn’t it, it’s crossed It’s a crossed idea this word what this can talking is not was That’s right that’s why example crosswords, right? crusades acrostic acrostic understood But it’s only that’s right it can continue and that word we don’t we found nowhere

Scriptures that show them but the words stauros eilon pilon, that’s how it’s pronounced Sorry my Greek Fuleco right, you have no obligation to say what Greek correctly is fine there is nothing related to the Cross a Cruci object form but literally Simple wood like that and for example even

Reference works it helps us to understand this by going back here to the Wi dictionary I would like to even make an addendum here related to Wi dictionary if by chance those who If you’re following us, there’s no such thing work if you are going to buy it I suggest buying it

From the 2002 edition down 2002 to older older versions why Because this reference is here that I am quoting in this Ed if you look at most current Vine dictionary unfortunately the publishing house of the Assembly of God she doctored this this this text of English work we will not find these

References here regarding that of the Cross right, it came from Calé do Deus Tamuz Uhum that it was added to the churches, right? the passage of time with the help of Constantine we don’t have it, we won’t have it we will have this reference Unfortunately, sleep was adulterated But anyway, right, buy one

Oldest dictionary you will ever have the original work in English, right? unfortunately in Portuguese we have there is a great lack of academic work, the greatest part of the of the matters that we We have to resort to works in English, right? Uhum, but anyway, here it says stauros, right?

Primarily denotes post or stake vertical In such pieces the malefactor US were used as execution noun stauros is from the verb esturo tie to a stake the post must be Originally distinguished from the form church of the two-beamed Cross is the we see and we talk a little

More in the beginning, right And we have others construction Here, for example, JD’s dictionary Douglas, he speaks the Greek word like this for Cruz is Pentacles means First a straight post or beam and secondarily a pole used as instrument of Punishment and execution is used as the latter in the sense in

In the New Testament the noun occurs 28 times and the verb 46 times execute except the simple and straight post known as Cruz Simplex we have this the models of Cruzes, right? fits the cross Simplex also the dictionary international theology of the new testament says so, o stauros, it’s a

Straight stake and sometimes sharp bridge can serve various purposes like stake for a fence A foundation a palisade palisade there were several, several groupings of stauros or stakes for do what Era fence to make those those stakes pointy to fight against others enemy armies then did Aqua ag bridge structure facing

Enemies, right, so that they would go to battle pierced there, right At the time of da battle then literally meant a wooden object just that right, one straight stake and the others example lid Scott na In your dictionary right, gre english Lex speaks a fence like Stakes or palisades simply that and

Also the same way the expression xilon Gentlemen cake basically means this when these words were translated from Greek even in the septuagint, it doesn’t use aa word xilon to be able to translate the Hebrew scriptures Remembering that the Hebrew scriptures we cannot find never once does the word Cruz then

Always you Agent used the expression xilon in passages over time, right? there was a need to make a translation into the Latin language for Latin used the word cross with x hence deliver our word Cruz, right? Portuguese in other languages ​​except Cruz in Latin this is called etymology

Words the cross in Latin is nothing more also than the meaning of stauros it was simply a wooden stake it just doesn’t represent a cross as we understand the word Cross today for us right in our world in our world today religious Oh Denis there is one one one open

Quotation marks bullshit between evangelicals and Jehovah’s Witnesses in this matter of try to define the cross as an art merely and evangelicals try define the cross as an art with a crossing another wood according to some models Mesopotamians It was an art with a type of circle, right? Something circular there

Top was even a type of God for the God gives life finally to the Mesopotamians why am I talking to you? saying this is because I wanted to know and eh, what will this imply? eh in doctrinal issues in which doctrinally this will imply whether the

Cross is an art if the cross is is is is queas Mythic about what this will imply for you Could you say or Oh yes for sure Yes, let’s go in parts, so let’s explain this cross with this ase there, isn’t it a shape of cycle we find this related to God

Sun the sun for the Romans was the God Apollo for the Greeks he is represented like a sun right, that’s the thing, the cross na na na Mesopotamian art Eh can meet representations in the form of a cross that was known as Cruz ansata or cross and this Cross had a shape of

A key, right? It was vertical art with a bow in a hoop shape on the key-like top and also call of an that was associated with the God of life fertility in ancient religion Egyptian including you can continue until the God seven neither aham So explaining this situation we have

Two elements there it was very good you raise this issue which is important uhum can you finish your reasoning sorry it wasn’t just what I wanted really ask why there is a problem evangelicals want the cross Ah let me get my brushes here ready, evangelicals want the cross

Be it like this or identify the cross like this in this way for the eh for the Jehovah’s Witnesses it seems like it seems that it is interesting that the cross is a art like that So for me that doesn’t matter much relevance understood important is what is

Important result the essence and eh eh involved in spiritual matters and everything else if the cross was like this if the cross was like this if the cross was like this a key well but what happens you presented cross models here British Museum this Cross here you know

More or less specify the year I don’t remember her, let me see if I I think here in the representation of the book OK, let me see here, this one, this one here we already have a proposal to be crusade right What is her year here? you also already have a cross here

Proposal of with open arms and this one here is also this one which is from first century after Christ, right? It seems that This here, as these say, is the trophies victory trophies, right? we bring the victory trophy belongs to Júlio Cesa in 46 to 45 BC oxa this here

A Nice Guy will come up with a cool idea So what do we have here as a model de Cruz from that time we What did the image is deciphering for us that what this image is saying was there were the enemy armor placed in this structure, i.e. representing that

That God he was victorious over the your enemies so what do they they did, they took the armor of their enemies and clothing this structure showing that that God was victorious over his enemies i.e. the one responsible for the battle was the one God not associated Cross consequently

Is a God in the form of a Cross, yes God always have the victory trophies was in the form of Cross as well as the objects that we vios here this one is also a model of here you 1st century victory trophy after Christ museum in Berlin, right?

What is this Look at this there is there is a model is what I like, right, we were talking about wrong chiasmus that that that object that you showed here I looked at is an amulet dated around the again 200 damn look at this look at this one

Oh look at this one, oh God of Canaan, 15th century BC Museum of Israel was already a cross, right? of Cruz n it was all shaped like Cross Gods in formats of open arms than the cross it literally represents a God of open arms uhum for religions

Old ones right CTO right now we go now to the point of the question in what That means oh I found a super chat here at Scania Super super thanks Scania cat yes eh, what does this imply in questions doctrinal in spiritual matters What is the outcome of this cross?

Be with open arms or the cross be So, what does this imply? for So let’s go there first I guess that everyone is in agreement, right? Regardless of whether it is a trinit or whether it is a unicist if it is a completely monotheistic Christian, I think this is at the points that

Let’s agree our salvation depends solely and exclusively due to the thanks to Jesus’ ransom sacrifice Christ thanks to his sacrifice we can have our sins forgiven and opportunity to have eternal life and a relationship close to your God and father that is that is Peaceful fact for all of us, right?

Regardless of what denomination we we belong as Christians Really that would be a matter secondary but that’s the question, right? For Christians, the Bible encourages Always look for the real knowledge is not true knowledge this is biblical knowledge historical knowledge in all areas so it will reflect our faith by no example

Evangelical he will agree that It’s right to have an idol, I won’t I will not bring attention to the issue of to worship an idol but to have an idol as representing your faith and the cross we literally need to understand this She’s an idol She’s an idol An idol

Pagan of ancient religions maybe not be worshiped perhaps like Catholics comes the cross in a little way more peculiar, right in the Catholic faith Uhum but is an is an object that has been added to faith Christian, that is, the Bible itself says that the association has God’s table with the

Table of demons, right? add symbols within Christianity end not being something pure, right if you saw a person like that, for example, if you saw an evangelical and concerning the cross what would you ask he It’s a very interesting question I I would ask why that what would be the origin of the

Cruz uhum and why besides which would be the origin of the Cross, right? And if in fact we can reach a conclusive way that Jesus actually died on a cross because an interesting question arises, right? Could the almighty God of would leave your son dies in a

Cross inside is punished by a god punisher that’s the question behind also that we must understand why Ali we have to understand that when the person was submitted to that that that situation she was being punished by a God Jesus being dying on a cross he was being punished by a God not

We can’t escape this culture Roman culture naturalization right, so it’s something that you believe that Jesus died on a cross OK but you will have to understand that why come back from this you will have to accept this this this this within a religious issue ok then that means that then that means

Dear Dan, what do you mean then? clash between Jehovah’s witness and the evangelical It would happen because the witness of Jehovah was going to say that Jesus was not punished by God because he died like this arm Possibly like this or not like that matters but as long as it was in a

Torture instrument called Cross however, it was not necessarily what does the deaths mean stake crusade is then you so if you asked evangelicals about the origin of the Cross he would not know answer because eh eh Generally the evangelicals don’t research much about that, oh, I don’t know that they exist

People who are evangelical scholars scholars who seek in a way specific to know this, right? So if he say that the cross is with arms open and this will imply a doctrinal issue and an understanding mistaken in the question of doctrine is that explain this to us in questions secondary obviously because the

The important thing is that Jesus died point right Uhum that’s what it is important for Christians but so that that thing that I again I’ll repeat it again, for example in proverbs Chapter 23 Verse 23 there says we should buy the truth or acquire the truth

Right, right, and don’t sell it, that is, oo Christian he has the responsibility to analyze what what he believes It really has a biblical basis historical and everything so that it is not just one faith eh how can i say borrowed what they said to me is what I

I believe uhum because what that involves more on this issue Elton is what brought you to attention Well, come on, when I talk to T Jehovah I become T Jehovah when I’m an atheist I have to become an atheist now because of which is a prejudice against a certain group or

Person causes people’s minds to ignorance closes the mind with respect things that are plausible that the person has that has documents has archeology that proves it, I can even say what I think I can believe it and I agree with some basic constructs that this type of behavior is more than one

Personal interpretation made about of life but how good that in Brazilians No, human beings are fine so dear Denis is getting interesting this is Scania, thank you Scania for five years he said the following for JW Jehovah’s Witnesses in stake of the crucifixion of Jesus the plaque

Roman that brings King of the Jews was over the head or over the hands oh interesting question and now how that you get a lot out of this check This text is interesting, for example It’s in Matthew Chapter 27 Verse 37, right? that the bible reading here in the Bible

Revised and updated Almeida says so for Matthew over his head they placed the writing and Matthew 2737 ahem, that’s what it says in short, right? of his head in the case of Jesus they put the writing eh, they wrote down their accusation This is Jesus the King of the Jews then Those who

Who defend the cross as being the original instrument that Jesus was was submitted, it already interprets it like this well if it’s over your head obviously your arms are extended laterally, right? At first We have this conclusion, right? That’s that conclusion But let’s check fallen to the ground, stretched to low

Yes, for example, you can see King of Jews right over your head I’m putting the Bible in Greek for us make comparisons Devid Uhum, the question I ask is what is the central part of the body human being, which is the most important head is not Hmm let’s give an example

Suppose a child decides planting a banana tree um we usually talk that the child stood with her feet up or head to wait a minute if we say that a child planted a banana tree we generally we say she stood on her head down upside down by the head

The head is the most main part Central we can use our legs up you can use this expression but the first thing you will see in our mind is the expression upside down not with your feet up so even if Jesus, as we are analyzing that the evidence shows within a context

History then in context Jewish that he was subjected with arms so then up Uhum And the inscription will be above your head because the hands to head was more important than that the hands I understand now that then it is the question is a question interpretative qu see another question that

Also interpretative that many of the who talk about how the defense of Cruz uses it is John Chapter 20 Verse 25 you can get us so far on the screen, right? Look at the people giving Congratulations on 10,000 subscribers thank you guys yes leave it

I’ll put it on the screen here from now on There’s little more than one super chat here our dear Scania, right? sent one more here, you five, oh no 11 Don’t let me fish the portion here what do you want what would it be say say for me

Dear is John Chapter 20 Verse 25 John Chapter 20 Verse 25 Verse 25 so the issue with the plate is fixed above the head of Jesus that’s not it There is no proof that his hand was open is simply above the head of Jesus which is the central part of the

Body is the most important part of the body and this text is also widely used for those who defend the cross, right? In short, he talks like that, they told him then the other disciples saw the Lord But he replied yes so listen to your

Hands Tomé Né was doubting the da da da situation eh we saw your hands and the sign of Carnations or nails plural, right there there they didn’t put their finger and they didn’t put their hand by your side in no way I I will believe Then we take this ticket and

Come on, they’re talking about nails here more than one, that is, this is proof that Jesus then also died in his arms open But this It is imperative, right now to give a some wood on the fire to give a little fuel on the fire dear sneakers let me use the images themselves

For me to also understand here you mentioned the following is that this here is a cross and This here is from the 15th century before Christ here you have an idol it’s cruciform isn’t it that helps me read That’s a bit of a cruciform, right? cruciform from 3800 to 25,500 before CR

This is in the Cyprus museum, I mean eh Oh, the Greeks there I ask you, wouldn’t it benefit vision of Christians in trying to defend that the cross is a vertical art and another horizontally based on these propositions that already exist there since before Christ hundreds of Years Before Christ

Yes, if you take it roughly, yes, but with based on that in no evidence in these historical propositions yes yes there what What happens with all these images, right? Gods within each context each epoch each culture we notice then that it is a Pagan symbol literally Crosses was

Gods for the nations before including the Romos also as a symbol of worship green symbol of worship now when was added Christ to cruz qualis are the archaeological and historical stories to show that Jesus fact died on a cross none will be simply speculation and a tradition

Which has been imposed for centuries by the church simple catholic that’s how I understood it but like that but I understand I like to put counterpoint, for example on the 12th now raar meso oo pastor Elias Soares You’ll be here with me, right in the arena? poetic and I will put counterpoints

For him and I want to put these counterpoints for example to put line at the stake you said the cross for me Elton and for you I am Impartial people here in the arena but this here I will say to myself it doesn’t difference if you be the cross was a

X an x ​​was the cross was a pencil a pencil it was the cross It was a transverse art with other horizontal PR to me there is no difference What matters are other values ​​that are Then the cross is just an instrument for me of torture point Now of course I’m

Picking up my guest to put firewood at the stake and leave the business here anymore thing like we say so what what happens Here we have the images I will return the images that are of 3 Years Before Christ which is a model Possibly of a cross and that

Cruz’s proposal she was a vertical with a horizontal here from the 15th century before Christ means 1500 before crist also a vertical with a horizontal, is that what serves as a fuel to to feed to promote the idea that Jesus may have died on a cross like that with open arms and

Having these and I’m going to call them traces of these historical remains and There is still a mother goddess here too a type of Cross that found by eh which is in the National Archaeological Museum from cagliari Italy it’s in Italy, right? 2500 before Christ the proposal of the

Instrument here also considered as a goddess It’s a cross art form, it’s horizontal with vertical art So now you have what eh, present cross models that be opposite so we can say ah then is in agreement with the entire context that the we are analyzing here we believe that

Jesus Christ He died on a stake letter called Cruz Simplex, right? here in a in a cross a straight cross in the mold Jews, yes, we see here that the Cross in transversal form it has its origin very old everything related to religion pagan including Romans the first time

Where the expression Cruz appears within a context Christian, let’s find it in epistle of Barnabas is a rejected letter including by the church as not being inspired by that author who is not the Barnabas, isn’t that the apostle Barnabas? a a person who added his name to him

Makes an allusion to what Moses raised the arms of a victory in Israel, right? Every time Moses he lifted up Israel won every time he lowered Israel I started to lose the author of this letter he got this context from the scriptures Hebrews and made an allusion to

Jesus with open arms there what happened to the church fathers as Tertullian Justin, among others Remembering that they were responsible for many pagan and philosophical doctrines enter Christianity, right? took the image of a God victorious the victory trophy, right Hum and Said well, we’re not going to use it

This model because it is a Pagan God, no Let’s use this as our God but we are going to place the figure of Jesus no place in this Victory trophy because Jesus is our Victory trophy is the sun of Christians replacing the sun Roman then we see that these customs

Were logically added that this process did not last from one day to the next another was a process that lasted centuries and centuries, right, introduced it there, for example pagan festivities like Christmas exchanging look how interesting changing the birth of the sun god who was something always present in ancient cultures and

Putting Birth of Jesus uhum Have you ever seen that structure I I just won’t remember her name see you at mass and usually the priests take him, he is Golden yes he has a sun he has a cross I won’t remember this one’s name structure that is widely used in

Masses there is the sun Jesus for the Christians who were adapted to God sun of Rome now the question is like this, right? say Jesus, regardless of the way died logical That’s it that’s a fact conclusive for any Christian regardless of your domination this is this this is is unanimous among all

Us, right? But I personally think important Because until then Many perhaps criticize those who have a contrary view The vast majority who have regarding this subject then it is It is important to clarify that perhaps those which is a minority that believes in certain thing has to be analyzed

That they have basis that they are believing that they have foundation T document has archaeological have the scriptures as a basis for us expand our horizons further See, I don’t agree with such a thing particular person or group but has a That’s why they bring attention

So I need to respect it a little but this is our idea here proposed conversation, right, wonderful, dear Denis is wonderful, so now going back there Can I go back to the analysis of John 202? we can or or if you want I can release the link for people to enter

Here and ask questions to you like We said it right And then they will have 2 minutes to ask and you will have time at ease infinite time for reply so it’s here after I finish reading this here this here It’s not a question, right? Scania’s question, it’s

Just one comment he will make one observation of a biblical text that speaks so if it’s a stake on a stake the plate it was above the hands if it is the cross traditional over the head Mateus 27:37 informs that the plate was on top

Of the head, that is, it was the Roman cross traditional this is Scania’s opinion Thank you dear Scania for the 11 I’m going to release the link so people can enter and in the meantime you can stay at willingness to exhibit the text Then another text that we are

Analyzing, beyond that on the board which is widely used, right from Matthew and John Chapter 20 Verse 25 says the respect for the nails, right for the nails then understand is nails So it has to be automatically with open arms but it is something also speculative e.g. how many nails were used to

Fix a person in a structure wood, right, more than one, one of the TR could be several Remembering that generally nail was not used here because here has a more fragile cartilage was used here, right in this part where there was more support could be used more than one

Building another way of I don’t know if you or be able to focus for me just one representation where it can be used more than one nail that was a also a common way of posting on a straight stake let me put here the arms up but stuck in a way lateral

Uhum bowl understanding, look how interesting it is question I want to raise here Ok eh, the nails are proof that Jesus died in a way cruciform Ok how many nails too were used to nail the feet of Jesus because the feet also had to be taken neither

Yes because for example there in Lucas when talking to your disciples after the resurrection Luke Chapter 24 39 there he says, observe the my hands and my feet for a long time I don’t know if you’ll make it Also focus here I should have even printed in color or should have

Sent as a slide for you who stay easier Hey look here we have two representations what We see, you see, it’s the feet, right? time for a long time this several works they are film alum film is representative is Arts that we found it there at different times, right?

Many Arts were used two pre us feet but not necessarily the legs so they think it’s open because we see nails side by side the same could Happen with hands preach up more side by side and we have the representation of the nail only Oops boy, those feet are really big

Realistic Boy, this is more similar with something real no it’s not no but it’s done of wood should have reached at least colorful wood but the guy who made it That was either he was inspired or he was possessed one of the two humanly impossible this one we can see us

Can you see these on the internet? this representation and see what interesting that a work says about from nails, right from International standard bible encyclopedia of 79 Volume 1 page 826 comments like this, exactly number of nails used has been the subject of considerable speculation in the most ancient depictions of crucifixion

Jesus’ feet look nailed separately but in subsequent they are AC crossed and posted on the Wood on a single nail is what we see here right This representation uhum side feet and feet over over the foot It’s, right, on just one nail, that is, using this nail argument to say that Jesus

Died a form with open arms is also simply interpretative that which most pleases, right within the traditional Faith that the person has, they will use it as as a basis, right? Here is a question from Hamilton Freire but me Hilton Freire hug for you but I don’t think he

Will answer because I don’t think there is a lot to do with theme is Elton asks the teacher there if the original name of Jesus preached on the cross was yucha or another name in João 1919 a 22 well so as not to waste the time of

Teacher I’m going to say no it wasn’t yucha respectfully to the followers of Don’t think, please, okay, name, think? was not eh in all the manuscripts I know is iOS and others in other languages ​​accordingly with what is written there ready Professor You can feel free to talk there that you

You want beyond this issue of the Cross, right? And that whole situation that Jesus would pass To Die as a sacrifice for humanity he fulfilled several prophecies within a process until finally arrive at the situation he died for all of us right, the Bible said that the Bible says that

He dies he would be betrayed for 30 coins of silver that not even a single bone of yours would be broken, right? And so many things that are broken fulfilled in Jesus only in the way that Jesus died also fulfilled a prophecy and unfortunately many do not pay attention to

This reminds me of the snake that Moses pretended to be a snake yes in the desert so that every time that the people in the desert every time the people was bitten by snakes as punishment through their areas they looked at that serpent and they were healed

That there prefigures what Jesus would do In the future we call this type and antitype right yes type and antitype a Bible says that all things previous ones served as a shadow of things that came the sacrifice of animals represented the sacrifice made by Jesus and so on related to that

See that the very Jesus briefly here I will read Jerusalem Bible is not for us say that I’m reading it here in translation of the new world here, which is actually a translation quite criticized so no I won’t be no V when you look there I’m here laughing this is very creative

The name they created there, oh my Denis teacher Elton what is this man for the love of God boy here invent see who this will be citizen or guru, that was good, see, I’m not a guru no but it continues there, in John 3, 14 and 15, there Jesus

Talking about how Moses lifted the Serpent in the Desert so it is necessary that May the Son of Man be lifted up to May everyone who believes have life in Him eternal well I don’t remember a single time I have some snake with legs and arm When Moses placed that

Structure he placed in a structure that to which the snake could become attached There’s a straight structure, a straight post right, look if we went to Galatians Galatians to think here Galatians Chapter 3 Paul he further reinforces this idea Galatian Chapter 3 of 13 of 10 to

13 but then there are those who are by works of the law, they are under the curse because it is written damn everyone who does not adhere to all prescriptions that are in the book of law to be practiced, right? then in 11 he says that by law no one

Is justified before God, right now the law It is not by faith but whoever practices these things no No they will live there speak in Christ rescued us from the curse of the law because before the law we were all sinners, the PEC, the sacrifices of animals did not cover sins, only

Of Christ Christ rescued us from curse of the Law becoming a curse by us because it is damn written all over the one I think about Madeiro doesn’t we find the word Cruz here but Madeiro If I’m not mistaken here, the word xylon in this passage, right?

Teacher can even help me with this meaning and Paul being a Jew He identified the instrument of torture that Jesus was literally subjected to a straight pole because the Jews did not use structures cruciform and the prophecies they have to be fulfilled in detail and Jesus he complied in detail until

In this matter in his way that he a straight shape died, right representing So that copper snake uhum well eh We arrived here in the presence of our dear Marcos Lola Good evening Marcos Lola, you are very welcome, okay? kisses to you friend Marcos Lola

Very good people and you wanted to make one ask Denis Silva, this is the moment we will release the link for you to come in, you can come in, okay? remembering that you will not be able to There’s a lot of time to talk, it’s 2 minutes

Just to ask the question why the Live’s protagonist is Denis So you have 2 minutes Marco lolas Marcos Lola to ask the question first satisfaction and it’s there reviewing here it was missing you can do the question Ok thanks for your attention no no I I I lost until I got it

Come in I missed the congratulations part Denis for the excellent work research Are you really a young man very cool scholar What do you have done and for us it is a source of pride, right? Exhibitions that Elon offers in this space For us this is very important

I missed a bit of the question I was going to I was just here and sending it to he will show you just the part of the serpent that Moses lifted up in a post in a has a post was not in a cross and as you just said there

The prophecies They have to be fulfilled in the your smallest details are what you said So how would the prophecies turn out? fulfilling down to the smallest details If Jesus said that just as Moses raised the Serpent in the Desert the son of man went be erected so then we go back there

For numbers 20 218 which shows that Moses reed the serpent is an aste is a postre then So if the criminals there If he was executed on a cross he would have no problem with it running in a cross only that Jesus could not in under no circumstances be executed in a

Cross because he himself said so how Moses lifted the serpent from the desert it was going to be lifted it couldn’t be different So how would the writing in its smallest details I’m just saying this here for just to give some reinforcement there but I missed it

This part that Denes had said there about Moses I neither I nor I realized I hadn’t even heard, otherwise maybe not I hadn’t even entered Congratulations there Denis one hug my brother may Jehovah bless you and Then you too, we are there in the fight, man

Brother OB we are together dear Thank you Thank you brother, a pleasure to talk to you and get to know you See he’s still going to come here to the arena still to have a program just for ok he owes me so he owes me I have already sent three proposals

At him there and he’s dodging I’m going charge you man, I’ll charge you passing by going through this phase, right? programming and But you will see with Surely the house is yours let me see what that Marcela tafona has to ask Denis Silva but she says what are you

Understood, of all this proposition of the Denis Silva What would you ask for he Good night, you can hear me very well At night I can hear well if the audio is good Good evening, sorry, where am I? improvised here because I arrived from work is quiet now so I didn’t see

The whole Live but I know more or less what that Denis brought my proposal question for him is more of a question theological than historical Only one moment for please then my question is following since all this information what you said about the origin of Cross of her connection with

False gods and why do you like would you explain to the people o Why Jesus couldn’t die on a cross and let me rephrase the question since that this whole story of the cross is linked to false gods and it would be logical and consistent that the one who would save the

Humanity was executed exactly on a symbol that represents everything that the creator repudiates This is a question interesting theological question can reply please OB thank you tafana one hug, see my brother so come on this question is interesting, right? first we noticed here that Jesus needed to fulfill

Prophecies and we brought attention here from snake there in the desert the Serpent in Desert within this theological context Would the almighty God allow see only would allow Jesus to die of fact this really happened allowed his son to die in such a way voluntary he did it for us are

Thank you for your mercy, right? of both God and Jesus now he would allow a symbol here Pagan full of spiritualism, right? mysticism was part of the prophecy that it was fulfilled that Jesus fulfilled, right? way so pure and essential for us Christians is an unconsidered point and

Remembering reminds Elton that his parents church brought attention that the instrument of punishment other than Torture itself came with one more object than impalement was part of the question Priapus God who was a God rapist Would Jesus be him? subjected to this type of torture because this was included we need to understand

This was included in the torture carried out by the Romans made by the Romans that’s why biblically historically Jesus He died in the Jewish way of punishment is that we can even crush there in the in the Gospel of John Chapter 18 In Faced with O 19, many claim that

Jesus died for the Romans because crime of sedition but is not repeated Pilate tried to free Jesus because he didn’t see anything wrong he even said If it’s you he’s disturbing go there and do it yourself why not I see nothing wrong with this man according to your law where you are

Condemning this man I don’t know why This is already an indication that it wasn’t in the n Roman questions but in the questions Jewish communities that the matter was being treaty only because the Jews are about the rule of Rome some matters It would have to be taken to get an approval, right?

So to speak of the Roman Empire at that time so it’s important analyze these issues and this point was important to Fonda get up Ok let me see here, where are people? evangelicals to go live to question Denis Silva’s arguments right, so evangelicals can enter the

Link is there let me send it again because it suddenly went up I didn’t notice why I intend to pin my pix, right? relevant then people and I don’t particularly care much about this is not if the cross it was like this Or if the cross was simha to

I don’t care much, I don’t care much. The Cross was just for me an instrument of torture point if it was a proposal from X now what I presented to oo den still standing what he brought here as a reference for Cruz’s model, right? Cruz porn as he talks about 3,800 before

In. crist until 2500 before crist is here This was a form of cross from 1500 before de crist you have a shaped cross of horizontal and vertical here also the mother goddess from 2500 before Christ Eh okay at the National Archaeological Museum has the microphone let me turn it off here

He’s from Italy in Cagliari also has a Cruz model right, Cruz means that idea of horizontal e vertical and so that’s it I want to invite you eh evangelical brother to enter here live to suddenly question you is a student on these issues too and has something to address about the arguments

Against the arguments suddenly you don’t agree and you want to argue against Denis so can you that was it for me called Hi it’s Marc Marcos hi Marcos yes OK, I’m listening right here So if it doesn’t make any difference to you, right? that Jesus died on a cross in a

Wood or any other instrument For you it’s okay now what is important for us Jehovah’s witnesses V that we get very attached and We believe a lot in the details prophetic, this gives us confidence in Jehovah that everything that is written in the the way it’s written it happens like that

In the same way So if Moses lifted up the serpent on a pole Jesus said he was also going to be erected the way Moses lifted the Serpent on the pole then for us to witness Jehovah this is very important because people observe Essence of Bible prophecies complying with the smallest details

Just like the prophecies that happened there in Babylon at its lowest details This is very important for us is very important now of course the as you said yourself, right? important that Jesus really sacrificed his life as a ransom in exchange for lots of beauty, right, but for We observe these details

Because this increasingly generates us trust in the word of God in the Bible Sacred, right? That’s what’s important for us observing these details is a lot very important Ahem now yes to Marcos Lola listening to what you’re saying there no Marcos Lola, calm, super good what you said there I have nothing against

Not that and now Adriano Cruz brought something here reflective people but not It stops being comical It’s comical but reflective, Adriano Cruz is bone, what he said here people I want to say that This is everything here, I don’t have it no intention of belittling anything but the sign of the

Cross made by Catholics and there will be just two ends n father and son and the Spirit and the Spirit again stood by out there but you don’t know how to put one in the same in the place of a father or in the place of the child

Adriano doesn’t work, that’s not how it works Okay, what would your father’s name be? neither Patos and then the son replaced the father again I don’t know if the cross is like this right, if the cross is like this, then it’s possible divide Trial, right, Adrian, and then matela, okay?

Saying what you think you can laugh Marcela is talking Speak Adriano Cruz and no, I can’t read it, I read it here something but the font is small for me and my light here is very lower the signal Ah is out ah the signal the signal of the cross was made by Catholics

Have only two ends, right if the cross is so and then to make the sign of the cross so it will get complicated Catholics making the sign of the cross here na ter talking about the sign of the cross Elton Um, speaking of the sign of the cross, that’s what we

We saw it at the beginning of our conversation, right? Yes rituals were grafted the Romans they did the sign of the cross to protect spirits and Demons, right when carrying out insur because literally made the sign of the God who It would be for protection for them, right?

This was grafted now ahem grafted the Trinity in this matter, right? seeing that one thing leads to another yes yes yes your observation is perfect Hi hey there is details that are very important I’m going to ask you a question over your statement that it doesn’t make a difference

Whether it was a pole or whether it was a wood is For me, I don’t understand that the cross is just an instrument of torture So see well That’s the place where Jesus died symbol of blessing or was a symbol of curse symbol eh eh so one

Very good question symbol of blessing to from a religious perspective curse symbol also from one spirituality now within a sense anthropological what would we have there sociological what we would have Ali was it was a kind of environment where tortured where killed where penalized, right? More or less this idea

Now assigning curses or blessings is This is more of a religious bias, So let’s see what the Bible says about this we go eh Galatians Chapter 3 called place of the skull Néa including but within this outfit Which it is the text that is a place of curse

No, that’s not it, it’s a good topic for we reflect Do you remember Denis I am here with little possibility of reading there in Galatians where Paul says that cursed everyone who is hanged on the tree This is Galatians 3. Not that text, I I approached I approached just now here it is

Galatians Chapter Chapter 3 Verse 10 to 13 that then says that damn everything whoever is hung on a tree so the place of execution was a symbol of Damn, the question is whether the cross was the place where Jesus died why did the people want to put Cruz inside the

Their worship meeting places a symbol that is a curse Why is it curse because the curse he represented was the punishment of death to punishment of death is the greatest curse that man can receive because of Adam’s disobedience then say that It doesn’t matter if it’s Cruz or

It’s not not stopping to reason that that where Jesus died is a symbol of curse so if you believe it is a cross should not have a symbol of curse this becomes a image and most importantly besides everything Denis said, I don’t know if he Have you reached this point?

Reading something from appendix 5C of the new world translation with references that part where there is that image there from a book where it shows ooo instrument to which Jesus should have been executed, which is this image here I don’t know if I can show it, let me to throw here

It’s an ellipse, Marcela is still waiting Still hold on I want to see this image Wait, where does he let me put him here? in priority, wait, I want to see if there is How do you center the image of the Cross there? ready So CR, let’s see, that’s it, that’s it

You have there Denis, you approached this point because there are These are books by people who wrote about this type of execution to which Jesus was subjected according to the studies that have been done and none of them was Jehovah’s witness so that the people know that these are facts of

Historians who wrote about of this matter Jesus died where the wood was a cross with two beams or it was a post vertical if you haven’t read it you can bring and this point there Denis So Denis and you will answer the question of Marcela tafona and also mine, I’m going

Talking like that is what Marcela Tafona said asking me about the issue of curse and I say that the curse is from a religious perspective because the cemetery is a damned place place where the dead return Depends on jail where prisoners are held or there in United States Where the penalty is committed

Of death are cursed places It depends on from the perspective understood Depends on the lenses and looking through the mere anthropology eh eh they are just places But of course I’m not, I’m not here walking on the side of skepticism spiritual I don’t have mine assignments Macela tafona very well

Said when about the attribution of the Cursed be he who was taken to the Madeiro considering that the cross was a It has always been an object of torture, right? It was always in this sense that she also It was an object of adoration, right? Well introduced Denis but then she

Became an object exclusively of torture specifically in the context there of J the Romans and everything else then it was Cursed would be the person who was taken to the Madeiro In this sense, because it was considered as a criminal, right because he had perhaps prevaricate at some point in the Law

And then dignity was death, right? he became worthy of death And then I I want to assign this question to you because my answer is already there explicit or implicit in the my way of asking Denis you understands that the cross is not the cross but the

Right place the question Marcel is talking about went to well the cross was the place the place in If it was cursed and if it was cursed which one What would be your biblical Valence for support the place and not the cross as damn right there was a place of death

It was execution so uhum literally no It’s a nice place, it’s a place of Curse Suffering So we have two contexts OF the place was literally a place of sacrifices where it would be a Cruel torture we can’t even imagine we also have the spiritual context

According to the ATF he brought attention so we put the two things together now the fact You paid attention, oh, but what’s wrong with it? see these old Crosses now, right? I don’t care if it’s num Cruz for x for num Y ne The question is since Saint Cruz in specific the cross

Represented an object of false worship Pagan and we embrace this object whether you want it or not conscious or not unconscious independent of our vision literally we are bringing an idol into the our worship or into our houses, right? Maybe this is more for Those who are Catholic don’t use this symbol of

More visible way, right the evangelicals they no longer use it that way eh, evangelicals do use some evangelicals some evangelicals use less frequently than they have some even have crosses on the altar understand already I saw you allow me Elon and Denis to do the reading this appendix here

End of it, which is where this appears image I allow if you allow Well, I’m going to ask you to excuse me, will you? turn off my camera because I’m going to use it the cell phone flashlight so I can have better illumination here in the Bible is

I will turn off my camera just for This reason is out, I can only do it before of you present while you take the your cell phone I saw a question I don’t know if Welton saw it as very interesting there from one of the chats that Paulo speaks he said

Of the Cross Cross was Jesus was crucified Wouldn’t that be a sign that Jesus died? on the cross I would like to answer this question that I found interesting fica to will n from the person who sent this question there can you send it again fish to prepare apart from one

Reasoning there is a person who sent it image on my WhatsApp you can talk at I will again his Ach didn’t see the general context, right, but he I asked him what he said like that Paulo had said that Christ was crucified in such a way This is not an indication that Jesus

Really died in a cruciform object So to answer his question, no because I say no to the word Cruz that we find in the vast majority of Today’s translations are literally a mistake of translation There is no word Cruz in Bible according to Professor Elto said that the nuts represent something

Crossed we won’t find this in no verse of the Bible including New Testament in Greek scriptures simply stauros or xilon or panto nothing to do with Cross the Bible Jerusalem she she translated in a way correct as Madeiro more or less around six to 10 times at some point

Some passages from his translation and translated correctly e.g. we don’t even read Galatians 3 here, right? translated as Madeiro and that really That’s right, other passages she has already used the expression Cross but the cross it is a mistranslation of original Greek words the cross in

Latin X is the equivalent of stauros she has nothing to do with the cross that we understand today when we read the word Cruz then responding to ask him, I thought it was a lot interesting is simply a mistake translation of most translations and that leads to a doctrinal error that Jesus

Died in a Cruz people, just one word here for you people will send me images They sent an image on WhatsApp I don’t follow fish images due Due to the aleg here but I’ll try Understand, send me a link to the images I can even try fishing, yes, Marcela, okay?

You can feel free while you talk I will present the images here there is still a technical detail about it of cross cross of two beams that I speak what is the weight of body if it really were is executed in the same way as people think

Eh he would be the weight of your body would tear your hands there is evidence that people who died on the Cross they were tied and not preached, eh, there is a program, eh and Universal is not the Universal Church, okay? eh, I think it’s interesting facts that

There was an article about this that was impossible for him to be executed preached with open arms because the weight of your body would tear your hands This is just a detail but let me read it so here what I what I I requested I will turn off my camera and

I’m going to turn on the cell phone flashlight here so it’s page 1518 of the New World Translation with reference also called rbi eh about appendix 5C this appendix 5C brings torture stake in Greek stauros from Latin crux So this new world translation it has several appendages that are

Small studies then on this page 1518 where does that image appear that I I showed it says like this, the book says it here in German but I will read that it has the translation of the book The Cross and the Crucifixion by Herman Fulda Breslau

1878 page 109 says there was not always trees available in places chosen for execution public so that a simple beam was stuck in the ground, the renegades were tied or nailed to it by the hands raised and often also by the feet after presenting a lot of solid evidence

Concluded on pages 219 and 220 opens quotes Jesus died on a simple stake of death in support of this speak to or use so customary of this means of execution in the East b indirectly itself story of the Sufferings of Jesus many expressions of the primitive priests

From the church close quotes another quote says Paul William Smith that it was professor at the university of Basel in his work The Story of Jesus Volume 2 tubingen eig Alemanha 104 pages 386 394 made a detailed study of the word grega stauros on page 386 of his work he says open quotes

Isauro refers to every pole or trunk of vertical hereto tree regarding the execution of the punishment imposed on Jesus Paul Smith wrote on page 387 to 389 beyond the lashes According to reports evangelicals only take into account the simplest form of crucifixion Roman for the punishment imposed on Jesus

Suspension of the naked body on a stake what purpose did Jesus have to carry or drag to the place of execution to intensify the ignominious punishment all more than a simple suspension is refuted by the large scale on which the execution was often carried out du 1 at once

Eh varo Jewish antiquities volume eh 17 10.10 per square in wars Jewish eh second volume page 12 Verse 6 by attorney Felix in wars judaicas eh Volume 2 page 15 paragraph 2 by Titus in Jewish Wars volume 7 it’s paragraph 11 so all these here show that they existed until 2000

Executions at once, therefore there is a lack completely any evidence that Jesus Christ was crucified in two pieces of wood placed in right angle we don’t want to add Nothing is the written word of God insertion into the inspired scriptures of the Pagan concept of the Cross but we see esturo

According to the simplest meaning since Jesus used the stauros to represent suffering and shame or torture of his followers Matthew 1624 we translate estur as stake torture for differentiated xylon that we translate it as Madeiro or in the note of footer per tree according to acts

530 why did I want to bring attention this from here It is because many people talk like that Jehovah’s Witnesses change the Bible to adapt your beliefs because they they want to change because they want to do it seems like what they say is the truth

So just this little bit because I saw that Denis spoke about the deine dictionary, which is mentioned at the beginning, this is proof that the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ claim to don’t bring the word Cross it has substantial huh it’s historicity that was shown here by writers who were not testimonial

Jehovah even lived before the Russian born so Eh people can disagree But they should be careful how they say disagreeing is one thing and She has to have arguments now attacks that will come many of this type just that people are desperate because of a religiosity is what I had for

Say Wonderful people I want to say that we are getting close to the end but I want to hear Brazil here preterist Brazil preterist What’s up preterist brazilian what are you Send it boy, what question do you have? I would like to do it here for Denis Silva and

After Denis Silva’s question he will respond obviously after that we we will close Live I’m going to say goodbye because I arrived from work look now I’m dusty and my mother is already calling me there, okay Thank you for being able to come in Wonderful hug dear kiss for one

Hug from you to yours ask Good night everyone peace and grace Good evening to everyone too, Professor Welton Denis the question is if he has already heard about the archaeological find of first century eh do benan yohanan ben ragol ach um a a person who was crucified on the

First century Which coroners right after archaeologists including this finding very famous Brazilian archaeologist here he says this in one of his works in his book I won’t mention the name here but Everyone knows what I’m talking about then he says he propagates that even El There’s an image there, this image that El

Put it is from the heel of yanan do do first century and this image that was appearing with his hands tied was was would be the form of crucifixion of the first century that the Romans would use that even a challenge on the question of whether Jesus was given one

One having been given to Jesus the consent to take your body he has a dignified burial eh yanan is historical proof that this was possible aa yon ranan was given this this this burial where was it found in the ossuary, right this one first century find there and the position

Of Carnations in the Heel showing that they were weights sideways if Denis Do you know what to say about this? hey, if he comments anything about it then just That’s wonderful, dear preterist Brazil Hey, you can feel free, but this is how you can talk and together enjoy taur

João Pedro toural Speaks Does not apply only to a beam of and yes to Mars of two beams means he says that has support to say that the cross is so And also to say that the cross is only one vertical line can talk dear Denis Silva, thanks for the question

This is really the question, if not I’m wrong is the only one If I’m wrong please correct me, you’re the only one skeleton, right, pairs of a skeleton that found of a person who was subjected to a situation of torture of crucifixion at that time, right? we can quote is the following archaeologically

Historically, as we have already commented in the past we will ask the question here of the Romans there was no single form of fixing a person in a structure of wooden crosses were used that literally were Gods for the Romans used Straight stakes the Romans used a lot

Straight stake also used X stake people upside down i.e. go depend a lot on what the shape of this found that found in what way this this person she was arrested in this in this wooden structure So there will be a lot of speculation regarding this but it helps us understand a

A little more ways than the person was trapped inside on top of this wooden structure whether in tê form of de and form of X né e so on, including a stake straight line was also used a lot in that world of Wonderful era we have now we have oo

Henrique, yes, oops, can you just talk? quickly He said the question to Gods, right? The question of a religious nature Death on the Cross wasn’t valid and Jesus was there it was not within a political context and religious and for this reason it also to have been crucified as pointed out as

Blasphemy because he claims to be the son of God could not equal God to have been crucified exactly on the cross by That and So Dani Silva so I think let’s see if I I understand the question, right? That’s the question whether he was killed in Roman form or Jewish is

That’s the question, was there a Roman crucifixion that could be already on the cross and existed as yourself affirmed the crucifixions in the shape of Cruz when they denoted a sense of religious nature Jesus yours yours yours judgment by the Jews He was like blasphemy, right, like putting yourself like

Son of God emip position of God then That’s why he couldn’t have been taken also made of wood in the shape of a cross on account This is according to Jewish tradition if Let’s take the context from John Chapter 18 is that I didn’t have time to address

Here, right in the context of John Chapter then you can read there in a way Very succinct, right? Very specific, João Chapter 18 and Chapter 19 There you go bring that whole sequence of trial of Jesus and everything else there Pilate although Many try to say that Jesus he

Was punished for the crime of sedition, right? against Rome but that one wasn’t It was the crime that Jesus was committing It was the crime that he made himself God of according to the Jews, right, and in fact the beginning to end Pilate he tries to free

Jesus several times I think saying that he didn’t see anything with him and everything else in the course of the give relative wings eh Pilate he delivers Jesus to the Jews from then on that sequence of events would be carried out along Jewish lines, he respected

For example That wine that was given to Jesus for example wine Believe that every The world knows that there was a custom Jewish was not a Roman custom aa It’s a question of not leaving Jesus hanging, right? that the next day would be a great Saturday

It was a custom, a Jewish custom when Jesus was handed over again the body of Jesus was handed over, right? Joseph is a semi-Jewish custom, ne dos dos dos dos burial processes, right? the beginning shows that Jesus was of the feat your punishment has been carried out in the manner

Jews according to the law of the Jews there many ask like this but the Romans led, right? We have the prophecy that Jesus’ clothes were distributed and That’s really it, but what We need to understand the Jews were About the rule of Rome OK, let’s give an example when

Alg an event when alg an event an football game or a Show the state He offers a military force generally to military police are there The police military she is not part of the event She there it is there to provide support for there is less crime control and

So on the same way was what This Roman conduct happened to Jesus was necessary because Jesus during the your ministry he he dragged Crowds So which That could be the fear of both the Romans like the Jews, it’s a mess, right? people try to have a protest there

And try to get Jesus somehow so as not to deal with that situation then there was in fact this participation of the Roman soldiers but in order to make the process finally follow your situation to even fulfill biblical prophecies, right? I’m bringing it in a good way

Denis succinctly but it wasn’t a custom Roman crucifixion and authority Romana Major wasn’t washing hands literally there in the sense of that you were absolving Jesus but the execution was Roman ex you I said so there wasn’t one fear so let me just conclude no

There was a fear on the part of Rome of Jesus make this sedition to what I see I see the Roman execution crucifixion what do I see the Jews accusing was putting Jesus in a condition of Divine God And then the crucifixion fits very good there because you said it yourself

That the crucifixion was for these molds eh, Divine, a religious nature, what was written on the cross it gives what was the crime that Jesus was being penalized it was written Jesus Nazareno King of the Jews this is a crime of sedition you declare yourself King within Rome but Jesus he wasn’t condemned

For infringing But this is just proof that the execution was Roman and not of the former Jews exactly only proves that the execution it was probably Romana because he was being convicted of a Roman crime is the which is written in the na against my will, right?

Because I had to take it to the end execution he would be acquitted but fear of sedition was If he weren’t crucified so danis how come you get out of this argument that you are bringing attention and I would like to talk a little bit about this this question then I could

Talk can talk sea Lola So how the friend, a friend asked it’s the Romana Cruz execution, etc., okay? but you have to take into account how was the one who said the prophecies how it was that Jesus said what happened to he actually like I said there previously the other criminals

It could have even been the others it could have been until it was, but only in relation to Jesus existed telling details about what happens with him, it was even raised question about how Moses raised the Serpent in the Desert Jesus Himself spoke Jesus himself said that so

How Moses Lifted the Serpent in the Desert it was going to be raised and Moses did not lift the snake on a cross and other detail important there prophecies were recorded in the Bible that no bone Jesus would be broken and everything would be fulfilled in the smallest details they broke the

Legs of the criminal who was standing by left they broke the legs of the do do criminal who was on your right but When they arrived at Jesus Jesus was already dead then the prophecies in the smallest details That’s the point That’s the point High point of the issue prophecy is fulfilled

In the smallest details, ok, I fell like us Live is ending, I wanted to hear the your question to Denis since we we’re talking about the cross cross she was a stake or the cross she This is how we ended Live na After your question Ask the question

So, in my opinion, the cross is the T-shaped, with bridge pointing up because that was the way the Romans do Oh and in the biblical text we have the Romans the Jews talking eh we don’t we have no King but Caesar there in John 19:15 then in Verse 19 he puts it in

Plaque Jesus Nazareth in the King of the Jews and This makes it very clear to me that the punishment is sedition now as the cross and her being a Pagan symbol and the Romans they had this one and they liked it Cruz or used A Cruz in everyday life for

Example as a symbol of worship I I just wanted to ask Denis’ opinion What does he think of Cicero’s opinion that was one of the csos of Rome in which he wrote this here like this, leave me alone reading here quickly is in the work for the rabí Leones loses Cícero, he talks

Like that, but the executioner sees it from the head and the own word Cross must be far away not just the person of a citizen Roman but from his thoughts eyes and ears because it is not just the occurrence reality of these things or their persistence but the responsibility for them

Expectation or rather their mere belief that is unworthy of a Roman citizen and a free man OK there based on this understanding from one of the coolest guys important of the Latin language ali né um of the greatest daum orators of the Empire of of the Roman Republic

Eh, how would it make sense for the Romans to use Cross to worship or use in religion Yes, Denis, you can feel free. to respond and after the response of the Dennis we we will close Du more than two hours of Live be The only question is, I’m not, I’m not

I know this work he was what in this in this Empire You have a his reference what he was Cicero the Cicero he was he was consul of the Republic is he he is oo so when the person is going to study Latin She study Cicero’s Latin because he was

The greatest orator writer of the time ee the greatest poet is Virgílio there he There’s a Vigilio talking about the trophy also that you mention the trophy in the text but I didn’t want to prolong it but the trophy has nothing to do with Cruz also not according to Vigílio But come on

It’s just like anyone else he gave to vision of him within a paranom of the time of him, of the contemporary world that he lived but if we catch the parents of the church like Tertullian Justin Erineus among others, they present literally the Crosses as gods including even the emperors themselves

When they were killed or an image died of ca was affixed to the cross showing that that God and would take the soul whatever it wants let it be from that one from that one Emperor becoming a God this shows some old works from PIS da church, right? then within a context

General there is no way to escape that the Romans just as other Nations considered symbols like gods including the cross neither Shutting down answering the crime question sedition right quick if you tell me allow uhum if we get the context there of John Chapter 18 Verse 31 speak there

Right, Pilate speaks and replied because Pilate, take yourselves and judge according to your law then they answered answered the Jews we it is not legal to kill anyone why that the Jews wanted to refuse kill jesus pilate again here he I didn’t want to be part of that because

He saw that Jesus was innocent he did not I wanted to be part of spilling a innocent blood but they didn’t want it It was lawful for Jews to kill anyone because whoever was on the dominion was was the about the Romans the Romans were dominating the Jews and It is in fact

That you yourself commented on later in the in John Chapter 19 Verse 6 and 7 speaks So stop with him, right? then take the same ones, take it yourself same Pilate speaking, take him you themselves and execute because I don’t see no reason to accuse the Jews

They answered we don’t have we have a law our law and It is second to the law that he must die that he became the son of God The Jews did those stupid things, right? There with Pilate, right, only God as Caesar, right? showing that they had rejected the Almighty God as King

Legitimate then I say no this is the most important part how come it wasn’t the only thing that sucks was the accusation of sedition as It’s but pulling Pilate’s ass, right? because he who for the Loyal Jews His only King would be the sovereign himself right, not a human king that even

He was a Pagan king But anyway, it’s not oo content then it would not make sense to say that this person should be executed because a law he broke in my country Brazil for example I broke a law of Brazil and be executed in a law American doesn’t make sense

Pilo at the time of the Portuguese colony a Brazilian was convicted by the law Portuguese the best analogy is this in colonial times, the Pax Romana did not would allow makes sense is the Pax Romana don’t let them condemn and Pilate acquits Jesus da da the accusation of blasphemy

Let me let me do the following So we can do it my green numão Yes part two daus guest part of pilate I just fell oo Brazil can speak den just concluding, right Pilate He simply washed your hands as required. Biblical account even speaks and delivered Jesus to the Jews and he gave

To Rome he simply gave permission for Jews to do what they were going to do to From then on, there was then all that process that the Bible account brings pay attention but we see several details from the exit, right from Jesus carrying the planting Until you get there in execution E

During him stuck in that in that wooden structure various aspects Jewish events being carried out and not Romans But anyway, that’s the general view Ok guys, what happens, show those who are here on live can keep it live so we can finish everyone together Elton shows the table

Of the Hebrew pictogram and see the representation of al eot this already reveals a covenant Jesus left and the shape of the Cruz Leandro Barroso hugs and kisses for you dear always contributing there with the Arena apologética beauty channel people contribute to my work a PX here next to our dear

Marcos Lola, are you directing your WhatsApp your device there and send a PX So, bless my work, my beauty It’s not tithe, I’m not asking for tithe, it’s not just a contribution even if everyone OK, so what happens to me? I’m not from the Hebrew area I’m from the area

From Greek So what do I could you add here regarding the Greek I of Nations yet realize that that we have very intelligent people Marcos Lola has a lot of knowledge and is a Thinker Marcos Lola we send very interesting video for me preterist Brazil is also intelligent

Who is enrolling in my course Greek has now become my student, right? very welcome Give you a big hug and my countryman and also Denis me I wanted to hear your thoughts from you finals for after your final considerations we close and I wanted to order Cai o Brasil prista

Marcos Lola wouldn’t end up like this so we can shut everyone down together I want to thank the opportunity Hmm or we can arrange yes of course I want thank you for the first opportunity first time here this year we stay a little bit nervous, right Hmm, but I think I managed reasonably

Pass here the idea of ​​the text of the subject in general Remembering that here As I said at the beginning, right? change anyone’s head people have the right and freedom to believe in what she wants believe and we have to respect that, right? whether we agree or not

It is important to always maintain respect open dialogue try to get into the mind of the another right to be able to understand what it is the person’s thoughts and bring attention that those who perhaps believe that Jesus died in no other way than a traditional way of showing the Cross

Also that it has a lot of basis, a lot of material has a lot of arguments too and that should be a way to stop to think and be respected also from the other side then this open dialogue and respectful, I think it’s healthy for everyone sides regardless of which subject

OK, here I’m asking if you have YouTube channel Do you have a channel? what is the name I have is reasoning insightful reason reasoning insightful Wonderful people and with that we We’re done, but there’s insightful reasoning bar TJ Maravilha I want to close one more programming Thank you very much caik cair eh

You three there, o fell you who are here on live say hi to me on Whatsapp my number is here in the description of the video because we are going to schedule a live I really like doing Live part two with people who are already here in the next Live as the presentation

Danis has already been done so there will be points and counterpoints I don’t want add three people to three more people unless I want it to be the same number of people who are on Denis’s side, three people on the same side same number of people on the side that is against Denis

So as not to be disloyal, right? So I want to maintain this balance also when have atheists and Christian five atheist five Christians, including us, are programming a big live, there it is, big live with the most intelligent atheists and the smarter Christians So it will be a Frieza versus Goku fight well

Thank you what did you laugh at boy what you’re laughing Look at Goku’s shirt boy just because I like Goku then oh no no honestly I like Goku thanks to Denis Thank you very much it was a It’s a pleasure to welcome you here, thank you, I fell

Thank you Marcos Lola, I really like it Marcos Lola always giving his support thank you preterist Brazil present at next Live I want you all Denis Congratulations on your presentation Many people praised you in the chat, and we We close here, thank you Brazil and

As I always say at the end of Live Praise be to God, praise be always God and wants to study Greek or delve deeper wants to understand the exegesis of true, a high-level course, a course seriously preterist Brazil what I say and other students who study with me

Let me tell you, it’s a serious course, it’s a course without dogmatism there I won’t go teach religiosity I will teach doctrine there sometimes I don’t let it have debate Sometimes I want to have a debate because I have students who are TJ I have students who are Christians but are respectful

Very beautiful people, you need to see it, right? I think I even have an old man who study with me I won’t say his name because I can’t, so people and the respect is very wonderful, okay? what happens Come study Come learn Okay then until next Live if God he wants

Cysto, God bless you all, kisses Brazil releases Vignette AND